Elecraft

KPA500 mobile?

Classic

List

Threaded

37 messages Options

Mike Smith VE9AA

KPA500 mobile?

Big fan of mobile ham radio here...Have always run 100w.

Would like to do more. (500w-1000w)

Has anyone here ever run a KPA500 mobile? (if so, how? Big inverters to
generate 15a @ 115ac?)

Related question...if you haven't run a KPA500 mobile, what amp HAVE you run
mobile?

Thanks

Mike VE9AA...VE9AA/m

Mike, Coreen & Corey

Keswick Ridge, NB

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

WA2SI

Re: KPA500 mobile?

Yaesu FT-891 w/
HLA 305V @ approx. 200 W.
http://www.rmitaly.com/index.php/en/news/92-news/19487-arrl-review-rm-italy-hla-305v-plus
Vy 73 de Bert
WA2SI

Sent from my android device.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Smith VE9AA <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Fri, 14 Apr 2017 12:00
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 mobile?

Big fan of mobile ham radio here...Have always run 100w.

Would like to do more. (500w-1000w)

Has anyone here ever run a KPA500 mobile? (if so, how? Big inverters to
generate 15a @ 115ac?)

Related question...if you haven't run a KPA500 mobile, what amp HAVE you run
mobile?

Thanks

Mike VE9AA...VE9AA/m

Mike, Coreen & Corey

Keswick Ridge, NB

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Phil Hystad-3

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by Mike Smith VE9AA

Years ago I looked into the idea of running 500 watts mobile and my amp of interest
was the SGC SG-500 SmartPowerCube amplifier. Since the SGC company was just
a 20 minute drive from my home I decided to go there and see if I could find someone
technical to talk to. I did talk with one of the technicians.

What I learned was, most people who use this Amp mobile usually use a second battery to run the amps
current demand of 40 amps with peaks up close to 90 amps for key down full power.
The assumption is that the duty cycle is low enough to allow the Alternator to maintain
charge on the battery simultaneously with providing raw power itself.

The implementation though required heavy duty wiring from the main vehicle battery/alternator
source with diodes in line that are obviously high-current and thus pricey. Also, some vehicles
may have need to upgrade their Alternator although on my 3/4 ton pickup truck, I already had
an oversized alternator in place.

I had my truck wired to handle the current draw and this was done at one of those “car”
electronics shops who do this regularly for guys (usually guys) who want big hunking audio
amps in their cars that also demand high current power. So, this kind of installation was
a regular day at work for that store (called Car Toys, Washington State and maybe other locations).

However, I never did buy the amp — kept putting it off and stayed with 100 watts of power
and eventually (two years ago) opted out of mobile operation in favor of portable operation and
instead of 500 watts, primarily 5 watts or whatever I would put out with my KX1, KX3, and now
KX2 (but have not had the KX2 long enough to work in the field portable).

But, the idea of running the KPA500 because it runs off of 120 VAC is not something I would
ever try just because of the hassle. I would get another suitable 500 watt class amp if I were
still into that and leave my KPA500 fixed in the shack. Not sure if the SGC SG-500 is still
available though, I heard a while back that SGC had stopped production but it still appears on
their web site http://www.sgcworld.com/ampProductPage.html.

73, phil, K7PEH

> On Apr 14, 2017, at 9:00 AM, Mike Smith VE9AA <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Big fan of mobile ham radio here...Have always run 100w.
>
> Would like to do more. (500w-1000w)
>
>
>
> Has anyone here ever run a KPA500 mobile? (if so, how? Big inverters to
> generate 15a @ 115ac?)
>
>
>
> Related question...if you haven't run a KPA500 mobile, what amp HAVE you run
> mobile?
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Mike VE9AA...VE9AA/m
>
>
>
> Mike, Coreen & Corey
>
> Keswick Ridge, NB
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Jim Brown-10

Re: KPA500 mobile?

George Wallner, AA7JV, is a superb engineer and has done a half dozen
DXpeditions to islands around the world. For one of his most recent, he
used SGC amps so that he could run on batteries that were recharged by a
small generator running in Economy mode, greatly reducing the quantity
of fuel that he had to carry on the boat.

Your advice regarding the alternator, battery, and DC wiring is also
quite important.

73, Jim K9YC

On Fri,4/14/2017 9:45 AM, Phil Hystad wrote:
> Not sure if the SGC SG-500 is still
> available though, I heard a while back that SGC had stopped production but it still appears on
> their web sitehttp://www.sgcworld.com/ampProductPage.html.

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Wes Stewart-2

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by Mike Smith VE9AA

Not me personally but my Elmer, the late W7UVR, back in the AM days ran a
high-level modulated 4-1000A.

I've got his QSLs around here someplace, but in the meantime someone else has
posted them too: http://hamgallery.com/qsl/country/USA/Washington/w7uvr.htm

He later converted to SSB, increased the generator to 15KW, had another ham
friend cut up and build beautiful tubular hinges to fold the elements of a
3-element tribander for travel.

The home station was equally impressive, although until Collins introduced their
noise blanker, was primarily used to transmit bulletins or code practice. The
mobile rig was the answer to the noise problem before that.

Wes N7WS

On 4/14/2017 9:00 AM, Mike Smith VE9AA wrote:
> Related question...if you haven't run a KPA500 mobile, what amp HAVE you run
> mobile?

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Elecraft mailing list

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by Phil Hystad-3

Back in the 80's and early 90's, I ran a KW mobile SSB, and never had any negative issues. I used the Hustler Super Resonators (still made and in use by many today), and they are rated at 1KW. I can't remember what automobiles I installed it in, but I remember using a much larger battery, and a larger alternator. Was not a good idea to use it with the car not running!!!!
In fact, I still have the amp in the closet; it is a Magnus MA1000B, ran on 12V (with the car running, 13.4 or so) and used eight, 31003OD Power Transistors. Requires about 60 Watts, for 1000W input.
Dick, K8ZTT

From: Ron D'Eau Claire <[hidden email]>
To: 'Mike Smith VE9AA' <[hidden email]>
Cc: [hidden email]
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2017 11:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 mobile?

One issue with mobile QRO is the antenna. While a mobile whip/loading coil combo can be designed for high power, it becomes difficult to prevent corona discharge from the end of the whip while transmitting at high power.

One fairly common solution decades ago was to mount a copper toilet tank float on the end of the antenna. Of course the wind resistance then required guying the whip. Since it was typically on the rear of the car, a nylon cord from the mid-point to somewhere forward on the roof was common.

Another approach - back when car bodies were steel - was to extend the whip to it could be bent over and tied to the front bumper, turning the car body and whip into a small loop antenna.

Today, it might be hard to establish the necessary distance from the antenna while sitting in the car to meet modern RF exposure limits, especially on 20 meters and up.

I never went QRO in my car, but had buddies who tinkered with it way back when vacuum tubes were "king". Back then I lived in the land of the "California Kilowatt" (Southern Calif.). They mounted outboard generators on their car engines to handle the power demand. Adding filaments, etc., a kW mobile station might require 1.5 or 2 kW of d.c. power to run it. Got a chuckle out of them when they'd key the mic to transmit while sitting at a stop light with the engine at idle, and the sudden added power demand caused the engine to stall.

73, Ron AC7AC

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

briancom

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by WA2SI

In the old days, cars didn't have computers. Getting away with running
a KW worked. Today may be different.

Nobody seems to be concerned about crashing/killing the computer(s)
running the whole car. Could lead to a really dangerous situation.

Don't know what the replacement cost for the motherboard/peripherials of
a car computer system is. My guess: big bucks.

What current experience is there out there?

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 4/14/2017 16:45 PM, Bert Craig wrote:

> Yaesu FT-891 w/
> HLA 305V @ approx. 200 W.
> http://www.rmitaly.com/index.php/en/news/92-news/19487-arrl-review-rm-italy-hla-305v-plus
> Vy 73 de Bert
> WA2SI
>
> Sent from my android device.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mike Smith VE9AA <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Fri, 14 Apr 2017 12:00
> Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 mobile?
>
> Big fan of mobile ham radio here...Have always run 100w.
>
> Would like to do more. (500w-1000w)
>
>
>
> Has anyone here ever run a KPA500 mobile? (if so, how? Big inverters to
> generate 15a @ 115ac?)
>
>
>
> Related question...if you haven't run a KPA500 mobile, what amp HAVE you run
> mobile?
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Mike VE9AA...VE9AA/m
>
>
>
> Mike, Coreen & Corey
>
> Keswick Ridge, NB
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Phil Wheeler-2

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by Phil Hystad-3

And then there's the car's electronics. Some
modern ones don't react well to high power RF. I
had one which didn't like 100 W -- though backing
off to 50 W made all things OK.

Phil W7OX

On 4/14/17 10:27 AM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:

> One issue with mobile QRO is the antenna. While a mobile whip/loading coil combo can be designed for high power, it becomes difficult to prevent corona discharge from the end of the whip while transmitting at high power.
>
> One fairly common solution decades ago was to mount a copper toilet tank float on the end of the antenna. Of course the wind resistance then required guying the whip. Since it was typically on the rear of the car, a nylon cord from the mid-point to somewhere forward on the roof was common.
>
> Another approach - back when car bodies were steel - was to extend the whip to it could be bent over and tied to the front bumper, turning the car body and whip into a small loop antenna.
>
> Today, it might be hard to establish the necessary distance from the antenna while sitting in the car to meet modern RF exposure limits, especially on 20 meters and up.
>
> I never went QRO in my car, but had buddies who tinkered with it way back when vacuum tubes were "king". Back then I lived in the land of the "California Kilowatt" (Southern Calif.). They mounted outboard generators on their car engines to handle the power demand. Adding filaments, etc., a kW mobile station might require 1.5 or 2 kW of d.c. power to run it. Got a chuckle out of them when they'd key the mic to transmit while sitting at a stop light with the engine at idle, and the sudden added power demand caused the engine to stall.
>
> 73, Ron AC7AC

k6dgw

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by briancom

I had a 100W HF mobile in a Ford Ranger in early 2001. Transmitting
would disable the cruise control if it was on. I gave the truck to #1
grandson when I bought a 2003 Silverado [he promptly rolled the Ranger
[:-(( ].

The computer that operated the driver's seat exceeded the capacity/speed
of the computer that got us to the moon by an order of magnitude or more
and it was one of a dozen or so in the truck. I put a 25 watt UHF FM rig
in it, and the first time I transmitted, the seat computer lost its mind
and pinned me to the steering wheel. $380 later, that was fixed and I
resorted to an HT in the truck.

I wouldn't put 500 watts in today's vehicles.

73,

Fred ("Skip") K6DGW
Sparks NV USA
Washoe County DM09dn

On 4/14/2017 11:58 AM, brian wrote:

> In the old days, cars didn't have computers. Getting away with
> running a KW worked. Today may be different.
>
> Nobody seems to be concerned about crashing/killing the computer(s)
> running the whole car. Could lead to a really dangerous situation.
>
> Don't know what the replacement cost for the motherboard/peripherials
> of a car computer system is. My guess: big bucks.
>
> What current experience is there out there?
>
> 73 de Brian/K3KO
>
>
>
>
> On 4/14/2017 16:45 PM, Bert Craig wrote:
>> Yaesu FT-891 w/
>> HLA 305V @ approx. 200 W.
>> http://www.rmitaly.com/index.php/en/news/92-news/19487-arrl-review-rm-italy-hla-305v-plus
>>
>> Vy 73 de Bert
>> WA2SI
>>
>> Sent from my android device.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Mike Smith VE9AA <[hidden email]>
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Sent: Fri, 14 Apr 2017 12:00
>> Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 mobile?
>>
>> Big fan of mobile ham radio here...Have always run 100w.
>>
>> Would like to do more. (500w-1000w)
>>
>>
>>
>> Has anyone here ever run a KPA500 mobile? (if so, how? Big inverters to
>> generate 15a @ 115ac?)
>>
>>
>>
>> Related question...if you haven't run a KPA500 mobile, what amp HAVE
>> you run
>> mobile?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>>
>> Mike VE9AA...VE9AA/m
>>
>>
>>
>> Mike, Coreen & Corey
>>
>> Keswick Ridge, NB
>>
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> http://www.avg.com
>
>

Tim Seed

Re: KPA500 mobile?

On the same vane,

My 2005, Range Rover would lock and unlock (repeat….) when I transmitted on 20M - other bands it was fine.

I was running 50W - totally separate 12V Truck battery , not connected to the Range Rover. Antenna 1:1

Enjoy the ride !

Regards

Tim
A45wg

> On Apr 14, 2017, at 11:12 PM, Fred Jensen <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I had a 100W HF mobile in a Ford Ranger in early 2001. Transmitting would disable the cruise control if it was on. I gave the truck to #1 grandson when I bought a 2003 Silverado [he promptly rolled the Ranger [:-(( ].
>
> The computer that operated the driver's seat exceeded the capacity/speed of the computer that got us to the moon by an order of magnitude or more and it was one of a dozen or so in the truck. I put a 25 watt UHF FM rig in it, and the first time I transmitted, the seat computer lost its mind and pinned me to the steering wheel. $380 later, that was fixed and I resorted to an HT in the truck.
>
> I wouldn't put 500 watts in today's vehicles.
>
> 73,
>
> Fred ("Skip") K6DGW
> Sparks NV USA
> Washoe County DM09dn
>
>
>
> On 4/14/2017 11:58 AM, brian wrote:
>> In the old days, cars didn't have computers. Getting away with running a KW worked. Today may be different.
>>
>> Nobody seems to be concerned about crashing/killing the computer(s) running the whole car. Could lead to a really dangerous situation.
>>
>> Don't know what the replacement cost for the motherboard/peripherials of a car computer system is. My guess: big bucks.
>>
>> What current experience is there out there?
>>
>> 73 de Brian/K3KO
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 4/14/2017 16:45 PM, Bert Craig wrote:
>>> Yaesu FT-891 w/
>>> HLA 305V @ approx. 200 W.
>>> http://www.rmitaly.com/index.php/en/news/92-news/19487-arrl-review-rm-italy-hla-305v-plus
>>> Vy 73 de Bert
>>> WA2SI
>>>
>>> Sent from my android device.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Mike Smith VE9AA <[hidden email]>
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Sent: Fri, 14 Apr 2017 12:00
>>> Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 mobile?
>>>
>>> Big fan of mobile ham radio here...Have always run 100w.
>>>
>>> Would like to do more. (500w-1000w)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Has anyone here ever run a KPA500 mobile? (if so, how? Big inverters to
>>> generate 15a @ 115ac?)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Related question...if you haven't run a KPA500 mobile, what amp HAVE you run
>>> mobile?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mike VE9AA...VE9AA/m
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mike, Coreen & Corey
>>>
>>> Keswick Ridge, NB
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>> http://www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/>
>>
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft>
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
> Post: mailto:[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
> Message delivered to [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>

Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT-2

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by Phil Wheeler-2

A few days ago we talked about the RF exposure rules related to Amateur
Radio, and how we all had to sign that we complied with those rules when
we renew our tickets.

I wonder if the exposure to passing cars is below the limit with a
Hustler or similar antenna on the rear bumper?

Are we good at 100w, 1000w?

Should I have not asked this question?

73 -- Lynn

On 4/14/2017 12:05 PM, Phil Wheeler wrote:
> And then there's the car's electronics. Some modern ones don't react
> well to high power RF. I had one which didn't like 100 W -- though
> backing off to 50 W made all things OK.
>
> Phil W7OX
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

David Olean

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by Mike Smith VE9AA

Hi Mike

I am running the KPA-500 now on battery power. It isn't mobile, but
it could be with the same hardware. The method I use is a 115 volt AC
inverter that runs off a 12 volt battery. I use the Xantrex Prosine Pure
Sine Wave 1800 watt inverter.

https://www.amazon.com/Xantrex-Technologies-1800PS-1800-Watt/dp/B0000225DC

This unit is crystal controlled and does not generate much RFI at all.
It does require huge input wiring and some substantial battery capacity.
I see 75+ amps on CW peaks, and to keep the regulation OK, the stranded
wire is about 3/4" in diameter and very short between the battery and
the inverter. I also have a 200 amp safety fuse in line as well. It has
worked great with two 275 AH solar batteries and you would not even know
you were running on batteries. The output of the sinewave inverter is
quite solid at around 117 vac. It has been in use for a few years. No
problems. I would run two moosey batteries besides the auto battery and
install a new alternator in your vehicle for charging the batteries. I
use solar panels here for charging, and on a sunny day see about 25 amps
charging the batteries between transmissions. I can run all day on a
sunny day, and about 10 or maybe 12 hours casual operating at night with
just the batteries. It is pricey, but cool. I use the KPA-500 on six
meters too and have been able to catch openings and work plenty of DX
with the solar power.

Dave K1WHS

On 4/14/2017 4:00 PM, Mike Smith VE9AA wrote:

> Big fan of mobile ham radio here...Have always run 100w.
>
> Would like to do more. (500w-1000w)
>
>
>
> Has anyone here ever run a KPA500 mobile? (if so, how? Big inverters to
> generate 15a @ 115ac?)
>
>
>
> Related question...if you haven't run a KPA500 mobile, what amp HAVE you run
> mobile?
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Mike VE9AA...VE9AA/m
>
>
>
> Mike, Coreen & Corey
>
> Keswick Ridge, NB
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

KENT TRIMBLE

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT-2

The assumption has always been that the driver and passengers are riding
inside a Faraday Cage and therefore are safe from RF radiated by an HF
antenna, regardless of where located and regardless of power level. The
truth of that assumption, coupled with how much shielding a vehicle
actually presents, is worth considering. Until the RF Exposure business
came along, no one considered safety for those outside the car.

Less and less body-metal, roofs made entirely of glass, more electronics
both on and inside human bodies (over and above the vehicle's
electronics), the close proximity of the antenna . . . all of which, in
my opinion, argue for a re-think of high-power mobile operation.

In the 1970s I greatly enjoyed mobile CW with an FT-101E until my first
child started occupying the rear seat. After she came along, I opted
for no further mobile work of any kind, at least when she and her
siblings were in the car. I'm not a geneticist, but neither am I
willing to push my luck with the gazillion of cell-divisions going on
every second in a child's growing body.

Excellent question to ask, Lynn.

73,

Kent K9ZTV

On 4/14/2017 2:39 PM, Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT wrote:

> A few days ago we talked about the RF exposure rules related to
> Amateur Radio, and how we all had to sign that we complied with those
> rules when we renew our tickets.
>
> I wonder if the exposure to passing cars is below the limit with a
> Hustler or similar antenna on the rear bumper?
>
> Are we good at 100w, 1000w?
>
> Should I have not asked this question?
>
> 73 -- Lynn
>

Jim Brown-10

Re: KPA500 mobile?

On Fri,4/14/2017 1:13 PM, KENT TRIMBLE wrote:
> The assumption has always been that the driver and passengers are
> riding inside a Faraday Cage

There are HUGE holes in that assumption in the form of non-metallic
parts and paint preventing contact between metal parts. An enclosure
forms a Faraday cage ONLY if it is continuous. and ONLY if all
conductors penetrating it have either a feed-through to the enclosure
or, if a shielded conductor, the shield is bonded to the enclosure at
the point of entry.

Modern vehicles have lots of paint between metal parts. When I used
Hamsticks on my Volvo S80, I had to bond the mount to the trunk, and I
had to bond around the trunk hinges.

73, Jim K9YC

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

KENT TRIMBLE

Re: KPA500 mobile?

Hi Jim . . .

That was my point, although without mentioning the paint.

I should have said "worth RE-considering."

Kent

On 4/14/2017 3:33 PM, Jim Brown wrote:

> On Fri,4/14/2017 1:13 PM, KENT TRIMBLE wrote:
>> The assumption has always been that the driver and passengers are
>> riding inside a Faraday Cage
>
> There are HUGE holes in that assumption in the form of non-metallic
> parts and paint preventing contact between metal parts. An enclosure
> forms a Faraday cage ONLY if it is continuous. and ONLY if all
> conductors penetrating it have either a feed-through to the enclosure
> or, if a shielded conductor, the shield is bonded to the enclosure at
> the point of entry.
>
> Modern vehicles have lots of paint between metal parts. When I used
> Hamsticks on my Volvo S80, I had to bond the mount to the trunk, and I
> had to bond around the trunk hinges.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2016.0.8012 / Virus Database: 4769/14314 - Release Date:
> 04/14/17
>
>

Phil Kane-2

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by KENT TRIMBLE

On 4/14/2017 1:13 PM, KENT TRIMBLE wrote:

> The assumption has always been that the driver and passengers are riding
> inside a Faraday Cage and therefore are safe from RF radiated by an HF
> antenna, regardless of where located and regardless of power level.

When I take my 2011 Ford Focus through the car wash, I put the mag-mount
VHF antenna inside the car but it is still connected to the radio. I
have no problem picking up the usual 2- and 3/4- meter repeaters that
way. So much for the "Faraday Cage". :)

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
Elecraft K2/100 s/n 5402

From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest
Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Wes Stewart-2

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

I am reminded of when I (actually my employer and you taxpayers) bought a
shielded room to enclose "my" RF laboratory. This was modular, 16' x 20' x 10'
and composed of 2" thick particle board, clad on both sides with tin-plated
sheet steel. Because I needed to be able to move a rack mounted test position
with a table top in and out, I specified a four-foot wide door.

The door was constructed similarly with a brass frame around the door and was
prehung in a brass jam and massive hinges. It was installed using a forklift to
position it while the fasteners were tightened. The jam had a continuous
channel around the periphery that housed a double row of beryllium-copper finger
stock backed up by conductive foam. The door frame had a brass "knife-edge"
around the periphery that drove into and was pinched by the finger stock in the
jam.

On of the specs that I remember was 120 dB of isolation at 10 Ghz. We measured
this by setting up a source with a horn antenna on a tripod outside the room
with another horn and LNA into a spectrum analyzer inside the room. We
normalized the path with the door open and the horns aligned and then closed the
door and measured the difference. It made 120 dB, but just barely; this is not
a trivial achievement.

To drive home the necessity of maintenance, the vendor engineer said, "Watch
this." He took a dollar bill out of his wallet and laid it across the finger
stock and then closed the door. I don't remember the exact number but it was
yuge; the attenuation went down 30 or 40 dB just from breaking the connection of
the knife edge with the finger stock over the width of a dollar bill. (For what
this room cost, he should have been using a c-note.)

Wes N7WS

On 4/14/2017 1:33 PM, Jim Brown wrote:

> On Fri,4/14/2017 1:13 PM, KENT TRIMBLE wrote:
>> The assumption has always been that the driver and passengers are riding
>> inside a Faraday Cage
>
> There are HUGE holes in that assumption in the form of non-metallic parts and
> paint preventing contact between metal parts. An enclosure forms a Faraday
> cage ONLY if it is continuous. and ONLY if all conductors penetrating it have
> either a feed-through to the enclosure or, if a shielded conductor, the shield
> is bonded to the enclosure at the point of entry.
>
> Modern vehicles have lots of paint between metal parts. When I used Hamsticks
> on my Volvo S80, I had to bond the mount to the trunk, and I had to bond
> around the trunk hinges.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Clay Autery

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT-2

I suspect that the dwell time would be small enough for most folks you
crossed paths with that you'd probably be safe (need to do the math anyway).

For cars going the same direction as you, you as the control operator,
have to make sure you don't irradiate anyone else around you beyond the
limits....

Besides installation accommodations, you can control exposure by
manually maintaining a sufficient "bubble" around you during
transmission (extended transmission... whatever the math tells you.

I don't have a feel for where we are generally "safe" mobile... For
myself, I would have to do an actual test as installed and
measure/observe and plot.

Another excellent question.... of course you should ask.

Not a trivial engineering task IF you want to do it correctly. :)

______________________
Clay Autery, KY5G
MONTAC Enterprises
(318) 518-1389

On 4/14/2017 2:39 PM, Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT wrote:
> I wonder if the exposure to passing cars is below the limit with a
> Hustler or similar antenna on the rear bumper?
>
> Are we good at 100w, 1000w?
>
> Should I have not asked this question?

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

k6mkf

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by k6dgw

I wonder what would happen if a mobile KW station keyed up beside one of these experimental driverless cars?

And I wonder how well the electronics in these cars are protected from RFI?

-- Mike Flowers, K6MKF, NCDXC - "It's about DX!"

> On Apr 14, 2017, at 12:12 PM, Fred Jensen <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I had a 100W HF mobile in a Ford Ranger in early 2001. Transmitting would disable the cruise control if it was on. I gave the truck to #1 grandson when I bought a 2003 Silverado [he promptly rolled the Ranger [:-(( ].
>
> The computer that operated the driver's seat exceeded the capacity/speed of the computer that got us to the moon by an order of magnitude or more and it was one of a dozen or so in the truck. I put a 25 watt UHF FM rig in it, and the first time I transmitted, the seat computer lost its mind and pinned me to the steering wheel. $380 later, that was fixed and I resorted to an HT in the truck.
>
> I wouldn't put 500 watts in today's vehicles.
>
> 73,
>
> Fred ("Skip") K6DGW
> Sparks NV USA
> Washoe County DM09dn
>
>
>
>> On 4/14/2017 11:58 AM, brian wrote:
>> In the old days, cars didn't have computers. Getting away with running a KW worked. Today may be different.
>>
>> Nobody seems to be concerned about crashing/killing the computer(s) running the whole car. Could lead to a really dangerous situation.
>>
>> Don't know what the replacement cost for the motherboard/peripherials of a car computer system is. My guess: big bucks.
>>
>> What current experience is there out there?
>>
>> 73 de Brian/K3KO
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On 4/14/2017 16:45 PM, Bert Craig wrote:
>>> Yaesu FT-891 w/
>>> HLA 305V @ approx. 200 W.
>>> http://www.rmitaly.com/index.php/en/news/92-news/19487-arrl-review-rm-italy-hla-305v-plus
>>> Vy 73 de Bert
>>> WA2SI
>>>
>>> Sent from my android device.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Mike Smith VE9AA <[hidden email]>
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Sent: Fri, 14 Apr 2017 12:00
>>> Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 mobile?
>>>
>>> Big fan of mobile ham radio here...Have always run 100w.
>>>
>>> Would like to do more. (500w-1000w)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Has anyone here ever run a KPA500 mobile? (if so, how? Big inverters to
>>> generate 15a @ 115ac?)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Related question...if you haven't run a KPA500 mobile, what amp HAVE you run
>>> mobile?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mike VE9AA...VE9AA/m
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mike, Coreen & Corey
>>>
>>> Keswick Ridge, NB
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>> http://www.avg.com
>>
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

k6dgw

Re: KPA500 mobile?

In reply to this post by Phil Kane-2

Semi-related curiosity regarding shielding. My wife's car has Sirius/XM
radio. It usually loses contact with the satellite driving under
Interstate bridges and the like. Likewise in the garage. OTOH, at our
previous home there was a tunnel through a small hill, perhaps 1/4 mi
long. The XM worked fine through it. There are a pair of tunnels at
Cave Rock next to Lake Tahoe through a granite mountain. XM works fine
through them too. Anyone know why?

73,

Fred ("Skip") K6DGW
Sparks NV USA
Washoe County DM09dn

On 4/14/2017 2:50 PM, Phil Kane wrote:

> On 4/14/2017 1:13 PM, KENT TRIMBLE wrote:
>
>> The assumption has always been that the driver and passengers are riding
>> inside a Faraday Cage and therefore are safe from RF radiated by an HF
>> antenna, regardless of where located and regardless of power level.
> When I take my 2011 Ford Focus through the car wash, I put the mag-mount
> VHF antenna inside the car but it is still connected to the radio. I
> have no problem picking up the usual 2- and 3/4- meter repeaters that
> way. So much for the "Faraday Cage". :)
>
> 73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
> Elecraft K2/100 s/n 5402
>