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KPA500 (another view)

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alsopb

KPA500 (another view)

It's been stated here that the difference between 1500W and 500W is
mostly unimportant. Most views are going from about 100 w to 500 W.

Here is another view based up the past 15 days of operation with a
KPA-500. The previously 1500 watts was used with identical antennas.

I chase DX and specifically the DX Marathon award where you try to work
as many countries as possible each year. Yes I can still work stations
but the net effect is:

1) You won't work everything you used to
2) It takes longer to work them
3) SSB pileup cracking is more difficult
4) RTTY pileups are more difficult still.

Frustration.

It hasn't been a complete wash. I've managed 174 countries/40 zones
with the KPA-500 BUT GETTING THERE WAS A LOT MORE DIFFICULT than Jan. 2011.

The above isn't unexpected.

Bring on a KPA-1000.

73 de Brian/K3KO

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Jim Bennett

Re: KPA500 (another view)

It's all relative to how to spend what dollars one has. For me, if money was no concern, I might have a mega KW Alpha sitting on my desk. But I don't have that kind of money, nor the additional dollars to run a dedicated 240V line to the shack. With the dollars I don't spend on a 1,500 watt amp, I can wait for the KAT500 Auto Tuner and get a 500 watt station that plays very well with my all-band, 600-ohm ladder line fed doublet. (And still run it off the existing 117V line in the shack.) Folks going from a 1,500 watt station to a 500 watt station probably will see the difference in a negative light. But I, like a lot of others, went from a 100 watt station up to a 500 watt station. BIG improvement. :-) :-)

Jim / W6JHB

On Tuesday, Jan 17, 2012, at Tuesday, 3:12 PM, Brian Alsop wrote:

> It's been stated here that the difference between 1500W and 500W is
> mostly unimportant. Most views are going from about 100 w to 500 W.
>
> Here is another view based up the past 15 days of operation with a
> KPA-500. The previously 1500 watts was used with identical antennas.
>
> I chase DX and specifically the DX Marathon award where you try to work
> as many countries as possible each year. Yes I can still work stations
> but the net effect is:
>
> 1) You won't work everything you used to
> 2) It takes longer to work them
> 3) SSB pileup cracking is more difficult
> 4) RTTY pileups are more difficult still.
>
> Frustration.
>
> It hasn't been a complete wash. I've managed 174 countries/40 zones
> with the KPA-500 BUT GETTING THERE WAS A LOT MORE DIFFICULT than Jan. 2011.
>
> The above isn't unexpected.
>
> Bring on a KPA-1000.
>
> 73 de Brian/K3KO
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 10.0.1416 / Virus Database: 2109/4148 - Release Date: 01/17/12
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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David Gilbert

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by alsopb

A power ratio of 3 (1500 watts versus 500 watts) is just under 5 db.
Check out these audio files (CW, though ... not SSB) I generated to see
what kind of impact that can have for readability of signals near the
noise threshold.

http://www.ab7e.com/weak_signal/mdd.html

73,
Dave AB7E

On 1/17/2012 4:12 PM, Brian Alsop wrote:

Alan Bloom

Re: KPA500 (another view)

Interesting experiment Dave. I think that kind of test is valid for VHF
operation. But on HF it is very rare to hear a signal at a constant
level like that.

Normally signal strength varies considerably from moment to moment due
to fading. Even if the average signal level is right at the noise
level, most of the time it will be well above or well below that level.
A dB or two increase or decrease will vary the percentage of time the
signal is copyable, but only a little. The QRM also varies in signal
strength from moment to moment.

Of course, louder is always better. But unless you are a big-gun
contester, where winning or losing depends on a few extra contacts over
the course of the weekend, I think you'd have a hard time noticing a
couple dB difference in normal operation.

I am just about to order a 2-element SteppIR Yagi. I decided that the
extra dB or two of the 3-element model is not worth another $450. :=)

Alan N1AL

On Tue, 2012-01-17 at 16:52 -0700, David Gilbert wrote:

Vic Rosenthal

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by David Gilbert

Those files had me reaching for my APF button!

I completely agree about every dB counting, either near the noise level or in a
competitive situation.

On 1/17/2012 3:52 PM, David Gilbert wrote:

> A power ratio of 3 (1500 watts versus 500 watts) is just under 5 db.
> Check out these audio files (CW, though ... not SSB) I generated to see
> what kind of impact that can have for readability of signals near the
> noise threshold.
>
> http://www.ab7e.com/weak_signal/mdd.html
>
> 73,
> Dave AB7E
>
>
>
> On 1/17/2012 4:12 PM, Brian Alsop wrote:
>> It's been stated here that the difference between 1500W and 500W is
>> mostly unimportant. Most views are going from about 100 w to 500 W.
>>
>> Here is another view based up the past 15 days of operation with a
>> KPA-500. The previously 1500 watts was used with identical antennas.
>>
>> I chase DX and specifically the DX Marathon award where you try to work
>> as many countries as possible each year. Yes I can still work stations
>> but the net effect is:
>>
>> 1) You won't work everything you used to
>> 2) It takes longer to work them
>> 3) SSB pileup cracking is more difficult
>> 4) RTTY pileups are more difficult still.
>>
>> Frustration.
>>
>> It hasn't been a complete wash. I've managed 174 countries/40 zones
>> with the KPA-500 BUT GETTING THERE WAS A LOT MORE DIFFICULT than Jan. 2011.
>>
>> The above isn't unexpected.
>>
>> Bring on a KPA-1000.
>>
>> 73 de Brian/K3KO
>>
>>
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Vic Rosenthal

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by Alan Bloom

Keep in mind that it all adds up. If you get 2 db more from your beam, and 3 db from going
from 500 to 1000 watts (say), and maybe a db by replacing your old coax, etc., that's 6 db
-- a huge advantage.

On 1/17/2012 4:15 PM, Alan Bloom wrote:

> Interesting experiment Dave. I think that kind of test is valid for VHF
> operation. But on HF it is very rare to hear a signal at a constant
> level like that.
>
> Normally signal strength varies considerably from moment to moment due
> to fading. Even if the average signal level is right at the noise
> level, most of the time it will be well above or well below that level.
> A dB or two increase or decrease will vary the percentage of time the
> signal is copyable, but only a little. The QRM also varies in signal
> strength from moment to moment.
>
> Of course, louder is always better. But unless you are a big-gun
> contester, where winning or losing depends on a few extra contacts over
> the course of the weekend, I think you'd have a hard time noticing a
> couple dB difference in normal operation.
>
> I am just about to order a 2-element SteppIR Yagi. I decided that the
> extra dB or two of the 3-element model is not worth another $450. :=)
>
> Alan N1AL
>
>
> On Tue, 2012-01-17 at 16:52 -0700, David Gilbert wrote:
>> A power ratio of 3 (1500 watts versus 500 watts) is just under 5 db.
>> Check out these audio files (CW, though ... not SSB) I generated to see
>> what kind of impact that can have for readability of signals near the
>> noise threshold.
>>
>> http://www.ab7e.com/weak_signal/mdd.html
>>
>> 73,
>> Dave AB7E
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
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k6dgw

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by alsopb

I'm fairly positive that everyone has their own story. For perhaps 9-12
months prior to purchasing the KPA500, I ran my 1,200W amp at 500W to
see if this was going to be a good deal. I decided it was, got the KPA
and sold the amp. I'm not sorry.

I'm probably somewhat more casual in contests and chasing DX than Brian
is, but I seem to do OK. I've put a little $$ into antennas, which I'm
pretty sure has made a much bigger difference than the 700W difference
in power, a friend got my TB working again for me which has made a BIG
difference, and I managed over 700 QSO's in the RTTY RU, some of which
were in fairly good sized piles. YMMV, that's mine.

Now ... the P3 has been entirely different. I bought it as a toy, my
wife had been spending some on her hobby, we have an "Equal Hobby
Allowance" policy, so why not? "Seeing the band" has made a huge
difference for me. I'd have never made 700 QSO's on RTTY were it not
for the P3. Working DX has become almost automated ... see the pile,
put VFO B in the middle, wait 'til DX answers someone, one signal shows
up, put VFO B on him, wait for TU, call. OK, sometimes it's 2 or 3
signals, but it works almost every time.

I was able to get rid of a big amplifier that I needed one of my
20-something grandsons to move for me, the footprint of my station on
the desk is markedly reduced and easier to use, and I love 500W no-tune
full QSK. I'll probably spring for the KAT500, my antennas do change,
it's the last thing I really have to experiment with. Besides, Andrea
keeps buying needlepoint stuff :-)

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2012 Cal QSO Party 6-7 Oct 2012
- www.cqp.org

On 1/17/2012 3:12 PM, Brian Alsop wrote:

> 1) You won't work everything you used to
> 2) It takes longer to work them
> 3) SSB pileup cracking is more difficult
> 4) RTTY pileups are more difficult still.

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Alan Bloom

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by Vic Rosenthal

Very true. But even 6 dB would not make a big difference for a
rag-chewer or a casual contester. Even for a fairly serious DXer, being
in the right place at the right time and having superior operating
skills are more important than an S-unit of signal strength.

The place where the best possible signal is really essential is for a
world-class contest station. Those guys agonize over every fraction of
a dB of feedline loss.

Alan N1AL

On Tue, 2012-01-17 at 16:20 -0800, Vic K2VCO wrote:

> Keep in mind that it all adds up. If you get 2 db more from your beam, and 3 db from going
> from 500 to 1000 watts (say), and maybe a db by replacing your old coax, etc., that's 6 db
> -- a huge advantage.
>
> On 1/17/2012 4:15 PM, Alan Bloom wrote:
> > Interesting experiment Dave. I think that kind of test is valid for VHF
> > operation. But on HF it is very rare to hear a signal at a constant
> > level like that.
> >
> > Normally signal strength varies considerably from moment to moment due
> > to fading. Even if the average signal level is right at the noise
> > level, most of the time it will be well above or well below that level.
> > A dB or two increase or decrease will vary the percentage of time the
> > signal is copyable, but only a little. The QRM also varies in signal
> > strength from moment to moment.
> >
> > Of course, louder is always better. But unless you are a big-gun
> > contester, where winning or losing depends on a few extra contacts over
> > the course of the weekend, I think you'd have a hard time noticing a
> > couple dB difference in normal operation.
> >
> > I am just about to order a 2-element SteppIR Yagi. I decided that the
> > extra dB or two of the 3-element model is not worth another $450. :=)
> >
> > Alan N1AL
> >
> >
> > On Tue, 2012-01-17 at 16:52 -0700, David Gilbert wrote:
> >> A power ratio of 3 (1500 watts versus 500 watts) is just under 5 db.
> >> Check out these audio files (CW, though ... not SSB) I generated to see
> >> what kind of impact that can have for readability of signals near the
> >> noise threshold.
> >>
> >> http://www.ab7e.com/weak_signal/mdd.html
> >>
> >> 73,
> >> Dave AB7E
> >>

Mike K2MK

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by alsopb

I'm hoping they skip the middle man and go right for the KPA-1500. Folks considering a KW might have been persuaded by the fine reviews and excellent integration to jump into the KPA-500. Those desiring the legal limit are probably taking a wait and see approach.

73,
Mike K2MK

alsopb wrote

It's been stated here that the difference between 1500W and 500W is
mostly unimportant. Most views are going from about 100 w to 500 W.

Here is another view based up the past 15 days of operation with a
KPA-500. The previously 1500 watts was used with identical antennas.

I chase DX and specifically the DX Marathon award where you try to work
as many countries as possible each year. Yes I can still work stations
but the net effect is:

1) You won't work everything you used to
2) It takes longer to work them
3) SSB pileup cracking is more difficult
4) RTTY pileups are more difficult still.

Frustration.

It hasn't been a complete wash. I've managed 174 countries/40 zones
with the KPA-500 BUT GETTING THERE WAS A LOT MORE DIFFICULT than Jan. 2011.

The above isn't unexpected.

Bring on a KPA-1000.

73 de Brian/K3KO

Vic Rosenthal

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by Alan Bloom

It isn't really a question of what's more important. Of course if you don't call on the
right frequency you won't get through even with 5 kW. It's about what happens "other
things being equal" in poor conditions, near the noise level or in a pileup.

On 1/17/2012 4:30 PM, Alan Bloom wrote:

> Very true. But even 6 dB would not make a big difference for a
> rag-chewer or a casual contester. Even for a fairly serious DXer, being
> in the right place at the right time and having superior operating
> skills are more important than an S-unit of signal strength.
>
> The place where the best possible signal is really essential is for a
> world-class contest station. Those guys agonize over every fraction of
> a dB of feedline loss.
>
> Alan N1AL
>
>
> On Tue, 2012-01-17 at 16:20 -0800, Vic K2VCO wrote:
>> Keep in mind that it all adds up. If you get 2 db more from your beam, and 3 db from going
>> from 500 to 1000 watts (say), and maybe a db by replacing your old coax, etc., that's 6 db
>> -- a huge advantage.
>>
>> On 1/17/2012 4:15 PM, Alan Bloom wrote:
>>> Interesting experiment Dave. I think that kind of test is valid for VHF
>>> operation. But on HF it is very rare to hear a signal at a constant
>>> level like that.
>>>
>>> Normally signal strength varies considerably from moment to moment due
>>> to fading. Even if the average signal level is right at the noise
>>> level, most of the time it will be well above or well below that level.
>>> A dB or two increase or decrease will vary the percentage of time the
>>> signal is copyable, but only a little. The QRM also varies in signal
>>> strength from moment to moment.
>>>
>>> Of course, louder is always better. But unless you are a big-gun
>>> contester, where winning or losing depends on a few extra contacts over
>>> the course of the weekend, I think you'd have a hard time noticing a
>>> couple dB difference in normal operation.
>>>
>>> I am just about to order a 2-element SteppIR Yagi. I decided that the
>>> extra dB or two of the 3-element model is not worth another $450. :=)
>>>
>>> Alan N1AL
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, 2012-01-17 at 16:52 -0700, David Gilbert wrote:
>>>> A power ratio of 3 (1500 watts versus 500 watts) is just under 5 db.
>>>> Check out these audio files (CW, though ... not SSB) I generated to see
>>>> what kind of impact that can have for readability of signals near the
>>>> noise threshold.
>>>>
>>>> http://www.ab7e.com/weak_signal/mdd.html
>>>>
>>>> 73,
>>>> Dave AB7E
>>>>

Dave Perry N4QS

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by Alan Bloom

I think that for serious Dxers, 6 db can make a huge difference. I have a
KPA500 and a KW amp. I tend to use the 500 watt amp for casual contesting
and Dxing. But I find that I often have to turn on the KW when I am working
very weak signal DX or when I am trying to bust a big pileup. For example,
I have an inverted L on 160M (and have worked 99 countries over the last
three winters on top band). I am finding this winter that when an EU
station can't hear me with the KPA500, the station often comes right back
when I turn on the KW amp. The same goes if I am attempting to work a weak
Asian sig on the higher bands. In short, when you are dealing with weak
sigs just barely audible above the noise threshold, 6 db makes a big
difference! You need that 6 db even more when you live in western KY!

Dave, N4QS

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]]On Behalf Of Alan Bloom
Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2012 6:30 PM
To: Vic K2VCO
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 (another view)

Very true. But even 6 dB would not make a big difference for a
rag-chewer or a casual contester. Even for a fairly serious DXer, being
in the right place at the right time and having superior operating
skills are more important than an S-unit of signal strength.

The place where the best possible signal is really essential is for a
world-class contest station. Those guys agonize over every fraction of
a dB of feedline loss.

Alan N1AL

On Tue, 2012-01-17 at 16:20 -0800, Vic K2VCO wrote:
> Keep in mind that it all adds up. If you get 2 db more from your beam, and
3 db from going
> from 500 to 1000 watts (say), and maybe a db by replacing your old coax,
etc., that's 6 db

> -- a huge advantage.
>
> On 1/17/2012 4:15 PM, Alan Bloom wrote:
> > Interesting experiment Dave. I think that kind of test is valid for VHF
> > operation. But on HF it is very rare to hear a signal at a constant
> > level like that.
> >
> > Normally signal strength varies considerably from moment to moment due
> > to fading. Even if the average signal level is right at the noise
> > level, most of the time it will be well above or well below that level.
> > A dB or two increase or decrease will vary the percentage of time the
> > signal is copyable, but only a little. The QRM also varies in signal
> > strength from moment to moment.
> >
> > Of course, louder is always better. But unless you are a big-gun
> > contester, where winning or losing depends on a few extra contacts over
> > the course of the weekend, I think you'd have a hard time noticing a
> > couple dB difference in normal operation.
> >
> > I am just about to order a 2-element SteppIR Yagi. I decided that the
> > extra dB or two of the 3-element model is not worth another $450. :=)
> >
> > Alan N1AL
> >
> >
> > On Tue, 2012-01-17 at 16:52 -0700, David Gilbert wrote:
> >> A power ratio of 3 (1500 watts versus 500 watts) is just under 5 db.
> >> Check out these audio files (CW, though ... not SSB) I generated to see
> >> what kind of impact that can have for readability of signals near the
> >> noise threshold.
> >>
> >> http://www.ab7e.com/weak_signal/mdd.html
> >>
> >> 73,
> >> Dave AB7E
> >>

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Tony Estep

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by k6dgw

On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 6:28 PM, Fred Jensen <[hidden email]> wrote:
>....I've put a little $$ into antennas, which I'm
> pretty sure has made a much bigger difference...
=============
Agreed (I usually agree with Fred). Propagation here was super
frustrating today. Lotsa band noise, and weak signals on 10 and 12. I
blew a couple of hours listening to stations that I wanted to work,
but couldn't call because I wouldn't have been sure what I was hearing
if they did come back. 3 db extra of antenna would have solved
everything.

This thread illustrates something about the anthropology of
Elecrafters that I find fascinating. I'm also a member of a list
devoted to radios that aren't much good for anything but no-code
ragchewing. A conversation like this could never happen there; it
would be like a sudden bunch of posts in some Martian dialect, and the
participants would have no idea what anybody was talking about.

Tony KT0NY

--
http://www.isb.edu/faculty/facultydir.aspx?ddlFaculty=352
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Keith Heimbold

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by Mike K2MK

At the moment, I am spending money on my little beginners antenna farm. I am upgrading my K4KIO Hex beam (and keeping the hex beam for vacation property) to a Steppir 3 element antenna for my small lot station. I haven't bought the KPA500 yet but I am seriously considering transitioning from the Quadra VL1000 but I have not pulled the trigger yet.

I run the Quadra at 110 VAC and it does about 750W on HF. Does that 250W make that much difference I doubt it, but something has still held me back and that is the internal antenna tuner which the Quadra has a pretty weak excuse for one but it still works well enough for my 80 and 40 vertical. Everyone has a reason, I guess. Once the KAT500 comes out I will reassess and most likely make the move.

Keith

Sent from my iPhone please excuse typos

On Jan 17, 2012, at 4:45 PM, "Mike K2MK" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm hoping they skip the middle man and go right for the KPA-1500. Folks
> considering a KW might have been persuaded by the fine reviews and excellent
> integration to jump into the KPA-500. Those desiring the legal limit are
> probably taking a wait and see approach.
>
> 73,
> Mike K2MK
>
>
> alsopb wrote
>>
>> It's been stated here that the difference between 1500W and 500W is
>> mostly unimportant. Most views are going from about 100 w to 500 W.
>>
>> Here is another view based up the past 15 days of operation with a
>> KPA-500. The previously 1500 watts was used with identical antennas.
>>
>> I chase DX and specifically the DX Marathon award where you try to work
>> as many countries as possible each year. Yes I can still work stations
>> but the net effect is:
>>
>> 1) You won't work everything you used to
>> 2) It takes longer to work them
>> 3) SSB pileup cracking is more difficult
>> 4) RTTY pileups are more difficult still.
>>
>> Frustration.
>>
>> It hasn't been a complete wash. I've managed 174 countries/40 zones
>> with the KPA-500 BUT GETTING THERE WAS A LOT MORE DIFFICULT than Jan.
>> 2011.
>>
>> The above isn't unexpected.
>>
>> Bring on a KPA-1000.
>>
>> 73 de Brian/K3KO
>>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/KPA500-another-view-tp7198413p7198652.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
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Johnny Siu

KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by Vic Rosenthal

Hello Vic.

I agree with you that every dB does count in marginally situation. Over 90% of hams in Hong Kong live in high rise multi-storey apartments. Antenna on the roof is always not allowed by local regulations. I am only using hamstick horizontally mounted on the window frame. In this situation, I sold my ICPW-1 in exchange for a KPA500 because I have never had the chance to run the PW1 at full 1kw.

There are situations where improvement in antenna is nearly impossible. Then a few more dB power is really necessary. The official power output of KPA500 is 500 w but I find it can easily work at some 600w SSB without any difficulties.

TNX & 73,

Johnny VR2XMC

________________________________
從︰ Vic K2VCO <[hidden email]>
收件人︰ Elecraft Reflector <[hidden email]>
傳送日期︰ 2012年01月18日 (週三) 8:53 AM
主題︰ Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 (another view)

It isn't really a question of what's more important. Of course if you don't call on the
right frequency you won't get through even with 5 kW. It's about what happens "other
things being equal" in poor conditions, near the noise level or in a pileup.

On 1/17/2012 4:30 PM, Alan Bloom wrote:

--
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/

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Johnny Siu

KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by Keith Heimbold

Hello Keith,

I consider Quadra is a very good ampliifer. It is a keeper unless you want to trade it in order to release some cash for yourself. Or, you are looking for something portable. The design of Quadra is very mature and more sophiciated.

TNX & 73,

Johnny VR2XMC

________________________________
從︰ Keith Heimbold <[hidden email]>
收件人︰ Mike K2MK <[hidden email]>
副本(CC)︰ "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
傳送日期︰ 2012年01月18日 (週三) 9:05 AM
主題︰ Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 (another view)

At the moment, I am spending money on my little beginners antenna farm. I am upgrading my K4KIO Hex beam (and keeping the hex beam for vacation property) to a Steppir 3 element antenna for my small lot station. I haven't bought the KPA500 yet but I am seriously considering transitioning from the Quadra VL1000 but I have not pulled the trigger yet.

I run the Quadra at 110 VAC and it does about 750W on HF. Does that 250W make that much difference I doubt it, but something has still held me back and that is the internal antenna tuner which the Quadra has a pretty weak excuse for one but it still works well enough for my 80 and 40 vertical. Everyone has a reason, I guess. Once the KAT500 comes out I will reassess and most likely make the move.

Keith

Sent from my iPhone please excuse typos

On Jan 17, 2012, at 4:45 PM, "Mike K2MK" <[hidden email]> wrote:

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alsopb

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by Mike K2MK

The other point about "desktop db" is that repair is a heck of a lot easier.
No antenna parties, climbing and dealing with the elements.
Having an amp like a KPA1500 which one can fix helps keep those db's on
the air.

I've seen many ham stations with inoperative antennas that eventually
lead to QRT rather than repair.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 1/17/2012 7:45 PM, Mike K2MK wrote:

> I'm hoping they skip the middle man and go right for the KPA-1500. Folks
> considering a KW might have been persuaded by the fine reviews and excellent
> integration to jump into the KPA-500. Those desiring the legal limit are
> probably taking a wait and see approach.
>
> 73,
> Mike K2MK
>
>
> alsopb wrote
>
>> It's been stated here that the difference between 1500W and 500W is
>> mostly unimportant. Most views are going from about 100 w to 500 W.
>>
>> Here is another view based up the past 15 days of operation with a
>> KPA-500. The previously 1500 watts was used with identical antennas.
>>
>> I chase DX and specifically the DX Marathon award where you try to work
>> as many countries as possible each year. Yes I can still work stations
>> but the net effect is:
>>
>> 1) You won't work everything you used to
>> 2) It takes longer to work them
>> 3) SSB pileup cracking is more difficult
>> 4) RTTY pileups are more difficult still.
>>
>> Frustration.
>>
>> It hasn't been a complete wash. I've managed 174 countries/40 zones
>> with the KPA-500 BUT GETTING THERE WAS A LOT MORE DIFFICULT than Jan.
>> 2011.
>>
>> The above isn't unexpected.
>>
>> Bring on a KPA-1000.
>>
>> 73 de Brian/K3KO
>>
>>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/KPA500-another-view-tp7198413p7198652.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
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>

Buddy Brannan

Re: KPA500 (another view)

The only real problem with amp over antennas is that an amp only helps in one direction. Better antennas help both ways :)

And what about alligator stations? You know, big mouth, little ears?

In my getting to be 25 years on the air, I've never had an amp. Never seen a need for one. Maybe it's just that I "don't know what I'm missing". Of course, I also have never had a yogi or quad or any other sort of directional antennas, living on small city lots or in apartments. I'd personally rather sink money into antennas, myself.

It's all good though. You say potato and all that…
--
Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY

On Jan 17, 2012, at 8:43 PM, briana wrote:

> The other point about "desktop db" is that repair is a heck of a lot easier.
> No antenna parties, climbing and dealing with the elements.
> Having an amp like a KPA1500 which one can fix helps keep those db's on
> the air.
>
> I've seen many ham stations with inoperative antennas that eventually
> lead to QRT rather than repair.
>
> 73 de Brian/K3KO
>
>
> On 1/17/2012 7:45 PM, Mike K2MK wrote:
>> I'm hoping they skip the middle man and go right for the KPA-1500. Folks
>> considering a KW might have been persuaded by the fine reviews and excellent
>> integration to jump into the KPA-500. Those desiring the legal limit are
>> probably taking a wait and see approach.
>>
>> 73,
>> Mike K2MK
>>
>>
>> alsopb wrote
>>
>>> It's been stated here that the difference between 1500W and 500W is
>>> mostly unimportant. Most views are going from about 100 w to 500 W.
>>>
>>> Here is another view based up the past 15 days of operation with a
>>> KPA-500. The previously 1500 watts was used with identical antennas.
>>>
>>> I chase DX and specifically the DX Marathon award where you try to work
>>> as many countries as possible each year. Yes I can still work stations
>>> but the net effect is:
>>>
>>> 1) You won't work everything you used to
>>> 2) It takes longer to work them
>>> 3) SSB pileup cracking is more difficult
>>> 4) RTTY pileups are more difficult still.
>>>
>>> Frustration.
>>>
>>> It hasn't been a complete wash. I've managed 174 countries/40 zones
>>> with the KPA-500 BUT GETTING THERE WAS A LOT MORE DIFFICULT than Jan.
>>> 2011.
>>>
>>> The above isn't unexpected.
>>>
>>> Bring on a KPA-1000.
>>>
>>> 73 de Brian/K3KO
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/KPA500-another-view-tp7198413p7198652.html
>> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>>
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>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> Version: 10.0.1416 / Virus Database: 2109/4149 - Release Date: 01/17/12
>>
>>
>>
>
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Keith Heimbold

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by Johnny Siu

Hi Johnny,

My only complaint about the Quadra is the pretty lame internal autotuner and if I sold it I could probably have enough to buy the KPA500 and the KAT500, and maybe have a little left over to put towards a legal limit 6m tube amp. Not sure that math adds up. I am a 6m enthusiast but HF keeps me going in the dry spells (which are plenty especially on the west coast US).

Thanks for the good advice and perspective.

Keith
AG6AZ
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wayne burdick

Re: KPA500 (another view)

Administrator

In reply to this post by Vic Rosenthal

Call me a contrarian, but my biggest thrills have always come from
working Europe with 3 watts to an attic dipole and other under-the-
radar efforts. I'd probably get stage fright if you put me in front of
a KW :)

But that's where Eric comes in. A little ying, a little yang.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

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Byron Servies

Re: KPA500 (another view)

In reply to this post by Tony Estep

Heck, I will be ecstatic when I manage to find the time to finish my
KPA100, other K2 accessories, and trim my pair of 20/15 dipoles and
10m loop!

(living in medium density housing with "as long as we can't see it"
HOA restrictions by the harbor in Santa Cruz, which isn't so bad,
really)

73, Byron N6NUL

On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 6:51 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire <[hidden email]> wrote:
> There are a great many Hams whose budget and circumstances does NOT allow a
> 240V service or huge antenna. They may be renters, living under HOA
> restrictions, or simply have a very small lot. For them, stepping up from
> 100 watts to 500 watts - about the most one can squeeze from a 120 V mains
> outlet - is significant.

--
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2012 Cal QSO Party 6-7 Oct 2012
- www.cqp.org
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