Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

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Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Chris Hallinan
I just opened the box.  Can't wait to dive in.  I decided to buy the kit so
I'd know how it goes together and be more comfortable with upgrades later
down the road.  Already saving for the P3 and then the KPA500!

I've been reading the list for the past week or so, and learned much about
the rig from the discussions here.

From some reading, I've heard that an external interface isn't required for
the digital modes?  Not sure about that.  Wonder what others are using for
external interface for digital modes?  I had a SignalLink USB at one point
and it worked quite well.

Thanks,

Chris
K1AY
Punta Gorda, FL

--
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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

KEN-3

> On Dec 18, 2014, at 8:56 PM, Chris Hallinan <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> From some reading, I've heard that an external interface isn't required for
> the digital modes?  Not sure about that.  Wonder what others are using for
> external interface for digital modes?  I had a SignalLink USB at one point
> and it worked quite well.


Chris,

One can, at least in theory, get by with feeding the audio directly between the K3 and the computer.  However, from what I’ve read, adjustment is very sensistive and it is more susceptible to hum , RF pickup, etc.  And you have to deal with how your computer handles the audio (mixers, audio enhancement, etc.)    The SignaLink is a good, simple, reliable interface, well worth it IMO.

Have fun and good luck with your construction.

Ken WA8JXM

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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

NK7Z
Hi,
I used to use a Rigblaster on my old Icom, I got the K3, and after
asking was told no need...  I reluctantly connected everything, and it
works just fine with out an interface...  No hum, everything works very
well...  I have no wires coming out the front of the rig, nor to I have
to rewire for mode changes...  I am totally happy with teh lack of an
interface...  

Do download everything K9YC has published and read it...  
--
Thanks and 73's,
For equipment, and software setups and reviews see:
www.nk7z.net
for MixW support see;
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mixw/info
for Dopplergram information see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/dopplergram/info
for MM-SSTV see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/MM-SSTV/info


On Thu, 2014-12-18 at 21:15 -0800, Walter Underwood wrote:

> The Signalink is noisy and the VOX is not needed because you can use the KX3 VOX.
>
> I highly recommend reading K9YC’s short paper on audio interfacing. He knows more about this stuff than I ever will.
>
> http://audiosystemsgroup.com/USB_Interfaces.pdf
>
> wunder
> K6WRU
> CM87wj
> http://observer.wunderwood.org/
>
> On Dec 18, 2014, at 6:19 PM, Ken <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> >
> >> On Dec 18, 2014, at 8:56 PM, Chris Hallinan <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >>
> >> From some reading, I've heard that an external interface isn't required for
> >> the digital modes?  Not sure about that.  Wonder what others are using for
> >> external interface for digital modes?  I had a SignalLink USB at one point
> >> and it worked quite well.
> >
> >
> > Chris,
> >
> > One can, at least in theory, get by with feeding the audio directly between the K3 and the computer.  However, from what I’ve read, adjustment is very sensistive and it is more susceptible to hum , RF pickup, etc.  And you have to deal with how your computer handles the audio (mixers, audio enhancement, etc.)    The SignaLink is a good, simple, reliable interface, well worth it IMO.
> >
> > Have fun and good luck with your construction.
> >
> > Ken WA8JXM
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > Message delivered to [hidden email]
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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Edward R Cole
In reply to this post by Chris Hallinan
Our little border collie used to go "nuts!" if a "brown truck" came
into the neighborhood.  Sadly she passed in 2009 but now we have a
"not-little" German Shepherd-mix that goes "nuts" if any vehicle
drives down "her road" :-D

Re: use of the K3 with computer for digital modes.  I have never of
heard your complaints on the K3.  I have mine directly connected with
RS audio cables (with 2.5mm connectors) and the K3 USB/RS232 cable
for control of PTT and keying.  I've no problem with hum or
difficulty setting levels.  I pre-set my K3 Line-in at 10.  I use two
different soundcards: emu0202 and Delta-44.
http://www.kl7uw.com/station%20layout.htm

The automatic mode shift by memory channels is very nice.  I use the
Frequency Memory Editor to set up my favorite digital frequencies
(once) and forget.  I use DATA-A for this since I am running
soundcard sw on my computer (WSJT, WSPR, FLdigi).

73, Ed - KL7UW
http://www.kl7uw.com
     "Kits made by KL7UW"
Dubus Mag business:
     [hidden email]

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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Jim Brown-10
In reply to this post by Chris Hallinan
On Thu,12/18/2014 5:56 PM, Chris Hallinan wrote:
> Wonder what others are using for
> external interface for digital modes?

Here's my advice. http://k9yc.com/USB_Interfaces.pdf

73, Jim K9YC


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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Joel Black-2
In reply to this post by KEN-3
Definitely use some type of external sound card. In this day and age and all the admonishments to not do so, I *still* hear Windows sounds over the air when using the “default” sound card.

If you spend just a few dollars more (you’ve already bought the K3, don’t scrimp on the interface), you can buy something much nicer than the SLUSB. I use the Creative Labs EMU 0204 and have posted here how well it hears regularly. The EMU is no longer available new, but they crop up for sale every once in a while on the used market. As a matter of fact, there is a used one for sale on qrz.com <http://qrz.com/> (http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?461417-E-MU-0204-Soundcard-Unit <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?461417-E-MU-0204-Soundcard-Unit>). This one is not mine nor do I know the ham who is selling it. As in all other money exchanges, caveat emptor.

I am sure Jim will weigh in on this. As Walter said, listen to what Jim says about the subject. He even has a paper on the subject that is easy to read and understand.

Good luck with whichever interface you choose. Maybe I’ll see your trace on the waterfall soon.

73,
Joel - W4JBB


> On Dec 18, 2014, at 11:15 PM, Walter Underwood <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> The Signalink is noisy and the VOX is not needed because you can use the KX3 VOX.
>
> I highly recommend reading K9YC’s short paper on audio interfacing. He knows more about this stuff than I ever will.
>
> http://audiosystemsgroup.com/USB_Interfaces.pdf
>
> wunder
> K6WRU
> CM87wj
> http://observer.wunderwood.org/
>

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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Chris Hallinan
Thanks to all for the great info, and esp. Walter and others who suggested
the reading material from Jim, K9WC, I'll make that a priority to digest.
I hadn't thought about the PC sounds, so given the way I operate, I'll
probably opt for the external sound card.  I love my PC sounds, and have
custom sounds for lots of events, including the band edge alerts, and
sounds from other programs that I usually have open when I operate. I'm so
silly with my sounds I have a 4-port mixer here in the shack that I pipe
everything into to drive a pair of old speakers.  Looking forward to
experiencing whatever stereo effects are offered in the K3 using that setup!

(Hint: Feature request: Stereo CW where the center of the passband is in
the "middle", with lower freqs going left, and higher freqs going right...)
;)

I started the build last night, looks like I'll be done in one or two more
evenings.

See you all on the air!!

Thanks again,

Chris
K1AY
Punta Gorda, FL

On Fri, Dec 19, 2014 at 5:52 AM, Joel Black <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Definitely use some type of external sound card. In this day and age and
> all the admonishments to not do so, I *still* hear Windows sounds over the
> air when using the "default" sound card.
>
> If you spend just a few dollars more (you've already bought the K3, don't
> scrimp on the interface), you can buy something much nicer than the SLUSB.
> I use the Creative Labs EMU 0204 and have posted here how well it hears
> regularly. The EMU is no longer available new, but they crop up for sale
> every once in a while on the used market. As a matter of fact, there is a
> used one for sale on qrz.com <http://qrz.com/> (
> http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?461417-E-MU-0204-Soundcard-Unit <
> http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?461417-E-MU-0204-Soundcard-Unit>).
> This one is not mine nor do I know the ham who is selling it. As in all
> other money exchanges, caveat emptor.
>
> I am sure Jim will weigh in on this. As Walter said, listen to what Jim
> says about the subject. He even has a paper on the subject that is easy to
> read and understand.
>
> Good luck with whichever interface you choose. Maybe I'll see your trace
> on the waterfall soon.
>
> 73,
> Joel - W4JBB
>
>
> > On Dec 18, 2014, at 11:15 PM, Walter Underwood <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >
> > The Signalink is noisy and the VOX is not needed because you can use the
> KX3 VOX.
> >
> > I highly recommend reading K9YC's short paper on audio interfacing. He
> knows more about this stuff than I ever will.
> >
> > http://audiosystemsgroup.com/USB_Interfaces.pdf
> >
> > wunder
> > K6WRU
> > CM87wj
> > http://observer.wunderwood.org/
> >
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>
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> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>


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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Don Wilhelm-4
In reply to this post by Chris Hallinan
Chris,

A good quality external soundcard will do much better than the SignaLink
(the Signalink noise floor is poor and is only a single audio channel).

The K3 has galvanic isolation (transformers) built into the Line In and
Line Out lines.
Jim Brown K9YC has recommended a Tascam soundcard as a good and
relatively inexpensive one.  You might also want to read Jim's
information on bonding equipment.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 12/18/2014 8:56 PM, Chris Hallinan wrote:
> >From some reading, I've heard that an external interface isn't required for
> the digital modes?  Not sure about that.  Wonder what others are using for
> external interface for digital modes?  I had a SignalLink USB at one point
> and it worked quite well.
>
>

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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Mike K2MK
In reply to this post by Chris Hallinan
Hi Chris,

I've been going direct for digital modes for years with my K3 and never had a problem even at legal limit. If you like your PC sounds and don't want to turn them off when you operate digital you only need a small under $10 USB audio adapter. I'm using this one:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001MSS6CS/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It has its own identification on the Windows sound control panel so when you set up your K3 to take sounds from your PC you just identify this device as the source. That lets you set the level independent of your normal PC sounds. I still feed audio from the K3 directly into the PC. I think there is a minor problem with this particular audio adapter as it wants to be a monaural microphone input device rather than a stereo line input device. But there are many similar devices on Amazon to choose from.

73,
Mike K2MK


Chris Hallinan wrote
I just opened the box.  Can't wait to dive in.  I decided to buy the kit so
I'd know how it goes together and be more comfortable with upgrades later
down the road.  Already saving for the P3 and then the KPA500!

I've been reading the list for the past week or so, and learned much about
the rig from the discussions here.

From some reading, I've heard that an external interface isn't required for
the digital modes?  Not sure about that.  Wonder what others are using for
external interface for digital modes?  I had a SignalLink USB at one point
and it worked quite well.

Thanks,
Chris
K1AY
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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Bill Frantz
In reply to this post by Chris Hallinan
My computer's (MacBook Pro) sound system doesn't support
bi-directional sound. I have used a SignaLink for several years
now and been happy with it. I do intend to get a higher quality
interface to see if I can decode weaker signals.

I operated using the K3's VOX for several years. My normal way
of operating is to look for signals on the P3, switch to their
mode, and copy them. I got tired of having to turn VOX off in
the voice modes and then back on for PC digital and built a
cable which connected the VOX line from the SignaLink to the K3.
Now changing modes is just switching modes on the K3 and getting
the right program's window to the front on the computer. I only
wish my KX3 changed between PC digital and voice modes as easily.

On 12/18/14 at 9:15 PM, [hidden email] (Walter Underwood) wrote:

>The Signalink is noisy and the VOX is not needed because you can use the KX3 VOX.

73 Bill AE6JV

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill Frantz        | The first thing you need when  | Periwinkle
(408)356-8506      | using a perimeter defense is a | 16345
Englewood Ave
www.pwpconsult.com | perimeter.                     | Los Gatos,
CA 95032

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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Chris Hallinan
Hi Bill,

Thanks for the info.  Are you using your Macbook Pro native for digital
modes?  If so, what software are you using?

-Chris

On Fri, Dec 19, 2014 at 9:58 AM, Bill Frantz <[hidden email]> wrote:

> My computer's (MacBook Pro) sound system doesn't support bi-directional
> sound. I have used a SignaLink for several years now and been happy with
> it. I do intend to get a higher quality interface to see if I can decode
> weaker signals.
>
> I operated using the K3's VOX for several years. My normal way of
> operating is to look for signals on the P3, switch to their mode, and copy
> them. I got tired of having to turn VOX off in the voice modes and then
> back on for PC digital and built a cable which connected the VOX line from
> the SignaLink to the K3. Now changing modes is just switching modes on the
> K3 and getting the right program's window to the front on the computer. I
> only wish my KX3 changed between PC digital and voice modes as easily.
>
> On 12/18/14 at 9:15 PM, [hidden email] (Walter Underwood) wrote:
>
>  The Signalink is noisy and the VOX is not needed because you can use the
>> KX3 VOX.
>>
>
> 73 Bill AE6JV
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Bill Frantz        | The first thing you need when  | Periwinkle
> (408)356-8506      | using a perimeter defense is a | 16345 Englewood Ave
> www.pwpconsult.com | perimeter.                     | Los Gatos, CA 95032
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>



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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

David Christ
In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm-4
Memory loss here.  Remind me what the second audio channel is used for.

David K0LUM


On Dec 19, 2014, at 2:26 PM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Chris,
>
> A good quality external soundcard will do much better than the SignaLink (the Signalink noise floor is poor and is only a single audio channel).
>
> The K3 has galvanic isolation (transformers) built into the Line In and Line Out lines.
> Jim Brown K9YC has recommended a Tascam soundcard as a good and relatively inexpensive one.  You might also want to read Jim's information on bonding equipment.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR

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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Don Wilhelm-4
David,

For data mode operation, most applications use only the left channel,
but there are a few that can swap channels.  I would stick with a stereo
device for the most flexibility.
And, if you want to use the soundcard for some other purpose (such as
for SDR purposes - like the KX3 I/Q RX output), you will need both channels.

In other words, more flexibility, wider bandwidth and better audio noise
characteristics than the SLUSB provides.  The bandwidth is not important
for data mode operation, but is a real asset for SDR use.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 12/19/2014 10:59 AM, David Christ wrote:
> Memory loss here.  Remind me what the second audio channel is used for.
>
>

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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Chris Hallinan
In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10
Ah. The light bulb just clicked on.  Thanks for posting the links, Walter.
Great write-up, Jim.  Just finished reading it.

I don't need anything related to rig control if I choose vox operation, and
guess what?  I'm an amateur musician and I have at least 2 audio interfaces
in the house.  Of course, they are overkill (one is an old Edirol FA-101
with 8 inputs and outputs, and one is a very nice Steinberg UR-28M. Both
are way more than I need for digital modes.)  I'll probably buy the Tascam
only because I love buttons, knobs, and LEDs.  (Don't we all?)  LOL


Thanks guys,

Chris
K1AY

On Fri, Dec 19, 2014 at 10:56 AM, Walter Underwood <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Jim updated this in July to recommend two current, high-quality USB audio
> interfaces. At $49 and $99, either is cheaper than the Signalink.
>
>
> http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/639303-REG/Numark_STEREO%7CIO_Stereo_iO_USB.html
>
> http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/657978-REG/Tascam_US_122MKII_US_122MKII_USB_2_0.html
>
> wunder
> K6WRU
> CM87wj
> http://observer.wunderwood.org/
>
> On Dec 19, 2014, at 12:43 AM, Jim Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > On Thu,12/18/2014 5:56 PM, Chris Hallinan wrote:
> >> Wonder what others are using for
> >> external interface for digital modes?
> >
> > Here's my advice. http://k9yc.com/USB_Interfaces.pdf
> >
> > 73, Jim K9YC
> >
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Jack Brindle-2
In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm-4
I’ll go beyond this. CocoaModem allows for decoding two streams simultaneously. I feed the main receiver to the left channel, and the K3’s sub receiver to the right. Of course only one channel can be used for transmit since Wayne hasn’t developer a sub transmitter yet. ;-)

Other digital apps provide similar services that take advantage of separate audio feeds from the radio.


There are other uses - during a contest I will also feed the output of each receiver to be recorded on the computer. This allows me to replay some of the contest if I really get bored (makes good CW practice as well), and makes the disk vendors happier when I need more storage for all the audio files…

Note that if you want to play with CW Skimmer having high bandwidth is a huge advantage. The SLUSB has a relatively narrow bandwidth coded which means narrow band of frequencies will be decoded. Wide band interfaces will allow a much wider swath of frequencies to be decoded with Skimmer and similar software. This will be limited by the platform hardware and USB Audio drivers in play. The Mac audio, for example limits bandwidth to relatively narrow widths (96KHz as I recall), while Windows allows double that. I do not know if Windows running on VMware Fusion on the Mac will allow wider bandwidths from the audio interface, but my suspicion is that it will since Fusion provides its own USB drivers.

- Jack B, W6FB

> On Dec 19, 2014, at 8:12 AM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> David,
>
> For data mode operation, most applications use only the left channel, but there are a few that can swap channels.  I would stick with a stereo device for the most flexibility.
> And, if you want to use the soundcard for some other purpose (such as for SDR purposes - like the KX3 I/Q RX output), you will need both channels.
>
> In other words, more flexibility, wider bandwidth and better audio noise characteristics than the SLUSB provides.  The bandwidth is not important for data mode operation, but is a real asset for SDR use.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 12/19/2014 10:59 AM, David Christ wrote:
>> Memory loss here.  Remind me what the second audio channel is used for.
>>
>>
>
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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Wes (N7WS)
In reply to this post by NK7Z
Me too.  I had a Signalink.  With the K3 I found no difference between it and
the built-in sound of my Lenovo T400 laptop, which is my current system.

At K9YC's suggestion I acquired a Tascam US-100.  While it worked fine, there
was no noticeable difference in performance on my modes of choice, RTTY and
PSK.  Perhaps on so called lower noise modes like JT65 there would be some
difference: I can't say. Personally, I think we're at the mercy of the quality
of the line out on the K3.  VOX works fine, you don't need any more complex
switching.

The hand-wringing over Windows sounds when using an internal sound card is
unwarranted in my opinion.  Turn the things off and stop worrying about it.  If
you're a total klutz you can have Windows sounds on your external card too.

Wes  N7WS

242 countries worked on RTTY using the K3.


On 12/18/2014 10:32 PM, David Cole wrote:
> Hi,
> I used to use a Rigblaster on my old Icom, I got the K3, and after
> asking was told no need...  I reluctantly connected everything, and it
> works just fine with out an interface...  No hum, everything works very
> well...  I have no wires coming out the front of the rig, nor to I have
> to rewire for mode changes...  I am totally happy with teh lack of an
> interface...
>
> Do download everything K9YC has published and read it...

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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Wes (N7WS)
In reply to this post by David Christ
Playing Windows sounds :-)

On 12/19/2014 8:59 AM, David Christ wrote:

> Memory loss here.  Remind me what the second audio channel is used for.
>
> David K0LUM
>
>
> On Dec 19, 2014, at 2:26 PM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Chris,
>>
>> A good quality external soundcard will do much better than the SignaLink (the Signalink noise floor is poor and is only a single audio channel).
>>
>> The K3 has galvanic isolation (transformers) built into the Line In and Line Out lines.
>> Jim Brown K9YC has recommended a Tascam soundcard as a good and relatively inexpensive one.  You might also want to read Jim's information on bonding equipment.
>>
>> 73,
>> Don W3FPR
>

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Re: Little brown truck arrived w/ my K3!

Eric Ross-2
In reply to this post by Chris Hallinan
I also use and like the SignaLink.  

Here is a preview of your weekend.  Have fun with the build.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/125220397@N06/sets/72157644623374769/

Eric
wb7sdeOn Dec 18, 2014 6:19 PM, Ken <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
> > On Dec 18, 2014, at 8:56 PM, Chris Hallinan <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > From some reading, I've heard that an external interface isn't required for
> > the digital modes?  Not sure about that.  Wonder what others are using for
> > external interface for digital modes?  I had a SignalLink USB at one point
> > and it worked quite well.
>
> Chris,
>
> One can, at least in theory, get by with feeding the audio directly between the K3 and the computer.  However, from what I’ve read, adjustment is very sensistive and it is more susceptible to hum , RF pickup, etc.  And you have to deal with how your computer handles the audio (mixers, audio enhancement, etc.)    The SignaLink is a good, simple, reliable interface, well worth it IMO.
>
> Have fun and good luck with your construction.
>
> Ken WA8JXM
>
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K3 - How to turn off internal speaker

W4GRJ

Something changed in my K3 Config, use to have the internal spkr off for use with external noise cancelling speaker. This has to be the dumbest question ever asked, How to turn off internal spkr?
Jack
W4GRJ


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Re: K3 - How to turn off internal speaker

Chester Alderman
K3's Owner's Manual, discussion on page 20 and CONFIG menu settings on page
59.  Set SPKRS = 1 and just below, set SPKR+PH set to YES.

Tom - W4BQF


-----Original Message-----
From: Elecraft [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of w4grj
Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2014 8:15 AM
To: 'elecraft'
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 - How to turn off internal speaker


Something changed in my K3 Config, use to have the internal spkr off for use
with external noise cancelling speaker. This has to be the dumbest question
ever asked, How to turn off internal spkr?
Jack
W4GRJ


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