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KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

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ANDY DURBIN

KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

"If I was to replace the K3S with a rig with only RS232 control of the KPA500, will the Kat500 still follow along using the Aux cables."

I'm pretty sure the answer is "No". AUX cables don't do anything unless connected to an AUX compatible rig. It is, however, easy to feed the KAT500 with the rigs responses to KPA500 interrogations assuming the rig is Kenwood or Kenwood compatible. The KPA500 can be configured to poll for IF, FA, and FB. KAT500 is wired to listen to the FA responses.

Email me for a cable sketch if you need it.

Andy, k3wyc

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ANDY DURBIN

KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

"I simply want to know:
1) does the KAT500 also switch with BCD data
and
2) if so, can those data come from a KPA500 that is being controlled with serial data. (When I say Aux cable, I'm referring to the 15-pin cable that includes BCD (band) data."

1 - The KAT500 schematic shows it receives BCD band data. I assume that could be used to control the selected antenna but I don't see how it would be useful for selecting a tuning solution.

2 - The KPA500 schematic shows that BCD band data is receive only so it does not appear to be capable of sending band data to the KAT500.

My "interesting project" computes and outputs Elecraft format BCD band data but I found no use for it and I disconnected it after initial testing. I control my KPA500 with the serial data band command "^BN" and I control my KAT500 with the serial data frequency command "f". My KAT500 and KPA500 always follow my TX frequency. I placed higher priority on avoiding KAT and KPA faults than on optimizing receive performance when split.

Current KAT500 firmware can only follow VFO A (FA) if listening to a Kenwood rig that is being polled by a KPA500. The Kenwood TX VFO may be VFO A or VFO B.

73,
Andy, k3wyc

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Wes Stewart-2

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

Thanks Andy.

I'm starting to get my head around this. "Tis a pity that Elecraft didn't allow
for the KPA500 to control the KAT500 via the band data bus and have an
integrated Amp/Tuner combo that didn't require a proprietary interface.

The tuning solutions are in the tuner memory so telling it, or letting it
measure, the frequency recalls them.

Wes

On 11/18/2020 3:02 AM, Andy Durbin wrote:

> "I simply want to know:
> 1) does the KAT500 also switch with BCD data
> and
> 2) if so, can those data come from a KPA500 that is being controlled with serial data. (When I say Aux cable, I'm referring to the 15-pin cable that includes BCD (band) data."
>
>
> 1 - The KAT500 schematic shows it receives BCD band data. I assume that could be used to control the selected antenna but I don't see how it would be useful for selecting a tuning solution.
>
> 2 - The KPA500 schematic shows that BCD band data is receive only so it does not appear to be capable of sending band data to the KAT500.
>
> My "interesting project" computes and outputs Elecraft format BCD band data but I found no use for it and I disconnected it after initial testing. I control my KPA500 with the serial data band command "^BN" and I control my KAT500 with the serial data frequency command "f". My KAT500 and KPA500 always follow my TX frequency. I placed higher priority on avoiding KAT and KPA faults than on optimizing receive performance when split.
>
> Current KAT500 firmware can only follow VFO A (FA) if listening to a Kenwood rig that is being polled by a KPA500. The Kenwood TX VFO may be VFO A or VFO B.
>
> 73,
> Andy, k3wyc
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Elecraft mailing list

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

I received a bit of further information this morning. The KAT500 only uses the band data to validate that the received frequency (from the K3) is on the indicated band. It does not use it for anything else.

Further, the KPA500 only uses band data to select the band. In general, the KPA doesn’t care about the frequency - it really has no frequency-sensitive elements. The KPA does not receive frequency from the K3, and only uses the Kenwood data (or Icom band voltage) to select a band. Thus there is no data to be sent.

I believe you are searching for a solution that gathers transceiver frequency and sends it to the KAT500. Or, allow the KAT500 to use its built-in frequency measurement system to select the bin.

Jack, W6FB

> On Nov 18, 2020, at 8:00 AM, Wes <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Thanks Andy.
>
> I'm starting to get my head around this. "Tis a pity that Elecraft didn't allow for the KPA500 to control the KAT500 via the band data bus and have an integrated Amp/Tuner combo that didn't require a proprietary interface.
>
> The tuning solutions are in the tuner memory so telling it, or letting it measure, the frequency recalls them.
>
> Wes
>
>
> On 11/18/2020 3:02 AM, Andy Durbin wrote:
>> "I simply want to know:
>> 1) does the KAT500 also switch with BCD data
>> and
>> 2) if so, can those data come from a KPA500 that is being controlled with serial data. (When I say Aux cable, I'm referring to the 15-pin cable that includes BCD (band) data."
>>
>>
>> 1 - The KAT500 schematic shows it receives BCD band data. I assume that could be used to control the selected antenna but I don't see how it would be useful for selecting a tuning solution.
>>
>> 2 - The KPA500 schematic shows that BCD band data is receive only so it does not appear to be capable of sending band data to the KAT500.
>>
>> My "interesting project" computes and outputs Elecraft format BCD band data but I found no use for it and I disconnected it after initial testing. I control my KPA500 with the serial data band command "^BN" and I control my KAT500 with the serial data frequency command "f". My KAT500 and KPA500 always follow my TX frequency. I placed higher priority on avoiding KAT and KPA faults than on optimizing receive performance when split.
>>
>> Current KAT500 firmware can only follow VFO A (FA) if listening to a Kenwood rig that is being polled by a KPA500. The Kenwood TX VFO may be VFO A or VFO B.
>>
>> 73,
>> Andy, k3wyc
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
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>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
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>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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john@kk9a.com

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

In reply to this post by ANDY DURBIN

So what does the HD15 cable do from the KAT500 to the KPA500? I
thought that the KAT controlled the amp but perhaps it is just passing
the K3 data through.

John KK9A

Jack Brindle W6FB wrote:

I received a bit of further information this morning. The KAT500 only
uses the band data to validate that the received frequency (from the
K3) is on the indicated band. It does not use it for anything else.

Further, the KPA500 only uses band data to select the band. In
general, the KPA doesn’t care about the frequency - it really has no
frequency-sensitive elements. The KPA does not receive frequency from
the K3, and only uses the Kenwood data (or Icom band voltage) to
select a band. Thus there is no data to be sent.

I believe you are searching for a solution that gathers transceiver
frequency and sends it to the KAT500. Or, allow the KAT500 to use its
built-in frequency measurement system to select the bin.

Jack, W6FB

> On Nov 18, 2020, at 8:00 AM, Wes <wes_n7ws at triconet.org> wrote:
>
> Thanks Andy.
>
> I'm starting to get my head around this. "Tis a pity that Elecraft
> didn't allow for the KPA500 to control the KAT500 via the band data
> bus and have an integrated Amp/Tuner combo that didn't require a
> proprietary interface.
>
> The tuning solutions are in the tuner memory so telling it, or
> letting it measure, the frequency recalls them.
>
> Wes

Dick Dievendorff-4

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

Mostly the cable is a pass through. The KAT500 has a relay to interrupt the amp key line during ATU tuning, and the KAT500 can observe (but not change) the exciter-controlled band lines.

The ATU needs the frequency. The amp needs the band.

Both amp and ATU have TX freq counters. Both amp and ATU have publicly documented mechanisms to be controlled by external automation to return to freq-appropriate settings before transmission.

We provide automation from K3, K3S, and K4 when you use the optional 15-pin ACC cables and select the appropriate settings in exciter, amp, and ATU. These are convenient, but not the only way the amp and ATU can be used.

If the amp were able to set band lines for the ATU, it would be of marginal utility. The ATU could return to the last used setting on that band. As soon as you QSY, the ATU would probably need to move, based on the tx freq count.

73 de Dick, K6KR

> On Nov 18, 2020, at 10:18, [hidden email] wrote:
>
> So what does the HD15 cable do from the KAT500 to the KPA500? I thought that the KAT controlled the amp but perhaps it is just passing the K3 data through.
>
> John KK9A
>
>
>
> Jack Brindle W6FB wrote:
>
> I received a bit of further information this morning. The KAT500 only uses the band data to validate that the received frequency (from the K3) is on the indicated band. It does not use it for anything else.
>
> Further, the KPA500 only uses band data to select the band. In general, the KPA doesn’t care about the frequency - it really has no frequency-sensitive elements. The KPA does not receive frequency from the K3, and only uses the Kenwood data (or Icom band voltage) to select a band. Thus there is no data to be sent.
>
> I believe you are searching for a solution that gathers transceiver frequency and sends it to the KAT500. Or, allow the KAT500 to use its built-in frequency measurement system to select the bin.
>
> Jack, W6FB
>
>
>> On Nov 18, 2020, at 8:00 AM, Wes <wes_n7ws at triconet.org> wrote:
>>
>> Thanks Andy.
>>
>> I'm starting to get my head around this. "Tis a pity that Elecraft didn't allow for the KPA500 to control the KAT500 via the band data bus and have an integrated Amp/Tuner combo that didn't require a proprietary interface.
>>
>> The tuning solutions are in the tuner memory so telling it, or letting it measure, the frequency recalls them.
>>
>> Wes
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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Elecraft mailing list

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

In reply to this post by john@kk9a.com

Two things. First, you are right, it passes the signals through from the radio. The second is that it can break the PTT line (in that pass-through) when the KAT needs to tune or otherwise change the relays while the system is transmitting (PTT being active).

Note that both the KAT and the KPA use many of the signals on the AuxIO. These include the BAND lines, PTT, and importantly, the AuxBus line. The KPA500 talks on the Auxbus (but does not listen), while the KAT listens on the Auxbus. Because of the way the KPA encodes its data, the KAT cannot receive any data from the KPA, but only that coming from the transceiver. That is kind of an important point - there is no communications between the KPA500 and the KAT500, which eliminates the ability to do really close control between the two.

73!
Jack, W6FB

> On Nov 18, 2020, at 10:15 AM, [hidden email] wrote:
>
> So what does the HD15 cable do from the KAT500 to the KPA500? I thought that the KAT controlled the amp but perhaps it is just passing the K3 data through.
>
> John KK9A
>
>
>
> Jack Brindle W6FB wrote:
>
> I received a bit of further information this morning. The KAT500 only uses the band data to validate that the received frequency (from the K3) is on the indicated band. It does not use it for anything else.
>
> Further, the KPA500 only uses band data to select the band. In general, the KPA doesn’t care about the frequency - it really has no frequency-sensitive elements. The KPA does not receive frequency from the K3, and only uses the Kenwood data (or Icom band voltage) to select a band. Thus there is no data to be sent.
>
> I believe you are searching for a solution that gathers transceiver frequency and sends it to the KAT500. Or, allow the KAT500 to use its built-in frequency measurement system to select the bin.
>
> Jack, W6FB
>
>
>> On Nov 18, 2020, at 8:00 AM, Wes <wes_n7ws at triconet.org> wrote:
>>
>> Thanks Andy.
>>
>> I'm starting to get my head around this. "Tis a pity that Elecraft didn't allow for the KPA500 to control the KAT500 via the band data bus and have an integrated Amp/Tuner combo that didn't require a proprietary interface.
>>
>> The tuning solutions are in the tuner memory so telling it, or letting it measure, the frequency recalls them.
>>
>> Wes
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
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ANDY DURBIN

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

In reply to this post by ANDY DURBIN

Some people seem to get quite hostile when I carefully distinguish between "band data" and "frequency data". For that reason I didn't emphasize that KAT500 needs FREQUENCY not BAND.

The cable for "KPA500 polls Kenwood and KPA500 and KAT500 listen to Kenwood" can be cobbled together for probably under $10 assuming you don't have the connectors and cable in the junk bin. You can also buy the cable from Elecraft. It works fine as long as you accept that KAT500 can only follow VFO A (limitation of current firmware). I was not satisfied with this (and other limitations) so I launched on a long, educational, rewarding, and sometimes frustrating, project to build a controller that made the Kenwood/KPA500/KAT500 interface work the way I though it should (I don't claim it works correctly , only that it works the way I want it to).

I've provided the link before but links a cheap so here it is again - https://tinyurl.com/ycrszzbe

73,
Andy, k3wyc

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Ken Winterling

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

I would like to see an Icom CI-V interface for the KPA500/KAT500
combination. This is built into the KPA1500 which is a combination
amp/tuner/antenna selector switch. The KPA1500 "speaks" Elecraft, Kenwood,
Yaesu, and Icom. The KPA500 can use Icom "band data" voltages but that
doesn't support the WARC bands. There is also no communication with the
KAT500 to tell it what band/antenna to use.

Yes, the KPA500/KAT500 combination switches perfectly to the proper band,
frequency, and antenna on *transmit *but does nothing on receive. When
just listening it is necessary to manually press the ANT(tenna) button on
the KAT500 to select the proper antenna for the selected frequency (band)
on the Icom radio. If you are trying to scan memories that doesn't work at
all. Having the ability for the KAT500 to follow the receiver so it could
select the proper band/antenna would be very helpful.

Has anybody built such an interface or know of an existing commercial
device that will perform the above function?

73,

Ken
WA2LBI

On Wed, Nov 18, 2020 at 4:01 PM Andy Durbin <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Some people seem to get quite hostile when I carefully distinguish between
> "band data" and "frequency data". For that reason I didn't emphasize that
> KAT500 needs FREQUENCY not BAND.
>
> The cable for "KPA500 polls Kenwood and KPA500 and KAT500 listen to
> Kenwood" can be cobbled together for probably under $10 assuming you don't
> have the connectors and cable in the junk bin. You can also buy the cable
> from Elecraft. It works fine as long as you accept that KAT500 can only
> follow VFO A (limitation of current firmware). I was not satisfied with
> this (and other limitations) so I launched on a long, educational,
> rewarding, and sometimes frustrating, project to build a controller that
> made the Kenwood/KPA500/KAT500 interface work the way I though it should (I
> don't claim it works correctly , only that it works the way I want it to).
>
> I've provided the link before but links a cheap so here it is again -
> https://tinyurl.com/ycrszzbe
>
> 73,
> Andy, k3wyc
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

ANDY DURBIN

KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

"I would like to see an IcomCI-V interface for the KPA500/KAT500 combination. "

It probably wouldn't be too difficult to implement. I have seen code for a CI-V decoder and, once the required TX or RX frequency has been extracted, it would be easy to compute and send band to KPA500 and frequency to KAT500.

No motivation here though and I don't know if anyone has published a suitable interface.

73,
Andy, k3wyc

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kd4iz

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

Andy and Ken,

Wonder if this could be adapted? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_xMEbW8z28

KD4IZ
Jack Spitznagel
FM19oo

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On
Behalf Of Andy Durbin
Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2020 13:49
To: Ken Winterling <[hidden email]>; [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

"I would like to see an IcomCI-V interface for the KPA500/KAT500
combination. "

It probably wouldn't be too difficult to implement. I have seen code for a
CI-V decoder and, once the required TX or RX frequency has been extracted,
it would be easy to compute and send band to KPA500 and frequency to KAT500.

No motivation here though and I don't know if anyone has published a
suitable interface.

73,
Andy, k3wyc

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Jim Brown-10

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

In reply to this post by ANDY DURBIN

On 11/19/2020 10:48 AM, Andy Durbin wrote:
> It probably wouldn't be too difficult to implement. I have seen code for a CI-V decoder and, once the required TX or RX frequency has been extracted, it would be easy to compute and send band to KPA500 and frequency to KAT500.

Many years ago, a homebrew CI-V to RS232 interface was published in QST,
and about 15 years ago, I bought two at a Chicago area hamfest that a
ham had made a small business of building and selling. It worked fine
with the IC746 that I owned at the time.

73, Jim K9YC

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Tom-4

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

In reply to this post by ANDY DURBIN

In the plans for Win4IcomSuite.
Tom

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On
Behalf Of [hidden email]
Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2020 1:55 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

Andy and Ken,

Wonder if this could be adapted? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_xMEbW8z28

KD4IZ
Jack Spitznagel
FM19oo

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On
Behalf Of Andy Durbin
Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2020 13:49
To: Ken Winterling <[hidden email]>; [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

"I would like to see an IcomCI-V interface for the KPA500/KAT500
combination. "

It probably wouldn't be too difficult to implement. I have seen code for a
CI-V decoder and, once the required TX or RX frequency has been extracted,
it would be easy to compute and send band to KPA500 and frequency to KAT500.

No motivation here though and I don't know if anyone has published a
suitable interface.

73,
Andy, k3wyc

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w4sc-2

Re: KPA500+KAT500 interfacing

In reply to this post by ANDY DURBIN

Google is your friend!!! ……….. There are several showing in a search…

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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