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KPA-500 FCC docs

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Bruce Beford-2

KPA-500 FCC docs

Copy and paste onto one line in your browser:

https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/ViewExhibitReport.cfm?mode=Exhibits&R
equestTimeout=500&calledFromFrame=N&application_id=290417&fcc_id='UTR-KPA500
'

Or, Go here:

https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/GenericSearch.cfm

Enter "Elecraft" for Applicant Name and click "Start Search" at the bottom
of the page.

On the next page, click on "Detail" under Display exhibits.

Enjoy,
Bruce, N1RX

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Peter Chamalian

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

Yep, that works!! Thanks

Pete, W1RM

-----Original Message-----
From: Bruce Beford [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2011 5:13 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA-500 FCC docs

Copy and paste onto one line in your browser:

https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/ViewExhibitReport.cfm?mode=Exhibits&R
equestTimeout=500&calledFromFrame=N&application_id=290417&fcc_id='UTR-KPA500
'

Or, Go here:

https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/GenericSearch.cfm

Enter "Elecraft" for Applicant Name and click "Start Search" at the bottom
of the page.

On the next page, click on "Detail" under Display exhibits.

Enjoy,
Bruce, N1RX

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S Sacco

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

In reply to this post by Bruce Beford-2

I'm not loving this part too much "Duty Cycle at 500 Watts 10 minutes
key down / 5 minutes off'
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Gary Gregory

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

*Why?

I cannot think of a way I operate that would exceed a 10 minute
transmission.

Other than a 'Fault' ?

Gary
*
On 16 March 2011 07:50, S Sacco <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm not loving this part too much "Duty Cycle at 500 Watts 10 minutes
> key down / 5 minutes off'
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
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--

*VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile
Elecraft Equipment
K3 #679, KPA-500 #018
Living the dream!!!*
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Tim Tucker

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

I'm a licensed Navy MARS operator. It is not uncommon to have very long
digital messages that need to be sent using digital modes that will take
longer than 10 minutes to send. This limitation pretty much eliminates this
amplifier from being able to be used in my shack for MARS purposes. Now
with that said, we don't often need to use an amplifier to send digitally,
but in the event I did, I couldn't do it with this amp if there is a 10
minute duty cycle.

Tim
AE6LX

On Tue, Mar 15, 2011 at 2:56 PM, Gary Gregory <[hidden email]> wrote:

> *Why?
>
> I cannot think of a way I operate that would exceed a 10 minute
> transmission.
>
> Other than a 'Fault' ?
>
> Gary
> *
> On 16 March 2011 07:50, S Sacco <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > I'm not loving this part too much "Duty Cycle at 500 Watts 10 minutes
> > key down / 5 minutes off'
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> *VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile
> Elecraft Equipment
> K3 #679, KPA-500 #018
> Living the dream!!!*
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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>
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Bruce Beford-2

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

In reply to this post by Bruce Beford-2

k6dgw

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

In reply to this post by Gary Gregory

10 min key down out of a total of 15 min is a duty cycle of 0.6667 which
seems pretty good to me. I don't think I want to pay for a CCS rating
when I'm really very ICAS. RTTY is my most demanding mode. I was a bit
concerned about my K3 on RTTY so I wrote a little Perl script to go
through a couple of RTTY logs and estimate the key down time. In the
RTTY RU, my duty cycle was 0.19 ... yes, my contest rates aren't exactly
stellar. In a RTTY ragchew, and assuming your contact is a wordy as you
are, and you both know what you want to say so there's no diddle time,
it would come to roughly 0.5 ... doesn't seem like a problem to me.

I'm no longer worried about my K3 in RTTY, I'm running it at around 40W,
driving the amplifier to 500W, to be "practiced and ready" for the KPA500.

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2011 Cal QSO Party 1-2 Oct 2011
- www.cqp.org

On 3/15/2011 2:56 PM, Gary Gregory wrote:

> *Why?
>
> I cannot think of a way I operate that would exceed a 10 minute
> transmission.
>
> Other than a 'Fault' ?

> On 16 March 2011 07:50, S Sacco<[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> I'm not loving this part too much "Duty Cycle at 500 Watts 10 minutes
>> key down / 5 minutes off'
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Tim Tucker

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

In reply to this post by Bruce Beford-2

The amount of power required is a function of propagation and intended
recipient. I can't say in advance of an *event*, how much power will be
required. If 100 watts isn't cutting it on the first delivery attempt (it
usually does), I'm not fooling around with 250 watts...I'm going straight to
500 if that's how much power I have available. There is no "use the minimum
amount of power requred..." rules here. Rather, we use the tools we have
available and methods within our SOP to get the message handled efficiently
and accurately. MARS isn't a trial and error service.

The real question is whether or not the 10 minute duty cycle is a function
of heat or is it a timer / firmware controlled function? The first
circumstance can be managed, however if duty cycle is controlled by the
latter then it doesn't seem viable to the MARS service to me. Any insight
into this question?

Tim

On Tue, Mar 15, 2011 at 3:29 PM, Bruce Beford
<[hidden email]>wrote:

> > I'm a licensed Navy MARS operator. It is not uncommon to have very long
> > digital messages that need to be sent using digital modes that will take
> > longer than 10 minutes to send. This limitation pretty much eliminates
> this
> > amplifier from being able to be used in my shack for MARS purposes. Now
> > with that said, we don't often need to use an amplifier to send
> digitally,
> > but in the event I did, I couldn't do it with this amp if there is a 10
> > minute duty cycle.
>
> > Tim
> > AE6LX
>
> Turn.the.drive.down. You don't need to drive the amp to the full 500W
> output
> for your 10+ minute message. Perhaps 200-250W will do? -Bruce, N1RX
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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KK7P

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

Heat.

73,

Lyle KK7P

> The real question is whether or not the 10 minute duty cycle is a function
> of heat or is it a timer / firmware controlled function?

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Jack Brindle

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

Lyle is correct (as usual). It is not a firmware function until things get too hot for the fan to handle.

Jack B, W6FB

On Mar 15, 2011, at 4:09 PM, Lyle Johnson wrote:

> Heat.
>
> 73,
>
> Lyle KK7P
>
>> The real question is whether or not the 10 minute duty cycle is a function
>> of heat or is it a timer / firmware controlled function?
>
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Guy, K2AV

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

In reply to this post by Tim Tucker

I can make you a very long list of amps and their finals which are destroyed
by key down at full ham power for 10 minutes. I can make a long list of
transceivers that will not run their rated power CCS. A K3 will do that by
common experience, but Wayne ain't guaranteeing it. Typically we don't
really expect ham transceivers to run CCS. Why would we expect ham amps to
run CCS.

If you need CCS duty cycles at a particular power level, you can buy CCS
military equipment rated for that power. OR, you can buy a ham amp that
specifies a "brick on key" rating (usually a derating). Alpha's have them,
and some others.

The manufacturer needs to specify if there is a derating to CCS. A derating
is not always possible (or admitted to) because the lower powers operate
quite less efficiently, particularly in broadband transistor amps without
variable tuning. Then there is this issue of running amps into awful
antennas with marginal matching. Only the amp designer knows for sure if
there is a CCS figure, and the mfr has to decide to take the risk and
publish the figure.

Many different manufacturers' ham amp models have been destroyed just by
operating in contests at the manufacturer's published power level. You hear
all about smoking amps at meetings of PVRC, YCCC, NCCC and the like.
Contests are a continuing 40% duty cycle overall, digital contests maybe
50%, 55%.

It appears that the KPA500 is designed for a 67% duty cycle, with a maximum
key down of 10 minutes at full power. That's pretty darn good for an amp in
a K3 box complete with power supply. Can wait and see if Wayne wants to
stick his head out there and list a CCS power rating for it.

You want to send 25 minute digital transmissions? Pay the money and get an
Alpha. 1500 watts out CCS for their newer models. My old Alpha 76PA will
do 700 watts out "brick on key", 1500 watts ICAS. The trick in the 76PA, is
that you reduce the plate voltage for that (the old CW setting) and the 700
watts out is still in the sweet spot of the PI network design, so the tubes
are efficient.

73, Guy.

On Tue, Mar 15, 2011 at 6:16 PM, Tim Tucker <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm a licensed Navy MARS operator. It is not uncommon to have very long
> digital messages that need to be sent using digital modes that will take
> longer than 10 minutes to send. This limitation pretty much eliminates
> this
> amplifier from being able to be used in my shack for MARS purposes. Now
> with that said, we don't often need to use an amplifier to send digitally,
> but in the event I did, I couldn't do it with this amp if there is a 10
> minute duty cycle.
>
> Tim
> AE6LX
>
> On Tue, Mar 15, 2011 at 2:56 PM, Gary Gregory <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > *Why?
> >
> > I cannot think of a way I operate that would exceed a 10 minute
> > transmission.
> >
> > Other than a 'Fault' ?
> >
> > Gary
> > *
> > On 16 March 2011 07:50, S Sacco <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > I'm not loving this part too much "Duty Cycle at 500 Watts 10 minutes
> > > key down / 5 minutes off'
> > > ______________________________________________________________
> > > Elecraft mailing list
> > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> > >
> > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > *VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile
> > Elecraft Equipment
> > K3 #679, KPA-500 #018
> > Living the dream!!!*
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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Leigh L. Klotz Jr WA5ZNU

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

Administrator

Guy, K2AV wrote

OR, you can buy a ham amp that
specifies a "brick on key" rating (usually a derating). Alpha's have them,
and some others.

Did anyone else notice the Alpha ad in QST over Christmas showed a fruitcake on the key instead of a brick?

Leigh/WA5ZNU

Gary Gregory

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

*We have lots of fruitcakes in VK - some have an amateur license !!!

Grin

Gary
*
On 16 March 2011 14:47, Leigh L. Klotz Jr WA5ZNU <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Guy, K2AV wrote:
> >
> > OR, you can buy a ham amp that
> > specifies a "brick on key" rating (usually a derating). Alpha's have
> > them,
> > and some others.
> >
>
> Did anyone else notice the Alpha ad in QST over Christmas showed a
> fruitcake
> on the key instead of a brick?
>
> Leigh/WA5ZNU
>
>
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/KPA-500-FCC-docs-tp6174338p6175308.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
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>

Jim Wiley-2

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

In reply to this post by Leigh L. Klotz Jr WA5ZNU

And has anyone noticed that the front panel indicators on the Alpha amp
shown in the recent ads seem to show 1500 watts out, with pretty close
to 2500 volts and 0.6 amps on the "meters". WOW! !500 watts RF out for
1500 watts DC in. 100% efficiency!! There's a good mark for Wayne and
Eric to shoot at.

Maybe the key isn't the only place you can find a fruitcake! Ain't
Photoshop cool?

- Jim, KL7CC

Leigh L. Klotz Jr WA5ZNU wrote:
>
> Did anyone else notice the Alpha ad in QST over Christmas showed a fruitcake
> on the key instead of a brick?
>
> Leigh/WA5ZNU
>
>
>
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Bob Naumann W5OV

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

In reply to this post by Tim Tucker

I think that those of us who are not involved in MARS need an education
about what you guys are doing.

When I was in Army MARS about 35 years ago, we had no real traffic to handle
at all. All we did was training. This was to be prepared - in case.

I would think that the need for MARS (sadly) has not increased but rather
diminished further due to increased 'normal' communication methods -
Internet, cell phones, et al. Soldiers call home via Skype routinely from
the battlefield - there's not a whole lot of reason for phone patches any
more.

Am I wrong?

73,

Bob W5OV
Ex- AAR2BQ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Tim Tucker
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2011 5:52 PM
To: Bruce Beford
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA-500 FCC docs

The amount of power required is a function of propagation and intended
recipient. I can't say in advance of an *event*, how much power will be
required. If 100 watts isn't cutting it on the first delivery attempt (it
usually does), I'm not fooling around with 250 watts...I'm going straight to
500 if that's how much power I have available. There is no "use the minimum
amount of power requred..." rules here. Rather, we use the tools we have
available and methods within our SOP to get the message handled efficiently
and accurately. MARS isn't a trial and error service.

The real question is whether or not the 10 minute duty cycle is a function
of heat or is it a timer / firmware controlled function? The first
circumstance can be managed, however if duty cycle is controlled by the
latter then it doesn't seem viable to the MARS service to me. Any insight
into this question?

Tim

On Tue, Mar 15, 2011 at 3:29 PM, Bruce Beford
<[hidden email]>wrote:

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Mike Reublin

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

In reply to this post by Leigh L. Klotz Jr WA5ZNU

The difference being that, with enough determination, the brick is edible......

73
Mike NF4L

On 3/16/2011 12:47 AM, Leigh L. Klotz Jr WA5ZNU wrote:
> Did anyone else notice the Alpha ad in QST over Christmas showed a fruitcake
> on the key instead of a brick?
>
> Leigh/WA5ZNU
>

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Brendan Minish

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

In reply to this post by Gary Gregory

On 16/03/2011 05:26, Gary Gregory wrote:
> *We have lots of fruitcakes in VK - some have an amateur license !!!

But not many have KPA500's yet ;-)

--
73
Brendan EI6IZ
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Guy, K2AV

Re: KPA-500 FCC docs

Hey, take it easy on my favorite flavor of biscuit....

73, Guy.

On Wed, Mar 16, 2011 at 9:17 PM, Brendan Minish <[hidden email]>wrote:

> On 16/03/2011 05:26, Gary Gregory wrote:
> > *We have lots of fruitcakes in VK - some have an amateur license !!!
>
> But not many have KPA500's yet ;-)
>
>
>
> --
> 73
> Brendan EI6IZ
> ______________________________________________________________
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