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K3 or SDR-5000?

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Ross Stenberg

K3 or SDR-5000?

I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they like bacon, but
what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs, bandscope,
computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?

73 and Merry Christmas

Ross Stenberg
K9COX

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Thom LaCosta

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

On Sat, 22 Dec 2007, Ross Stenberg wrote:

> I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they like bacon, but
> what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs, bandscope,
> computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?

I have not seen (m)any references to SDR-5000 mojo.

73 - k3hrn
Thom,EIEIO
Email, Internet, Electronic Information Officer

www.baltimorehon.com/ Home of the Baltimore Lexicon
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W4sc

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

In reply to this post by Ross Stenberg

Well Ross, if the pack of dogs were starving liberal vegitarians, they
would probably complain about the bacon,,,,

>From all that has been said, published, espoused, ect.. this is my take:

1) For portability - K3 Wins - No contest.
2) Price - Features: Depends more on what you desire in the radio and want
to use it for.
3) Price - Performance: From specs and test so far; it looks like a
toss-up?? Maybe K3 edge.
4) Price - Overall K3 has the win, especially since the second, optional RX
is truely independent
5) I like a "real" front panel, with knobs you can turn and tweek.

To implement a band scope, I would use a RFSpace SDR-IQ (or SDR-14)
attached to the K3 IF out.

I have had an assembled K3 on order since last April (or was it May??). No
other radio is/was under consideration. I will be using this first one (10
watt) as a UHF/uWave transverter IF. I am ordering a second one (100 watt)
with the "full monty" for HF when my piggy bank gets to the proper level
again (almost there!!).

Ben W4SC

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 1:11 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?

>I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they like bacon, but
> what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs, bandscope,
> computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?
>
> 73 and Merry Christmas
>
> Ross Stenberg
> K9COX
>
> _______________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Post to: [hidden email]
> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
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>
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k7svv

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

In reply to this post by Ross Stenberg

Ross,
Did you ask the same question on the Flex forum?

John [K7SVV]

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 11:11 AM
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?

Joe Subich, W4TV

RE: K3 or SDR-5000?

In reply to this post by Ross Stenberg

> what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs,
> bandscope, computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?

The design philosophy of the two radios is completely different.

The Flex-5000 front end is "broad as a barn door" - it applies all
the energy in an entire amateur band and adjacent frequencies
directly to the DSP analog to digital converter. This does two
things. First the ADC is required to have a much greater dynamic
range in order to deal with a 10 to 20 dB larger but very low
probability instantaneous peak voltage (very high peak to average
ratio). Second it requires the DSP software to sort out all the
signals in roughly a 200 kHz "window." This results in increased
processing time and more delay.

The front end of the K3 has a narrow "roofing" filter very close
to the first mixer which limits the bandwidth applied to the DSP
ADC. This provides two advantages. The peak to average ratio
of the signal applied to the ADC is not a high so the dynamic
range of the ADC can be better used (better optimized to conditions)
which theoretically provides better dynamic range (either better
sensitivity or more resistance to IMD). Secondly, by dealing with
a more narrow spectrum, the DSP can be made faster for equivalent
resolution (selectivity) or the available processing power/time
can be used for improved performance like, noise reduction/signal
correlation, context and focus filtering, spatial processing, etc.

The Flex philosophy has an advantage in that it can implement
in-band dual receive with a single set of receiver hardware. Its
DSP can demodulate any signal within the 196 KHz "window" and
provide one signal on each audio channel. With a multi-channel
audio card or multiple audio cads and enough computing power,
the Flex can be extended to "n-channel receive" without additional
hardware. The K3 design is limited to a single signal per DSP
channel.

Both design philosophies have their place. The K3 is like a high
performance sports car - it does one thing and does it better than
any other product. The Flex-5000 is like a fully loaded luxury
SUV - it has every option imaginable but it lacks precision,
handling and speed.

Your choice depends on whether you want frills or performance.

73,

... Joe, W4TV

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Ross Stenberg
> Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 1:12 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?
>
>
> I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they
> like bacon, but
> what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs,
> bandscope,
> computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?
>
> 73 and Merry Christmas
>
> Ross Stenberg
> K9COX
>
> _______________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Post to: [hidden email]
> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
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>
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>
>

Brendan Minish

RE: K3 or SDR-5000?

On Sat, 2007-12-22 at 14:17 -0500, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:

> Both design philosophies have their place. The K3 is like a high
> performance sports car - it does one thing and does it better than
> any other product. The Flex-5000 is like a fully loaded luxury
> SUV - it has every option imaginable but it lacks precision,
> handling and speed.

You could of course hang an SDR on the IF out of the K3, then you get
the best of both worlds ;-)

My SDR-14 works great with the K3

73
Brendan
EI6IZ

--
Don‘t complain. Nobody will understand. Or care. And certainly don‘t try
to fix the situation yourself. It‘s dangerous. Leave it to a highly
untrained, unqualified, expendable professional.

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Dave Larson-2

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

In reply to this post by Ross Stenberg

Hi Ross,

I own a SDR-1000 for just over a year now. Last May I sold my K2 and
ordered a yet to be delivered K3. Until the various tests have been
published by the ARRL and Mr. Sherwood, I would say the K3 vs. SDR-5000 are
a close match. The K3 will cost less than the SDR-5000 when you add the cost
of the required high powered computer to the cost of the SDR-5000. The K3
needs no computer to operate. The SDR-1000/5000 have a panadapter display
with the ability to tune in any signal with just a click of a mouse. No big
deal unless you become used to it as I have. When software becomes
available to mouse click tune the K3 with some sort of panadapter display,
My SDR-1000 will be up for sale and a second K3 will be ordered. Until
then, I will keep it along with my yet to be delivered K3 and will use which
ever rig is the right one for a given situation.

Dave, K8AA

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 1:11 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?

W4sc

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

It is here now I believe, in the latest version of SpectraVue s/w
supporting the SDR-14 or SDR-IQ and a K3.

http://www.rfspace.com/Home.html

Ben W4SC

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Larson" <[hidden email]>
To: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 3:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?

> Hi Ross,
>
> I own a SDR-1000 for just over a year now. Last May I sold my K2 and
> ordered a yet to be delivered K3. Until the various tests have been
> published by the ARRL and Mr. Sherwood, I would say the K3 vs. SDR-5000
> are a close match. The K3 will cost less than the SDR-5000 when you add
> the cost of the required high powered computer to the cost of the
> SDR-5000. The K3 needs no computer to operate. The SDR-1000/5000 have a
> panadapter display with the ability to tune in any signal with just a
> click of a mouse. No big deal unless you become used to it as I have.
> When software becomes available to mouse click tune the K3 with some sort
> of panadapter display, My SDR-1000 will be up for sale and a second K3
> will be ordered. Until then, I will keep it along with my yet to be
> delivered K3 and will use which ever rig is the right one for a given
> situation.
>
> Dave, K8AA
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 1:11 PM
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?
>
>
>>I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they like bacon, but
>> what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs, bandscope,
>> computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?
>>
>> 73 and Merry Christmas
>>
>> Ross Stenberg
>> K9COX
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Post to: [hidden email]
>> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
>> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
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>>
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
>> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>>
>>
>> --
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.6/1192 - Release Date:
>> 12/21/2007 1:17 PM
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
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Jerry Flanders

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

In reply to this post by Ross Stenberg

It seems to me that neither fully meets its advertised claims at the
present time. Many things depend on software that is not as fully
functional when you get the radio as it would be on a more
conventional radio like the 756PRO3.

We all expect the software will be completed someday, but disaster
could strike and owners of either radio _could_ have incomplete or
buggy radios forever. I worry less about the K3 than the Flex-5000.

Jerry W4UK

At 01:11 PM 12/22/2007, Ross Stenberg wrote:
>I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they like bacon, but
>what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs, bandscope,
>computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?
>
>73 and Merry Christmas
>
>Ross Stenberg
>K9COX

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Lee J. Imber (WW2DX)

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

In reply to this post by W4sc

If you are looking for a cheaper solution ($12 softrock) K3 IF and
Scott's (WU2X) Modified PowerSDR software you have a 160-6m fully
functional panadapter that tracks the rigs VFO :)

Http://www.wu2x.com/sdr.html

Youtube movie demo in the works.

73

Lee WW2DX

On Dec 22, 2007, at 3:13 PM, "W4sc" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> It is here now I believe, in the latest version of SpectraVue s/w
> supporting the SDR-14 or SDR-IQ and a K3.
>
> http://www.rfspace.com/Home.html
>
> Ben W4SC
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Larson" <[hidden email]>
> To: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 3:05 PM
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?
>
>
>> Hi Ross,
>>
>> I own a SDR-1000 for just over a year now. Last May I sold my K2
>> and ordered a yet to be delivered K3. Until the various tests have
>> been published by the ARRL and Mr. Sherwood, I would say the K3 vs.
>> SDR-5000 are a close match. The K3 will cost less than the SDR-5000
>> when you add the cost of the required high powered computer to the
>> cost of the SDR-5000. The K3 needs no computer to operate. The SDR-1000/5000
>> have a panadapter display with the ability to tune in any signal
>> with just a click of a mouse. No big deal unless you become used
>> to it as I have. When software becomes available to mouse click
>> tune the K3 with some sort of panadapter display, My SDR-1000 will
>> be up for sale and a second K3 will be ordered. Until then, I will
>> keep it along with my yet to be delivered K3 and will use which
>> ever rig is the right one for a given situation.
>>
>> Dave, K8AA
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ross Stenberg"
>> <[hidden email]>
>> To: <[hidden email]>
>> Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 1:11 PM
>> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?
>>
>>
>>> I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they like
>>> bacon, but
>>> what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs,
>>> bandscope,
>>> computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?
>>>
>>> 73 and Merry Christmas
>>>
>>> Ross Stenberg
>>> K9COX
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Post to: [hidden email]
>>> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
>>> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
>>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>>
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
>>> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>>> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.6/1192 - Release Date:
>>> 12/21/2007 1:17 PM
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Post to: [hidden email]
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>> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>
> _______________________________________________
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dave.wilburn

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

Anyone have pictures of a panadapter / softrock setup with a K3?
-

David Wilburn
[hidden email]
K4DGW
K2 S/N 5982

On Sat, 2007-12-22 at 16:51 -0500, Lee (WW2DX) wrote:

> If you are looking for a cheaper solution ($12 softrock) K3 IF and
> Scott's (WU2X) Modified PowerSDR software you have a 160-6m fully
> functional panadapter that tracks the rigs VFO :)
>
> Http://www.wu2x.com/sdr.html
>
> Youtube movie demo in the works.
>
> 73
>
> Lee WW2DX
>
> On Dec 22, 2007, at 3:13 PM, "W4sc" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > It is here now I believe, in the latest version of SpectraVue s/w
> > supporting the SDR-14 or SDR-IQ and a K3.
> >
> > http://www.rfspace.com/Home.html
> >
> > Ben W4SC
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Larson" <[hidden email]>
> > To: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
> > Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 3:05 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?
> >
> >
> >> Hi Ross,
> >>
> >> I own a SDR-1000 for just over a year now. Last May I sold my K2
> >> and ordered a yet to be delivered K3. Until the various tests have
> >> been published by the ARRL and Mr. Sherwood, I would say the K3 vs.
> >> SDR-5000 are a close match. The K3 will cost less than the SDR-5000
> >> when you add the cost of the required high powered computer to the
> >> cost of the SDR-5000. The K3 needs no computer to operate. The SDR-1000/5000
> >> have a panadapter display with the ability to tune in any signal
> >> with just a click of a mouse. No big deal unless you become used
> >> to it as I have. When software becomes available to mouse click
> >> tune the K3 with some sort of panadapter display, My SDR-1000 will
> >> be up for sale and a second K3 will be ordered. Until then, I will
> >> keep it along with my yet to be delivered K3 and will use which
> >> ever rig is the right one for a given situation.
> >>
> >> Dave, K8AA
> >>
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ross Stenberg"
> >> <[hidden email]>
> >> To: <[hidden email]>
> >> Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 1:11 PM
> >> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?
> >>
> >>
> >>> I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they like
> >>> bacon, but
> >>> what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs,
> >>> bandscope,
> >>> computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?
> >>>
> >>> 73 and Merry Christmas
> >>>
> >>> Ross Stenberg
> >>> K9COX
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Elecraft mailing list
> >>> Post to: [hidden email]
> >>> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
> >>> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
> >>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> >>>
> >>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
> >>> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> No virus found in this incoming message.
> >>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> >>> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.6/1192 - Release Date:
> >>> 12/21/2007 1:17 PM
> >>>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Elecraft mailing list
> >> Post to: [hidden email]
> >> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
> >> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
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> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
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Barry N1EU

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

In reply to this post by Lee J. Imber (WW2DX)

It would be very cool if some future generation of PowerSDR software provided a clickable bandmap overlay to the displayed spectrum from the K3. Functions such as quick qsy to any point in the spectrum and labeling of sigs with callsigns would be great tools for dxing/contesting.

73,
Barry N1EU

<quote author="Lee (WW2DX)">
If you are looking for a cheaper solution ($12 softrock) K3 IF and
Scott's (WU2X) Modified PowerSDR software you have a 160-6m fully
functional panadapter that tracks the rigs VFO :)

Http://www.wu2x.com/sdr.html

Ross Stenberg

RE: K3 or SDR-5000?

In reply to this post by k7svv

Thanks for all of the interesting feedback. I would ask the same question on
the Flex forum, but I fear that would be like asking about operating system
preferences on a Mac or Linux reflector:^)

Happy Holidays to all, Ross K9COX

-----Original Message-----
From: John [K7SVV] [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 1:17 PM
To: Ross Stenberg; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?

Ross,
Did you ask the same question on the Flex forum?

John [K7SVV]

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 11:11 AM
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?

>I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they like bacon, but
> what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs, bandscope,
> computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?
>
> 73 and Merry Christmas
>
> Ross Stenberg
> K9COX

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Richard Smith-23

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

Ross, that's not fair. Go ask your question.

Rich W1EZ

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>
To: "'John [K7SVV]'" <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2007 9:41 AM
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?

> Thanks for all of the interesting feedback. I would ask the same question
> on
> the Flex forum, but I fear that would be like asking about operating
> system
> preferences on a Mac or Linux reflector:^)
>
> Happy Holidays to all, Ross K9COX
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John [K7SVV] [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 1:17 PM
> To: Ross Stenberg; [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?
>
> Ross,
> Did you ask the same question on the Flex forum?
>
> John [K7SVV]
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 11:11 AM
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?
>
>
>>I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they like bacon, but
>> what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs, bandscope,
>> computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?
>>
>> 73 and Merry Christmas
>>
>> Ross Stenberg
>> K9COX
>
> _______________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Post to: [hidden email]
> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
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Frank Hunter

Re: K3 or SDR-5000?

In reply to this post by Ross Stenberg

Ross Stenberg wrote:
> Thanks for all of the interesting feedback. I would ask the same question on
> the Flex forum, but I fear that would be like asking about operating system
> preferences on a Mac or Linux reflector:^)

Which IMHO is exactly what you got here.

73, Frank GI4NKB

--

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dave.wilburn

RE: K3 or SDR-5000?

In reply to this post by Ross Stenberg

Well, Mac and Linux are supiour to windows, so what's the problem. Pick
either one and you win! ;^)
-

David Wilburn
[hidden email]
K4DGW
K2 S/N 5982

On Sun, 2007-12-23 at 08:41 -0600, Ross Stenberg wrote:

> Thanks for all of the interesting feedback. I would ask the same question on
> the Flex forum, but I fear that would be like asking about operating system
> preferences on a Mac or Linux reflector:^)
>
> Happy Holidays to all, Ross K9COX
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John [K7SVV] [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 1:17 PM
> To: Ross Stenberg; [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?
>
> Ross,
> Did you ask the same question on the Flex forum?
>
> John [K7SVV]
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ross Stenberg" <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Saturday, December 22, 2007 11:11 AM
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 or SDR-5000?
>
>
> >I realize that this is like asking a pack of dogs if they like bacon, but
> > what do you think other than the obvious differences (knobs, bandscope,
> > computer, $$, etc.) K3 or SDR-5000?
> >
> > 73 and Merry Christmas
> >
> > Ross Stenberg
> > K9COX
>
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