K3 - operation with the KPA500 and KAT500

[Bill-3]

Am I correct that the K3, KAT500, and KPA500 operates seemlessly when
operating SSB and you QSY? Specifically, is any operator intervention
(button pushing or tuning) need for QSY from the upper part of the band
to the lower part of the band (ie: 3975 QSK to 3655). Can I just pick
the mic and talk? Or, is some manual action required for the change?

Thanks,

Bill W2BLC

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[Ian Kahn, KM4IK]

You do have to manually retune the transceiver.  However, if you have all
the Elecraft cabling in place according to Elecraft's instructions, the
KAT500 and KPA500 should follow you.  If you're QSYing in the same band, you
shouldn't have issues, anyway.  There woudn't be anything to change on the
tuner or amp.  You may get a short retune cycle if necessary, to match the
antenna to the different band segment, but that should be it.

Hope this helps.

73,

-- Ian
Ian Kahn, KM4IK
Roswell, GA  EM74ua
[hidden email]
K3 #281, P3 #688, KPA500 #1468
HRD v5.x/6.0 Test Team

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Bill W2BLC
Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2013 6:21 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 - operation with the KPA500 and KAT500

Am I correct that the K3, KAT500, and KPA500 operates seemlessly when
operating SSB and you QSY? Specifically, is any operator intervention
(button pushing or tuning) need for QSY from the upper part of the band to
the lower part of the band (ie: 3975 QSK to 3655). Can I just pick the mic
and talk? Or, is some manual action required for the change?

Thanks,

Bill W2BLC

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[Gary Gregory-2]

Ian,

When you set up the kat500, do a couple 'tune' cycles across each of the
bands prior to operating and then you will find no unexpected tune cycles.
Setting the kat500 swr bypass is helpful also.

Running my OCF (80/20) I get no unexpected retunes which makes operating
and qsy etc very easy on all bands including the WARC bands.

73


On 24 September 2013 22:23, Ian Kahn - Ham <[hidden email]> wrote:

> You do have to manually retune the transceiver.  However, if you have all
> the Elecraft cabling in place according to Elecraft's instructions, the
> KAT500 and KPA500 should follow you.  If you're QSYing in the same band,
> you
> shouldn't have issues, anyway.  There woudn't be anything to change on the
> tuner or amp.  You may get a short retune cycle if necessary, to match the
> antenna to the different band segment, but that should be it.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> 73,
>
> -- Ian
> Ian Kahn, KM4IK
> Roswell, GA  EM74ua
> [hidden email]
> K3 #281, P3 #688, KPA500 #1468
> HRD v5.x/6.0 Test Team
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Bill W2BLC
> Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2013 6:21 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 - operation with the KPA500 and KAT500
>
> Am I correct that the K3, KAT500, and KPA500 operates seemlessly when
> operating SSB and you QSY? Specifically, is any operator intervention
> (button pushing or tuning) need for QSY from the upper part of the band to
> the lower part of the band (ie: 3975 QSK to 3655). Can I just pick the mic
> and talk? Or, is some manual action required for the change?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bill W2BLC
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
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>
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--
*Gary - VK1ZZ
Skype: Gary.VK1ZZ
http://www.qsl.net/vk1zz
Motorhome Portable*
*"Grumpy's House"*
*Elecraft K3
KPA500FT
KAT500FT**

*
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[Iain MacDonnell - N6ML-2]

On Tue, Sep 24, 2013 at 3:20 AM, Bill W2BLC <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Am I correct that the K3, KAT500, and KPA500 operates seemlessly when
> operating SSB and you QSY? Specifically, is any operator intervention
> (button pushing or tuning) need for QSY from the upper part of the band to
> the lower part of the band (ie: 3975 QSK to 3655). Can I just pick the mic
> and talk? Or, is some manual action required for the change?

With firmware 1.20 or newer, the KAT500 will (unless you configure it
not to) automatically perform "memory recall tunes" as you move around
within a band - i.e. when it detects a frequency change, it will
recall the memory closest to the new frequency.

In AUTO mode, it will also initiate full tuning if necessary, based on
VSWR measured above the configured threshold. In MAN mode, it will not
initiate tuning based on VSWR. This is explained in mode detail in the
KAT500 Utility help.

Full tuning will require a key-down signal - SSB won't do it - so, as
Gary suggests, "teaching" it about various segments within each band
(especially 80m) will help with smooth operation as you QSY around.

73,

    ~iain / N6ML
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[Bill-3]

The reason I asked the original question is my experience with the
KPA500 and KAT500:

KPA500 in the OPER mode.
KAT500 in AUTO (solid on).
K3 set to 25 Watts when running with the amp.
Everything has been well checked over for errors in installation and setup.

When I QSY between 3970 from 3755 and start talking on LSB - the KPA500
and the KAT500 both go wild. The tuner does not appear to remember that
both frequencies have been "memorized" or is very slow (several seconds)
to make the determination. The tuner will click (relay noise) and the
amp will show RED FAULT (REFL HI) and go to STBY.

Using the above frequencies, when I press the XMIT/TUNE button I get an
immediate RED FAULT (REFL HI) however, the unit does not go into STDY.
If the XMIT is kept on, the RED FAULT will switch off after about 3 or 4
seconds and normal amp output power is noted. I can then talk and all is
fine.

If this is how the combo is supposed to act, so be it - however, it
isn't what I expected. When I purchased the KAT500 and KPA 500, I was
under the impression it would follow me around the bands seamlessly,
with only the VFO touched for QSY

The amp and tuner were factory built - so no chance of errors there.
What am I missing? Or, is this how it is designed and is actually
working "properly?"

Thanks,

Bill W2BLC
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[Cady, Fred]

One other quick note: You do have to transmit for the KAT to do a quick memory recall tune. It won't track receiver tuning.
Cheers,
Fred KE7X


-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of iain macdonnell - N6ML
Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2013 7:27 AM
To: Bill W2BLC
Cc: Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 - operation with the KPA500 and KAT500

On Tue, Sep 24, 2013 at 3:20 AM, Bill W2BLC <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Am I correct that the K3, KAT500, and KPA500 operates seemlessly when
> operating SSB and you QSY? Specifically, is any operator intervention
> (button pushing or tuning) need for QSY from the upper part of the
> band to the lower part of the band (ie: 3975 QSK to 3655). Can I just
> pick the mic and talk? Or, is some manual action required for the change?

With firmware 1.20 or newer, the KAT500 will (unless you configure it not to) automatically perform "memory recall tunes" as you move around within a band - i.e. when it detects a frequency change, it will recall the memory closest to the new frequency.

In AUTO mode, it will also initiate full tuning if necessary, based on VSWR measured above the configured threshold. In MAN mode, it will not initiate tuning based on VSWR. This is explained in mode detail in the
KAT500 Utility help.

Full tuning will require a key-down signal - SSB won't do it - so, as Gary suggests, "teaching" it about various segments within each band (especially 80m) will help with smooth operation as you QSY around.

73,

    ~iain / N6ML
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[Iain MacDonnell - N6ML-2]

Bill,

What firmware versions do you have on the KAT500 and KPA500? Both have
had fixes implemented to make this sort of operation more smooth.

Also confirm that you have the AUX (HD15) cabling in place between the
K3-KAT500-KPA500 (and no direct RCA keying line between the K3 and
KPA500) ?

73,

    ~iain / N6ML



On Tue, Sep 24, 2013 at 7:11 AM, Bill W2BLC <[hidden email]> wrote:

> The reason I asked the original question is my experience with the KPA500
> and KAT500:
>
> KPA500 in the OPER mode.
> KAT500 in AUTO (solid on).
> K3 set to 25 Watts when running with the amp.
> Everything has been well checked over for errors in installation and setup.
>
> When I QSY between 3970 from 3755 and start talking on LSB - the KPA500 and
> the KAT500 both go wild. The tuner does not appear to remember that both
> frequencies have been "memorized" or is very slow (several seconds) to make
> the determination. The tuner will click (relay noise) and the amp will show
> RED FAULT (REFL HI) and go to STBY.
>
> Using the above frequencies, when I press the XMIT/TUNE button I get an
> immediate RED FAULT (REFL HI) however, the unit does not go into STDY. If
> the XMIT is kept on, the RED FAULT will switch off after about 3 or 4
> seconds and normal amp output power is noted. I can then talk and all is
> fine.
>
> If this is how the combo is supposed to act, so be it - however, it isn't
> what I expected. When I purchased the KAT500 and KPA 500, I was under the
> impression it would follow me around the bands seamlessly, with only the VFO
> touched for QSY
>
> The amp and tuner were factory built - so no chance of errors there. What am
> I missing? Or, is this how it is designed and is actually working
> "properly?"
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bill W2BLC
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

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[George Danner]

Bill,
Mine acts the same - until it transmits RF once!
That first transmit can (will) fault both the KPA500 & KAT500.
I hadn't noticed that before because my 80m antenna is the only one with a
significance difference in VSWR between the bottom & top of the band & I'm
not on 80m very often but do operate at the bottom or top if I'm on 3.060
MHz & 3.975 MHz.
Thanks
73
George
AI4VZ

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill W2BLC
Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2013 10:11 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 - operation with the KPA500 and KAT500

The reason I asked the original question is my experience with the
KPA500 and KAT500:

KPA500 in the OPER mode.
KAT500 in AUTO (solid on).
K3 set to 25 Watts when running with the amp.
Everything has been well checked over for errors in installation and setup.

When I QSY between 3970 from 3755 and start talking on LSB - the KPA500
and the KAT500 both go wild. The tuner does not appear to remember that
both frequencies have been "memorized" or is very slow (several seconds)
to make the determination. The tuner will click (relay noise) and the
amp will show RED FAULT (REFL HI) and go to STBY.

Using the above frequencies, when I press the XMIT/TUNE button I get an
immediate RED FAULT (REFL HI) however, the unit does not go into STDY.
If the XMIT is kept on, the RED FAULT will switch off after about 3 or 4
seconds and normal amp output power is noted. I can then talk and all is
fine.

If this is how the combo is supposed to act, so be it - however, it
isn't what I expected. When I purchased the KAT500 and KPA 500, I was
under the impression it would follow me around the bands seamlessly,
with only the VFO touched for QSY

The amp and tuner were factory built - so no chance of errors there.
What am I missing? Or, is this how it is designed and is actually
working "properly?"

Thanks,

Bill W2BLC
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[Bill-3]

Latest updates have been made and factory cables are being used.


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[Bill-3]

That is what I was looking for - I am not alone and perhaps it is just
how things work on the combo.

If that is how things are, that is fine - still beats using a manual
tuner and old tube amp!

Bill W2BLC
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[N5GE]

Bill,

I'm a CW operator, but I believe you could try the method I use to
activate the tuner and amp before working phone on MARS frequencies.

After you have tuned the tuner on your favorite frequencies (phone
and/or CW), perform the actions below when you QSY.

1. Set the K3 to transmit CW in SSB mode.
2. Connect a cw key to the K3.
3. After you have moved to the new band, tap the CW key one time and
the tuner and amp will be ready to transmit SSB.

Tom N5GE

On Tue, 24 Sep 2013 10:45:13 -0400, you wrote:

>That is what I was looking for - I am not alone and perhaps it is just
>how things work on the combo.
>
>If that is how things are, that is fine - still beats using a manual
>tuner and old tube amp!
>
>Bill W2BLC
>______________________________________________________________
>Elecraft mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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[Gary Gregory-2]

Tom,

Your suggestion works well, however, when the kat500 is 'programmed' a qsy
in band or to another band does not require a Tx on CW. The kat500 will
interrupt the key line on the kpa500 and the memorized 'bin' appropriate
for the new frequency/band is selected automatically.

It took a few iteratiions of FW to get this done and it works as designed
now.

73


On 25 September 2013 01:04, Tom <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Bill,
>
> I'm a CW operator, but I believe you could try the method I use to
> activate the tuner and amp before working phone on MARS frequencies.
>
> After you have tuned the tuner on your favorite frequencies (phone
> and/or CW), perform the actions below when you QSY.
>
> 1. Set the K3 to transmit CW in SSB mode.
> 2. Connect a cw key to the K3.
> 3. After you have moved to the new band, tap the CW key one time and
> the tuner and amp will be ready to transmit SSB.
>
> Tom N5GE
>
> On Tue, 24 Sep 2013 10:45:13 -0400, you wrote:
>
> >That is what I was looking for - I am not alone and perhaps it is just
> >how things work on the combo.
> >
> >If that is how things are, that is fine - still beats using a manual
> >tuner and old tube amp!
> >
> >Bill W2BLC
> >______________________________________________________________
> >Elecraft mailing list
> >Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> >Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> >Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> >This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> >Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

--
*Gary - VK1ZZ
Skype: Gary.VK1ZZ
http://www.qsl.net/vk1zz
Motorhome Portable*
*"Grumpy's House"*
*Elecraft K3
KPA500FT
KAT500FT**

*
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[Iain MacDonnell - N6ML-2]

I think you should be able to get better results. If you're repeatedly
QSYing to a particular band segment, and experiencing full tunes and
KPA500 faults, something is not right. You might try contacting
support - there is detailed diagnostic tracing that can be engaged for
situations like this, if you can reproduce the problem....

73,

    ~iain / N6ML



On Tue, Sep 24, 2013 at 7:45 AM, Bill W2BLC <[hidden email]> wrote:

> That is what I was looking for - I am not alone and perhaps it is just how
> things work on the combo.
>
> If that is how things are, that is fine - still beats using a manual tuner
> and old tube amp!
>
>
> Bill W2BLC
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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[Phil Salas]

I just press TUNE on the K3 when I QSY before operating.  This puts out a lower-powered carrier and the KAT500 selects the right tuning combination.
Phil – AD5X
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[N5GE]

All,

The setting of CW on SSB here is not set to help with tuner and amp
operation, (although a tap is faster than a hold) ;o).  I've  set it
that way because when I work 6m, 2m and 70cm phone, it's advantageous
to be able to send CW when propagation fades.

Some may disagree, but in my opinion, (and I could be wrong) CW is
still the most reliable form of communication during poor conditions,
due to it's narrow band width and narrow filtering possibilities.

Tom

On Wed, 25 Sep 2013 01:11:18 +1000, you wrote:

>Tom,
>
>Your suggestion works well, however, when the kat500 is 'programmed' a qsy
>in band or to another band does not require a Tx on CW. The kat500 will
>interrupt the key line on the kpa500 and the memorized 'bin' appropriate
>for the new frequency/band is selected automatically.
>
>It took a few iteratiions of FW to get this done and it works as designed
>now.
>
>73
>

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[Mike K2MK]

Hi Bill,

Help us by stating your firmware rev levels. "Latest Updates" might not include Beta releases for some folks.

73,
Mike K2MK

Bill W2BLC wrote

Latest updates have been made and factory cables are being used.

[John E. Reiser]

Bill, W2BLC,

What is the VSWR of your antenna at 3.965?  Is the KAT500 stable with 100
watts?  That would be a big clue to what is going on.  Any tuner's
power-handling capability decreases as VSWR rises.

73,

John, W2GW


----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill W2BLC" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2013 10:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 - operation with the KPA500 and KAT500

> The reason I asked the original question is my experience with the KPA500
> and KAT500:
>
> KPA500 in the OPER mode.
> KAT500 in AUTO (solid on).
> K3 set to 25 Watts when running with the amp.
> Everything has been well checked over for errors in installation and
> setup.
>
> When I QSY between 3970 from 3755 and start talking on LSB - the KPA500
> and the KAT500 both go wild. The tuner does not appear to remember that
> both frequencies have been "memorized" or is very slow (several seconds)
> to make the determination. The tuner will click (relay noise) and the amp
> will show RED FAULT (REFL HI) and go to STBY.
>
> Using the above frequencies, when I press the XMIT/TUNE button I get an
> immediate RED FAULT (REFL HI) however, the unit does not go into STDY. If
> the XMIT is kept on, the RED FAULT will switch off after about 3 or 4
> seconds and normal amp output power is noted. I can then talk and all is
> fine.
>
> If this is how the combo is supposed to act, so be it - however, it isn't
> what I expected. When I purchased the KAT500 and KPA 500, I was under the
> impression it would follow me around the bands seamlessly, with only the
> VFO touched for QSY
>
> The amp and tuner were factory built - so no chance of errors there. What
> am I missing? Or, is this how it is designed and is actually working
> "properly?"
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bill W2BLC
> ______________________________________________________________
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[k6dgw]

Once I "trained" my KAT500 at the middle of each of its segments for
each band and for each antenna usable on that band, I run it in MAN
mode.  My understanding is that in MAN, it will fetch the appropriate
values when it first smells RF [or is told on the port to the radio],
but it won't automatically enter a tune cycle.  In AUTO, it fetchs the
values from memory and set the relays [almost instantly], but if the
VSWR is above a threshold, it will enter a tune cycle automatically.
This usually isn't so good, especially on SSB.

No matter how I QSY or how far [Big Knob or band change], it never does
an unwanted tune cycle.  It selects the preferred antenna for the band
and I transmit.  You do have to TX to get it to fetch the right values,
I'm certain that it doesn't follow your receive frequency.

My antennas behave a bit differently when it's raining so I saved two
configurations using the KAT500 Utility.  The checklist then is:

1.  Go into shack
2.  Look out window
3.  If it's raining and wasn't last time I was QRV, load Wet Config
4.  If it's dry but was raining last time I was QRV, load Dry Config
5.  If it's the same as last time I was QRV, call CQ DX :-)

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2013 Cal QSO Party 5-6 Oct 2013
- www.cqp.org

On 9/24/2013 2:46 PM, John E. Reiser wrote:
> Bill, W2BLC,
>
> What is the VSWR of your antenna at 3.965?  Is the KAT500 stable with
> 100 watts?  That would be a big clue to what is going on.

W2BLC wrote"
>> KPA500 in the OPER mode.
>> KAT500 in AUTO (solid on).
>> K3 set to 25 Watts when running with the amp.


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