Microphone compatibility

[NZ0T]

I have tried several mics with my K2 and the best reports are from an old Midland CB hand mic that I got free at a hamfest.  It's an ugly old black thing but it works.

Ian J Maude wrote

I cannot keep quiet any longer! :)

What is all the noise about microphone compatibility?  We are radio
amateurs, it should be simple enough to wire a microphone for a rig.  
Just look at the pin outs on the mic and the rig and wire accordingly.  
The circuitry is not exactly complex!
If we buy *any* radio we pretty much know that the mic wiring is going
to be different.  4-way, 8-way, RJ45 connectors, the list goes on.  What
ever the manufacturer decides is the right way for them, this has always
been the case.
It really is quite simple.  Is your microphone a dynamic type?  If so,
wire it for Kenwood and it will work.  Does it need a voltage?  Look at
the diagrams as I mentioned before.  Good grief!  Elecraft are building
the rigs for us now and we are still moaning! ;)

73 Ian

--

Ian J Maude, G0VGS
SysOp GB7MBC DX Cluster
Member RSGB, GQRP
K2 #4044 |K3 #?

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[David Cutter]

> I've heard it said that some contest stations deliberately transmit a wider-than-necessary signal to keep competitiors away from "their" channel.

David
G3UNA

>
> >
> Within the context of SSB useage in ham radio I believe that the 'hype about
> audio' could lead to another related problem, if not already existing, which
> is poor use of the HF spectrum available to us. Given the proven fact that a
> SSB transmitter filter bandwidth of 2.1 kHz will result in the transmission
> of a very 'good quality' speech signal, provided that the carrier is
> positioned properly and that the mic - audio - modulator system
> characteristics suit human speech, I see no valid reason for using wider SSB
> filters. In addition to the increased amount of spectrum used, the use of
> wider filters followed by linear amplifiers whose IMD products might be only
> 30db or so below a test tone obviously results in a wider 'Interference
> Bandwidth', and should be discouraged IMHO. Adding Reverse ALC to the mix
> can further increase interference.
>
> Just an opinion.
>
> 73,
> Geoff
> GM4ESD
>

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[Thom LaCosta]

On Thu, 14 Feb 2008 [hidden email] wrote:

>
>> I've heard it said that some contest stations deliberately transmit a wider-than-necessary signal to keep competitiors away from "their" channel.

Ah....must be one of those "advance the technology" things that justify
contests....good for everyone.

73 k3hrn
Thom,EIEIO
Email, Internet, Electronic Information Officer

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[dj7mgq]

> I've heard it said that some contest stations deliberately transmit  
> a wider-than-necessary signal to keep competitiors away from  
> "their" channel.

I personally would not intentionally transmit a "wide" signal during a  
contest. It would, imho, be counterproductive, apart from any other  
reasons.

On the small 40m band in Europe, during large contests, you almost can  
not avoid stations sitting on top of each other and/or overlapping.  
Even if I assume that there were no BC stations between 7100kHz and  
7200kHz and that a channel is only 2.5kHz wide, between 7040kHz and  
7200kHz one only has space for 63 running stations without any  
conflicts arising, or using the older limits of 7040kHz to 7100kHz  
space for 23 SSB signals. Here there will always be a certain amount  
of elbowing going on. If one considers all the high powered phase  
noise being radiated and so on, then even a 9+20 signal can be a weak  
signal when compared to "40m contest noise" levels. And finding gaps  
between stations can be a real art.

This is why you want to have a signal with a very high average power  
level, but one which is also not wider than necessary.

vy 73 de toby


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[Mike S-8]

At 08:28 AM 2/14/2008, [hidden email] wrote...
>This is why you want to have a signal with a very high average power
>level, but one which is also not wider than necessary.

That sounds like CW. :-)  

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[Chris Kantarjiev K6DBG]

> I did say "_some_ newly licensed..."
>
> Congrats on the three Elecraft rigs and 20wpm CW; your enthusiasm is to
> be commended.  I look forward to working you.

Thanks, David, and sorry, all, for letting that rash message slip into
our oasis of civility. It was a frustrating day all around yesterday (but
that's still no excuse, just an explanation).

I look forward to working you, too! G-land has been very tough from here
so far...

73 de chris K6DBG
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[AC7AC]

CONTENTS DELETED

The author has deleted this message.

[Brett Howard]

Agreed... You only get so much "area under the curve" so why waste it with
width when its height that gets you heard?

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
[hidden email]
Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 5:29 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: Re: [Elecraft] Microphones (was electronic product standards)

> I've heard it said that some contest stations deliberately transmit  
> a wider-than-necessary signal to keep competitiors away from  
> "their" channel.

I personally would not intentionally transmit a "wide" signal during a  
contest. It would, imho, be counterproductive, apart from any other  
reasons.

On the small 40m band in Europe, during large contests, you almost can  
not avoid stations sitting on top of each other and/or overlapping.  
Even if I assume that there were no BC stations between 7100kHz and  
7200kHz and that a channel is only 2.5kHz wide, between 7040kHz and  
7200kHz one only has space for 63 running stations without any  
conflicts arising, or using the older limits of 7040kHz to 7100kHz  
space for 23 SSB signals. Here there will always be a certain amount  
of elbowing going on. If one considers all the high powered phase  
noise being radiated and so on, then even a 9+20 signal can be a weak  
signal when compared to "40m contest noise" levels. And finding gaps  
between stations can be a real art.

This is why you want to have a signal with a very high average power  
level, but one which is also not wider than necessary.

vy 73 de toby


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[Julian, G4ILO]

nz0t wrote

I have tried several mics with my K2 and the best reports are from an old Midland CB hand mic that I got free at a hamfest.  It's an ugly old black thing but it works.

I got one like that from Maplin several years ago. You could run over it with a truck and it wouldn't harm it. I've only ever used it on rare occasions when I've taken the K2 out mobile or portable, but it sure has earned some unsolicited complimentary audio reports.

As for plug compatibility, my oldest mic has been rewired so many times the cross-head screws on the plug shell are almost completely burred over. Fortunately since the K2 arrived in the shack several years ago I haven't needed to rewire it. It worked with the K3 with no problem.

[Alan Bloom]

I read years ago that speech processors like pre-emphasized audio
(louder highs, quieter lows).  And the heavier the processing the more
pre-emphasis is optimum.  Does anyone know if the K3 speech processor
does that automatically?

Al N1AL


On Thu, 2008-02-14 at 01:52, Brendan Minish wrote:

> On Wed, 2008-02-13 at 12:12 -0800, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:
>
> > There were some microphones produced for the "communications" market back
> > then such as the famous Astatic D-104 which had a microphone element with a
> > shaped response showing a distinct hump around 3 kHz, rolling off slowly at
> > lower frequencies and somewhat faster at higher frequencies. That hump
> > helped with "articulation" by emphasizing the mid-range speech frequencies.
>
> This is a presence peak.
>
> > I don't know if anyone is doing that today for mainstream communications
> > microphones.
>
> Today Paging Microphones are still specifically designed to have this
> pronounced mid range presence peak and also usually include Quite a bit
> of low frequency Roll off
>
> Shure have a range of dynamic elements available for this market, that
> have response curves that look remarkably similar to the HC4 and HC5
> elements.
> take a look at the response curve of the Shure 450
> http://www.shure.com/ProAudio/Products/WiredMicrophones/us_pro_450SeriesII_content
> a direct link to just the curve
> http://www.shure.com/groups/public/@gms_gmi_web_us/documents/web_resource/site_img_us_rc_450series2_larg.gif
>
> the 522 has a broader presence peak
> http://www.shure.com/ProAudio/Products/WiredMicrophones/us_pro_522_content
> Direct to curve
> http://www.shure.com/stellent/groups/public/@gms_gmi_web_us/documents/web_resource/site_img_us_rc_522_large.gif
>
> elements for these mics (and many others) are available at low cost as
> replacement parts.
>
> Heil sound plot their curves on a different log scale but after
> accounting for that the similarities are remarkable.
> http://www.heilsound.com/amateur/products/hc4/index.htm
>
>
> The needs of paging systems which include efficient use of limited power
> and maximum intelligibility in noisy environments are pretty much
> identical to our requirements for effective SSB modulation. Any well
> made paging/ Dispatch mic (or element..) is ideal for amateur radio use,
> most are far more durable and cost effective than 'the made for ham
> radio' stuff that is popular these days.  
>
> >  Even the "high end" Ham mics only offer general and
> > uninformative comments about "shaping" and "clarity" that say much and
> > convey little.
>
> These words (in ham radio use anyway) have become marketing speak and
> now mean nothing. As a former audio professional I cannot understand why
> all the hype about Audio in ham radio and to my ears there's a lot of
> money wasted on trying to make SSB into something it isn't.
>  
> >  Interestingly, one of the big exceptions is the inexpensive
> > little Radio Shack electret element. It comes with a frequency response
> > chart showing a very flat response across the audio spectrum.
>
> If you are looking for flat then these are a great place to start,
> however the design of the housing may have quite an impact on how things
> sound, this can be used to your advantage to create a presence peak or
> LF roll off.
>
> My own headset is based on a salvaged electret condenser mic with some
> audio tailoring done by means of a simple R/C filter, being lazy I
> copied the circuit of an Icom handmic. It works great and cost me almost
> nothing.  
>
> 73's Brendan EI6IZ  

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