K3 vs KX3
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I'm a dinosaur that is teachable.
I have a K3 and on the reflector I am seeing sooo many posts about the KX3: It is smaller, has a small bit of Rx tech that is the most miniscule amount above the stats on the K3 and appears to be small enough that all but the .01% of the aurally gifted could detect. There is far more that the K3 offers than the KX3; to buy the KX3 add-ons to give you 100 watts and the external tuner to handle that smoothly, you have a chain of equipment that is all in one box in the K3 and for pretty much the same price. So why the love fest with the KX3 and so little heard now about the K3 on the reflector? Dinosaur ears albeit tiny, are dying to know. Gary KA1J --- This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active. http://www.avast.com ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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On 1/21/2014 3:00 PM, Gary Smith wrote:
> So why the love fest with the KX3 and so little heard now about the > K3 on the reflector? The K3 is approaching maturity as a product, just as the K2 did. S/N's are now in the high thousands, we'll probably see occasional FW releases, but it is a very stable product. The KX3 [+accessories] is the new kid on the block, and thus gets most of the attention. Elecraft will hopefully announce a new, different product [K<mumble>], at which point, you will be asking, "Why the love fest with the K<mumble> and so little heard now about the KX3." 73, Fred K6DGW - Northern California Contest Club - CU in the 2014 Cal QSO Party 4-5 Oct 2014 - www.cqp.org ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Gary Smith-2
Hi Gary,
This Reflector follows the new rigs Wayne, Eric, and Company provide. As they mature the volume of email drops for each device. Little is heard of the K2, the K1, the KX1, and all the mini module kits because they have matured to the point where little about them changes. However, your words "I'm a dinosaur" reminds me of King Crimson's tune of the same name. It was meant to be a funny take on "I am a Walrus" (the walrus was Paul) even though the Walrus was obviously the partner of the Carpenter (poor oysters :( ). You can find the tune here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7c-VYR9p4K0 Good luck on your continuing Elecraft education. Kevin. KD5ONS > I'm a dinosaur that is teachable. > > I have a K3 and on the reflector I am seeing sooo many posts about > the KX3: It is smaller, has a small bit of Rx tech that is the most > miniscule amount above the stats on the K3 and appears to be small > enough that all but the .01% of the aurally gifted could detect. > > There is far more that the K3 offers than the KX3; to buy the KX3 > add-ons to give you 100 watts and the external tuner to handle that > smoothly, you have a chain of equipment that is all in one box in the > K3 and for pretty much the same price. > > So why the love fest with the KX3 and so little heard now about the > K3 on the reflector? > > Dinosaur ears albeit tiny, are dying to know. > > Gary > KA1J > > --- > This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus > protection is active. > http://www.avast.com > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Gary Smith-2
On 1/21/2014 3:00 PM, Gary Smith wrote:
> So why the love fest with the KX3 and so little heard now about the > K3 on the reflector? I don't yet own one (have been waiting for the 100W amp), but I think that the KX3 is one of the slickest radios around. Why? Because for $1,000 you have a state of the art QRP rig with an RX as good as anything else on the market. For another $1,000 you have a 100W radio that is VERY VERY good, and is equally at home as a mobile rig and in a ham shack. In either application, the operating desk (or dashboard) only needs to hold the KX3, which is only slightly larger than the detachable head of most rigs that have them. And an argument could be made that performance is best in its price class. What do you lose (as compared to a K3)? 1) TX phase noise that's in the range of the best of the other radios in the same price category, so you wouldn't want to contest with it driving a big power amp (just as I'm pretty unhappy with an IC-7600 10 miles away doing that); 2) It's less accommodating to interfacing stuff like computer sound cards; 3) You need outboard stuff for a spectrum display; 4) Less audio output -- if you want to listen on speakers, you need something external that's amplified. 73, Jim K9YC ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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Jim Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:
> What do you lose ([with a KX3] as compared to a K3)? 1) TX phase noise that's in the range of the best of the other radios in the same price category, so you wouldn't want to contest with it driving a big power amp (just as I'm pretty unhappy with an IC-7600 10 miles away doing that); 2) It's less accommodating to interfacing stuff like computer sound cards; 3) You need outboard stuff for a spectrum display; 4) Less audio output -- if you want to listen on speakers, you need something external that's amplified. The K3 is really a completely different animal: - It is intended as a base station radio, with twice as many controls and a built-in 100-W amp and ATU. - It has a fully independent sub receiver with the same specs as the main. The sub can be on a different band, and has no limit on VFO separation within bands like the KX3's dual watch. - It has up to 5 crystal filters per receiver, and if you outfit it with narrow filters, it will have better dynamic range than the KX3 for offsets below 2 kHz. The KX3 may have a slight edge in 2-kHz IMDDR3 with its own roofing filter module installed, as listed by Sherwood. But this difference would be insignificant for most uses, and with narrow crystal filters, the K3 will outperform the KX3 in heavy CW and narrow RTTY band conditions. Both are excellent, but if your goal is absolute dominance of the CW/RTTY bands, you'd go with the K3. The KX3, on the other hand, would be a great choice if you're on a smaller budget and/or plan to do a lot of field outings at QRP levels. It's by far the world's smallest high-performance all-band/all-mode transceiver. 73, Wayne N6KR ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Gary Smith-2
Gary,
The missions of the two radios are quite different. I can toss the KX3 into my daypack with some wire for a simple antenna, and I am off to the park or a nearby wilderness area for a nice day in the field. That is a one box solution (transceiver, batteries, antenna tuner, etc.) that is about the size of a brick, but much lighter. That is what it is designed to do. That is why I bought one. I had considered a K3 for a long time, but just couldn't see putting that much money into a radio that would sit on a desk most of the time. From the moment I saw the first announcement for the KX3, I knew it was the radio for me. The design team at Elecraft worked hard to get a high performance transceiver into a trail friendly package, and what a nice package it is. At home or in my car, I can hook it up to the KXPA100 and have a nice 100w station in two small boxes including antenna tuner.Same basic radio, same controls. That I why I will be buying a KXPA100. Re: "...and so little heard now about the K3 on the reflector?" That is not a bad reflection on the K3, but as a different poster said, represents its more mature stage of development. You don't hear as much about the K2 now, and even less about the K1 and KX1 for the same reason. So enjoy your K3. It will not be replaced by the KX3, nor will the K3 replace the KX3. This old dinosaur is very thankful that he can still get out and walk, and the KX3 is the perfect fit. When I can no longer walk, you will see me headed down the sidewalk on my "hover round scooter" with my KX3 attached and my homebrew magnetic loop antenna sticking up, headed for the nearest park. What a sight! ;-) Mark KE6BB ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by wayne burdick
Thank you all for the replies to my question, not one "wise guy"
reply at all and that is refreshing. I do understand the allure of a very small radio that does it all and does it well; I have a spud gun I use to get my antenna wires over the tallest trees when I go camping and I usually operate QRP or close to it to conserve the deep cycle battery. I have though found the K3 itself to be a really small radio and works conveniently and is not an anchor. That said, it would be unwieldy to take a K3 on a backpacking trip and it appears the KX3 would be a fine companion and one with ears like a bat. Amazing to see a complete SDR HF radio that is smaller than my old FT-208R. Amazing indeed. Thanks for the thoughts. 73, Gary KA1J --- This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active. http://www.avast.com ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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Another nice thing about the kx3...
I have mine sitting in my "go kit" which is a pelican case with kx3 and accessories. It's nice to just grab it and throw it in the car and go to wherever I may be headed. If I'm going backpacking I just put the kx3 and needed gear in my pack and go. The advantage here is that I don't have to disconnect all of the cables from the rig in the shack to go anywhere nor do I have reconnect them once I get home. Not to mention, wherever I go, the KX3 always gets that "wow" factor from hams and non-hams alike when they see it. Two co-workers went out and got their ticket after I showed them the KX3 and how sweet it can be on camping trips. Like others have said, it's nice having such a phenomenal radio in such a small package to take anywhere. 73, Steve KS6PD ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Gary Smith-2
I bought the K3/10 without 100w PA or ATU. I bought it mainly for
superior specs on CW, low phase noise, and versatility with transverters on bands above 6m. I am into eme and mw! The K3 is better (marginally) at this than the KX3, but physically larger so not so handy to haul out to remote locations where one is hand carrying gear (often up a steep trail). So, I also have the KX3. Mainly for 6m & 2m (when the new module comes out) and to interface with mw gear to use on those "high places" with excellent shots needed for DX on microwave. It may turn out the KX3 rivals the K3 for operating on dxpeditions (especially eme dxpeditions) due to size. Want the KX3 to have most of the features of the K3 then add the KXPA100 and ATU. What a nice line-up for mobile! My solution is to buy both! Then you have it all. Oh did I say I also use both radios on 600m. 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com "Kits made by KL7UW" Dubus Mag business: [hidden email] ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by k6dgw
I'm coming late to this party (thread), but I want to object to the
implication that the K3 must be reaching the end of development. There are two ways to pay for development. Either you charge for enhancements to old products, or you come out with new ones. I once suggested to Wayne that he charge for new features after some point. The response singed my eyebrows! This is /never/ going to happen. So I am always surprised that Elecraft continues to improve the K3 -- more than just providing support for it -- despite the fact that it is an 'old' product. This is very different from what other manufacturers do. But it's understandable that most of the effort goes into new products. Nevertheless I am looking forward to continued enhancement of the K3. There are certainly areas in which it can be improved, even though it already is one of the top performing amateur transceivers available at any price. The KX3 is an impressive piece of engineering, but although nobody stops you from using it in a fixed station, it is best adapted to use as a field rig. Personally, I didn't buy one because I have an emotional attachment to my old K2 for that purpose! On 1/21/2014 3:15 PM, Fred Jensen wrote: > On 1/21/2014 3:00 PM, Gary Smith wrote: > >> So why the love fest with the KX3 and so little heard now about the >> K3 on the reflector? > > The K3 is approaching maturity as a product, just as the K2 did. S/N's > are now in the high thousands, we'll probably see occasional FW > releases, but it is a very stable product. The KX3 [+accessories] is > the new kid on the block, and thus gets most of the attention. Elecraft > will hopefully announce a new, different product [K<mumble>], at which > point, you will be asking, "Why the love fest with the K<mumble> and so > little heard now about the KX3." > > 73, > > Fred K6DGW > - Northern California Contest Club > - CU in the 2014 Cal QSO Party 4-5 Oct 2014 > - www.cqp.org > > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Vic ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by KE6BB
I must agree I love my KX3 but it lacks many things that I have come to
expect with my K3. It is impossible to place all the features of a K3 into such a small package the size of a KX3. That said I would give up neither as both at the top of the transceiver lists and I have no plans on going back to my old FTDX-5000MP or IC-703+ either, both fine radios. All that with the fact that Elecraft supports its product line like no other company period. Coupled with their design team, engineers and owners make an unmatched company in our hobby. 73, Fred N0AZZ -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Mark Petiford Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2014 8:49 PM To: elecraft Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 vs KX3 Gary, The missions of the two radios are quite different. I can toss the KX3 into my daypack with some wire for a simple antenna, and I am off to the park or a nearby wilderness area for a nice day in the field. That is a one box solution (transceiver, batteries, antenna tuner, etc.) that is about the size of a brick, but much lighter. That is what it is designed to do. That is why I bought one. I had considered a K3 for a long time, but just couldn't see putting that much money into a radio that would sit on a desk most of the time. From the moment I saw the first announcement for the KX3, I knew it was the radio for me. The design team at Elecraft worked hard to get a high performance transceiver into a trail friendly package, and what a nice package it is. At home or in my car, I can hook it up to the KXPA100 and have a nice 100w station in two small boxes including antenna tuner.Same basic radio, same controls. That I why I will be buying a KXPA100. Re: "...and so little heard now about the K3 on the reflector?" That is not a bad reflection on the K3, but as a different poster said, represents its more mature stage of development. You don't hear as much about the K2 now, and even less about the K1 and KX1 for the same reason. So enjoy your K3. It will not be replaced by the KX3, nor will the K3 replace the KX3. This old dinosaur is very thankful that he can still get out and walk, and the KX3 is the perfect fit. When I can no longer walk, you will see me headed down the sidewalk on my "hover round scooter" with my KX3 attached and my homebrew magnetic loop antenna sticking up, headed for the nearest park. What a sight! ;-) Mark KE6BB ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Vic Rosenthal
On 1/22/2014 9:18 AM, Vic Rosenthal wrote:
> I'm coming late to this party (thread), but I want to object to the > implication that the K3 must be reaching the end of development. Did not mean to suggest that Vic. What *has* happened is that the K3 has been on the market for multiple years now [mine is S/N 642, they're currently shipping in the high thousands], most if not all of the "planned but not yet implemented" items have now been implemented, most of the bugs/problems/anomalies have been addressed, many of the feature requests have been taken care of, and the set of accessories is complete. While I'm sure that there will continue to be updates, they will be at a more measured pace as they have been recently. The K3 seems to meet all the requirements of a mature product, and consequently, traffic on the list about it decreases, just as it did for the KX1, K1, and K2. The original post asked why the list seems to be "All KX3, All the time." That's the reason and it's normal product evolution. > The KX3 is an impressive piece of engineering, but although nobody stops > you from using it in a fixed station, it is best adapted to use as a > field rig. Personally, I didn't buy one because I have an emotional > attachment to my old K2 for that purpose! Me too! And if I really need to go light, I always have my KX1. I used NU6T's K1 on a SOTA activation a couple of years ago. If my wife keeps on buying needlepoint stuff ... "equal hobby allowance policy" ... I'll have enough in my radio account to get one of those -- a really neat little field radio. 73, Fred K6DGW - Northern California Contest Club - CU in the 2014 Cal QSO Party 4-5 Oct 2014 - www.cqp.org ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Vic Rosenthal
Early this month I sent my K3 in for upgrades and updates, it is on
its way back right now. I put the kit together in 08 and understand it is now modified to be up-to-date with the new off the shelf K3s. I won't mention the cost involved, only to say it was absolutely reasonable and that it is really amazing to find such dedication from a company to their product line. I remember my first radio when I was a ham; it was a brand new TS-820S and it was nothing but trouble from the first week I had it. Kenwood would not stand behind their errors and found excuses for not covering the problems caused by myriad cold soldered joints. I even asked a Japanese friend to write to Trio-Kenwood directly for me to get help and was given the cold shoulder and they would not warranty it. That was 1979 and I have never bought anything Kenwood ever since and I never will again. Elecraft on the other hand has been nothing but helpful and willing to go overboard to help me with any question and resolve any issue I have ever had. I will be a life-long customer of Elecraft because of this. I appreciate the quality of their equipment and I appreciate the dignity they give me as a customer. Gary KA1J > I'm coming late to this party (thread), but I want to object to the > implication that the K3 must be reaching the end of development. > > There are two ways to pay for development. Either you charge for > enhancements to old products, or you come out with new ones. I once > suggested to Wayne that he charge for new features after some point. > The > response singed my eyebrows! This is /never/ going to happen. > > So I am always surprised that Elecraft continues to improve the K3 > -- > more than just providing support for it -- despite the fact that it > is > an 'old' product. This is very different from what other > manufacturers > do. But it's understandable that most of the effort goes into new > products. > > Nevertheless I am looking forward to continued enhancement of the > K3. > There are certainly areas in which it can be improved, even though > it > already is one of the top performing amateur transceivers available > at > any price. > > The KX3 is an impressive piece of engineering, but although nobody > stops > you from using it in a fixed station, it is best adapted to use as a > field rig. Personally, I didn't buy one because I have an emotional > attachment to my old K2 for that purpose! > > On 1/21/2014 3:15 PM, Fred Jensen wrote: > > On 1/21/2014 3:00 PM, Gary Smith wrote: > > > >> So why the love fest with the KX3 and so little heard now about > the > >> K3 on the reflector? > > > > The K3 is approaching maturity as a product, just as the K2 did. > S/N's > > are now in the high thousands, we'll probably see occasional FW > > releases, but it is a very stable product. The KX3 [+accessories] > is > > the new kid on the block, and thus gets most of the attention. > Elecraft > > will hopefully announce a new, different product [K<mumble>], at > which > > point, you will be asking, "Why the love fest with the K<mumble> > and so > > little heard now about the KX3." > > > > 73, > > > > Fred K6DGW > > - Northern California Contest Club > > - CU in the 2014 Cal QSO Party 4-5 Oct 2014 > > - www.cqp.org > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > Elecraft mailing list > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > Please help support this email list: > http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > -- > Vic > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: > http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > --- This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active. http://www.avast.com ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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