K3 in the Media
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Hi Guys,
I thought I would post a link to our local club's 2011 Field Day effort in Burlington, NC. It was pretty neat how much they focused on the K3 (proud to say it was my personal #1289, fresh back from a week in VP9). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uMY-HtV85Y Our 11 year old PIO did a great job! 73, Doug KF4VTT KF4VTT/VP9 K3#1289 AARC K4EG ex officio |
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Was that straight key really used or was it only for the cameras?
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I'm not sure if the actual video shot was of Christopher in action on they key or staged, but he prefers the straight key and can use one. His elmer will not let him move to a paddle yet. :-)
73, Doug KF4VTT |
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Yes, the "strange" way the youngster in the video was "addressing" the key leaped out at me, too. I have a nicely-done drawing in a frame on my shack wall that was sold in QST some years ago. It depicts a 1930's station with an HRO, Atwater-Kent and a gas lamp on the wall ... and ... the operator is shown sending code with his right index finger and the key is sideways to his hand! 73! Ken - K0PP ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by KF4VTT
Hooray for the Elmer! ;o) 73, Tom Amateur Radio Operator N5GE ARRL Lifetime Member QCWA Lifetime Member On Tue, 28 Jun 2011 08:16:12 -0700 (PDT), KF4VTT <[hidden email]> wrote: >I'm not sure if the actual video shot was of Christopher in action on they >key or staged, but he prefers the straight key and *can use one*. His elmer >will not let him move to a paddle yet. :-) > >73, >Doug >KF4VTT ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Amateur Radio Operator N5GE
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In reply to this post by Ken G Kopp
We had a fellow in the radio school class I attended at Ft Knox who tapped, or should I say pounded the J38 when sending. He was sent to cook school after a week of sending tests. 73, Tom Amateur Radio Operator N5GE ARRL Lifetime Member QCWA Lifetime Member On Tue, 28 Jun 2011 10:22:02 -0600, "Ken - K0PP" <[hidden email]> wrote: > >Yes, the "strange" way the youngster in the video was >"addressing" the key leaped out at me, too. I have a >nicely-done drawing in a frame on my shack wall that >was sold in QST some years ago. It depicts a 1930's >station with an HRO, Atwater-Kent and a gas lamp on >the wall ... and ... the operator is shown sending code >with his right index finger and the key is sideways to >his hand! > >73! >Ken - K0PP ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Amateur Radio Operator N5GE
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In reply to this post by AC7AC
* On 2011 28 Jun 10:19 -0500, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:
> That's one of the best PR pieces on the hobby I've ever seen, Doug. Seconded! We're too far away from any TV stations to get any video coverage. We did have the editor from the neighboring county paper show up after he contacted me Friday morning asking about amateur radio. Seems he had found the ARRL site and was curious. He went home with a Now You're Talking manual! Afteward he tweeted, "Just watched ham radio guys in action. Cool!" We may have him hooked. At least he took some pictures and promised a PDF for our publicity bonus. I'll be sure to point him toward the Elecraft site since he is a self-professed gadget nut. 73, de Nate N0NB >> -- "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true." Ham radio, Linux, bikes, and more: http://www.n0nb.us ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by N5GE
after having operated both a straight key and a paddle,
I'm not really sure that the two are comparable I don't think being able to send using a straight key does anything to help you send better than using a paddle, but using a paddle is much easier to me than using a straight key and if you take nostalgia out of it, I would think starting with a paddle is what I would recommend to anyone just starting out. I just don't understand the fascination with straight keys, they are hard to use and tiring if you don't use them correctly anyway my .02 cents worth al ve3gam ----- Original Message ----- From: <[hidden email]> To: <[hidden email]> Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 2:01 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 in the Media > > Hooray for the Elmer! ;o) > > 73, > Tom > Amateur Radio Operator N5GE > ARRL Lifetime Member > QCWA Lifetime Member > > > On Tue, 28 Jun 2011 08:16:12 -0700 (PDT), KF4VTT <[hidden email]> wrote: > >>I'm not sure if the actual video shot was of Christopher in action on they >>key or staged, but he prefers the straight key and *can use one*. His elmer >>will not let him move to a paddle yet. :-) >> >>73, >>Doug >>KF4VTT > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by KF4VTT
Al,
The issue isn't "nostalgia" - it's technique and timing. Paddles cover a multitude of sins: as long as you're hitting the paddles somewere close to the right point you'll get nice even CW. With a straight key any technique or timing issues are immediately obvious. The "old timer" WWII radio ops that I've known (in particular my dad) always stressed mastering the straight key before ever trying to use paddles. And if you've heard those OTs on the air, a large percentage of them illustrate the wisdom of learning (and mastering) the straight key first. 73, Al On Tue June 28 2011 5:31:10 pm VE3GAM Allen McRorie wrote: > after having operated both a straight key and a paddle, > I'm not really sure that the two are comparable > > I don't think being able to send using a straight key does > anything to help you send better than using a paddle, but > using a paddle is much easier to me than using a straight key and > if you take nostalgia out of it, I would think starting with > a paddle is what I would recommend to anyone just > starting out. I just don't understand the fascination with > straight keys, they are hard to use and tiring if you don't > use them correctly > > anyway my .02 cents worth > > al ve3gam > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <[hidden email]> > To: <[hidden email]> > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 2:01 PM > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 in the Media > > > Hooray for the Elmer! ;o) > > > > 73, > > Tom > > Amateur Radio Operator N5GE > > ARRL Lifetime Member > > QCWA Lifetime Member > > > > On Tue, 28 Jun 2011 08:16:12 -0700 (PDT), KF4VTT <[hidden email]> > >>I'm not sure if the actual video shot was of Christopher in action on > >> they key or staged, but he prefers the straight key and *can use one*. > >> His elmer will not let him move to a paddle yet. :-) > >> > >>73, > >>Doug > >>KF4VTT > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by VE3GAM Allen McRorie
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In reply to this post by VE3GAM Allen McRorie
I agree. I started on paddles and used them for four years before I ever
tried a straight key. By then the rhythm of the code was built in so using the key was simple. But I could only send for ten minutes or so before noticing how hard it was. I think I could run a key for a few hours but why when I can use paddles instead? Kevin. KD5ONS On Tue, 28 Jun 2011 15:31:10 -0700, VE3GAM Allen McRorie <[hidden email]> wrote: > after having operated both a straight key and a paddle, > I'm not really sure that the two are comparable > > I don't think being able to send using a straight key does > anything to help you send better than using a paddle, but > using a paddle is much easier to me than using a straight key and > if you take nostalgia out of it, I would think starting with > a paddle is what I would recommend to anyone just > starting out. I just don't understand the fascination with > straight keys, they are hard to use and tiring if you don't > use them correctly > > anyway my .02 cents worth > > al ve3gam Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Al Gulseth-2
The hardest CW to copy (for me anyway) has insufficient spacing between letters or words.
This is exactly what a keyer does NOT help you with! The operator has to learn to recognize what good CW sounds like. Does sending with a straight key help with that? Maybe, but I doubt it. Many of you have heard old-timers with bugs sending with the "banana-boat swing" (dits way too fast for the dahs) or the "Lake Erie swing" (think about sending from a rolling ship). These are generally considered 'bad CW', but they aren't difficult to copy. The techniques of sending with an iambic paddle, a bug and a straight key are very different. I don't think learning one helps you with the others. On 6/28/2011 4:07 PM, Al Gulseth wrote: > Al, > > The issue isn't "nostalgia" - it's technique and timing. Paddles cover a > multitude of sins: as long as you're hitting the paddles somewere close to > the right point you'll get nice even CW. With a straight key any technique or > timing issues are immediately obvious. > > The "old timer" WWII radio ops that I've known (in particular my dad) always > stressed mastering the straight key before ever trying to use paddles. And if > you've heard those OTs on the air, a large percentage of them illustrate the > wisdom of learning (and mastering) the straight key first. > > 73, Al > > On Tue June 28 2011 5:31:10 pm VE3GAM Allen McRorie wrote: >> after having operated both a straight key and a paddle, >> I'm not really sure that the two are comparable >> >> I don't think being able to send using a straight key does >> anything to help you send better than using a paddle, but >> using a paddle is much easier to me than using a straight key and >> if you take nostalgia out of it, I would think starting with >> a paddle is what I would recommend to anyone just >> starting out. I just don't understand the fascination with >> straight keys, they are hard to use and tiring if you don't >> use them correctly >> >> anyway my .02 cents worth >> >> al ve3gam -- Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/ ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
Re: Straight key first? (was: Re: K3 in the Media)
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There is a product called the "CW Machine" invented by Ulrich Steinberg
N2DE/DJ8GO and marketed by Begali which has vast capabilities beyond a standard keyer. One of the things it can do is analyze one's keying and provide feedback regarding spacing, etc. It appears to be a fabulous investment for the dedicated CW OP who is serious about mastering the art. Works with paddles, straight keys, bugs, 'swipers. Price seems reasonable by today's standards. Number of reviews at eHam are sufficiently high to lend creedance to the 5/5 rating it has achieved. More info available at www.i2rtf.com for interested listers. I have never seen one, much less operated one, but I was sufficiently intrigued by its potential that I purchased one. I take delivery on Thursday afternoon. The fellow who invented it is coming over to my shack to hook it up and get me started. I operate 100% CW. Paddles are wonderful--everyone sounds the same. And everyone makes the same mistakes. Straight keys are nostalgic, perhaps, but still worthy of learning to operate properly if no reason other than that 'they exist and they are part of our heritage'. Sideswipers are the least used and least understood of the keys but nonetheless worthy of the effort required to learn for the same reasons as previously mentioned. The bug is my favorite key because it's really difficult to do it correctly. I'm still trying to improve my dit to dah transitions after 51 years. I am hopeful that the CW Machine will help me achieve my personal goal of achieving the best 'fist' I can with each of the tools of the trade. That's the nice thing about ham radio -- so very many little niches to explore. 73, Stan WB2LQF KX1 #2411 K1#2994 K2# 6980 K3#5244 K9 #1 (Cocoa the Chihuahua) Everything is QRP, even the dog. On Tue, Jun 28, 2011 at 9:06 PM, Vic K2VCO wrote: > The hardest CW to copy (for me anyway) has insufficient spacing > between letters or words. This is exactly what a keyer does NOT help > you with! The operator has to learn to recognize what good CW sounds > like. ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Vic K2VCO
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Re: Straight key first? (was: Re: K3 in the Media)
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The decoder on the K3 can be used to monitor one's sending. Getting the
word spaces correct can be checked with it. However, thinking, copying, and sending simultaneously with the slight delay inherent in the decoder is like juggling five balls at once. It can be done but it makes life more interesting :) Kevin. KD5ONS On Tue, 28 Jun 2011 19:54:25 -0700, Ron D'Eau Claire <[hidden email]> wrote: ... > > I like to practice on my bug with a computer decoder that is very, very > finicky about spacing and element lengths. CW GET is one such program > that > really hates to decode anything but keyboard sending. My goal is to make > it > decode my bug fist reliably. > ... > > Ron AC7AC ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Al Gulseth-2
On 6/28/2011 4:07 PM, Al Gulseth wrote:
> The issue isn't "nostalgia" - it's technique and timing. Paddles cover a > multitude of sins: as long as you're hitting the paddles somewere close to > the right point you'll get nice even CW. With a straight key any technique or > timing issues are immediately obvious. Hmmm ... if the object is to send good, readable Morse code, and if we live in the end of the first decade of the 21st century [or beginning of the 2nd decade depending on whether you count from zero or one], why not let the technology of the times help? I think this issue *is* "nostalgia," and maybe some of "I had to do it so you do too?" You can send without spaces with an automatic keyer, and I know a few who do, and they're hard to copy especially if I had to make record copy. But learning to send the spaces isn't any harder with a paddle than a straight key or bug. And "timing" on a straight key isn't all that good anyway, even among really OT's. > > The "old timer" WWII radio ops that I've known (in particular my dad) always > stressed mastering the straight key before ever trying to use paddles. And if > you've heard those OTs on the air, a large percentage of them illustrate the > wisdom of learning (and mastering) the straight key first. That would not be my experience. In the later 50's I was a relief op at a coastal marine station while a high school senior. A few fists afloat were good, although I wouldn't ever suggest "timing" was their high point, Google "lake erie swing" for more than you ever wanted to know. A great number were just bad, and some took a couple or three of us to pool our copy and see if we could decipher it. Meanwhile, on the ham bands, they were very good and some excellent fists. I take a little pride in that. I'd rather have new hams [preferably young, but all ages will do] on CW and making Q's. Let's not discourage them by telling them they need training wheels when they actually can ride the bike. 73, Fred K6DGW - Northern California Contest Club - CU in the 2011 Cal QSO Party 1-2 Oct 2011 - www.cqp.org ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
Re: Straight key first? (was: Re: K3 in the Media)
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In reply to this post by Vic K2VCO
On Jun 28, 2011, at 9:06 PM, Vic K2VCO wrote:
> The hardest CW to copy (for me anyway) has insufficient spacing between letters or words. > This is exactly what a keyer does NOT help you with! The operator has to learn to > recognize what good CW sounds like. Does sending with a straight key help with that? > Maybe, but I doubt it. Nah, not with that. I think sending with a straight key does help with getting a feel for how characters are structured, though. Not a bad thing, but like others here, I'd much rather have interested cw ops than insisting on straight keys all the way. On the other hand (am I an octopus?), an op who handles a straight key well is a real joy to work. Ditto for a well-handled bug. I'd love to be able to use both well myself; straight key fist is a bit rusty, not what it once was, but it's coming back, and I'm having a lot of fun with it. I expect I'm more critical of my sending than some might be of it, though. > > Many of you have heard old-timers with bugs sending with the "banana-boat swing" (dits way > too fast for the dahs) or the "Lake Erie swing" (think about sending from a rolling ship). > These are generally considered 'bad CW', but they aren't difficult to copy. Unless the spacing is off, then, well, all bets are off. I don't mind some swing, it adds character. > > The techniques of sending with an iambic paddle, a bug and a straight key are very > different. I don't think learning one helps you with the others. Completely agree. To this day, I still can't send properly with an iambic paddle and tend to use them as though they were single lever paddles. Even though I've never owned such a beast. Really, really want another bug, though. But getting back to the straight key for a second, probably the worst code I've ever heard came from a straight key. Unfortunately, my friend Dave, N5RUL, had to suffer through that as his first cw contact. Were I not there to back him up on copy, and I really struggled with that myself, he'd have been completely lost and probably discouraged. The guy's dits and dahs were almost nearly the same length! Strange but true. In that case, I don't think a straight key helped him much. -- Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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I'm too new to this to know much, but it seems to me that one might best
learn to send Morse well by copying a lot of well sent Morse. I only say this because I listened to computer generated Morse for months before I got on the air. When I finally did send, I got compliments right away on my fist. All I was doing, though, is sending the same rhythm I'd been hearing for months. If this was already said, then I apologize for the redundant repetition :) 73, Wayne Conrad KF7QGA ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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