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OT: APP strain relief

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ab2tc

OT: APP strain relief

Hi all,

I have recently converted more or less completely to Anderson Power Poles for all my power supply needs. I use an 8-way "hub" from Powerwerx as my "distribution center". No fuses as the switching power supplies are current limited and probably failsafe in the event of most electrical component failures. For the big stuff, radios with #12 power wires I am not worried about the lack of strain relief on the connectors. But for the flimsy power cables supplied with accessories like my KAT500, LP-100A, Lantronix serial servers I am. Has anybody found a good solution for this? Should I just fill the back of the connectors with epoxy or is there a better way?

Knut - AB2TC

Bill Frantz

Re: OT: APP strain relief

On 4/24/13 at 2:20 PM, [hidden email] (ab2tc) wrote:

>I have recently converted more or less completely to Anderson Power Poles
>for all my power supply needs. ... For the big stuff, radios
>with #12 power wires I am not worried
>about the lack of strain relief on the connectors. But for the flimsy power
>cables supplied with accessories like my KAT500, LP-100A, Lantronix serial
>servers I am. Has anybody found a good solution for this? Should I just fill
>the back of the connectors with epoxy or is there a better way?

I haven't worried about the lack of strain relief, but with the
small wires I have had to solder the wires to the metal
connector inserts after crimping to keep them from pulling loose.

Cheers - Bill, AE6JV

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill Frantz | I don't have high-speed | Periwinkle
(408)356-8506 | internet. I have DSL. | 16345
Englewood Ave
www.pwpconsult.com | | Los Gatos,
CA 95032

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Don Wilhelm-4

Re: OT: APP strain relief

In reply to this post by ab2tc

Knut,

If you are referring to the flexing of the wire out the back of the APP
connector, that is a valid concern if you move things around
frequently. Actually, I have had no problems even with #18 wire.
Stay away from the epoxy unless you want it to flow onto the contact
area and render the connector useless - Hot Melt glue would be a better
solution because it does not flow easily. I would suggest a few layers
of heat shrink on the wire with a last large diameter heat shrink pushed
over the back of the APP connector.

If you have no fuses in that distribution box, I would highly recommend
inserting in-line fuses in the smaller gauge wires. You are not
protecting the equipment, but you are protecting the wire in the event
of a fault. If the wire cannot carry the full current of your supply
for a substantial time, then fuse it. I fuse #16 and #18 wire at 10
amps. #12 and #14 wire will likely be OK with a power source of 35 amps
or less, but I would recommend fuses on any larger supply, and
definitely fuse any battery, they can let out a LOT of current.

Safety first and you can keep hamming for a long time.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 4/24/2013 5:20 PM, ab2tc wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I have recently converted more or less completely to Anderson Power Poles
> for all my power supply needs. I use an 8-way "hub" from Powerwerx as my
> "distribution center". No fuses as the switching power supplies are current
> limited and probably failsafe in the event of most electrical component
> failures. For the big stuff, radios with #12 power wires I am not worried
> about the lack of strain relief on the connectors. But for the flimsy power
> cables supplied with accessories like my KAT500, LP-100A, Lantronix serial
> servers I am. Has anybody found a good solution for this? Should I just fill
> the back of the connectors with epoxy or is there a better way?
>
> Knut - AB2TC
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/OT-APP-strain-relief-tp7573006.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

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Doug Joyce

Re: OT: APP strain relief

In reply to this post by Bill Frantz

Hi Bill: I've found that if you strip the wire twice as long as necessary
and then turn it back on itself to the proper length, the crimp has more to
grab hold of and it will not pull out - I'm using a regular Power Pole
crimper.

73, Doug VE3MV

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Frantz" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2013 6:33 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: APP strain relief

> On 4/24/13 at 2:20 PM, [hidden email] (ab2tc) wrote:
>
>>I have recently converted more or less completely to Anderson Power Poles
>>for all my power supply needs. ... For the big stuff, radios with #12
>>power wires I am not worried
>>about the lack of strain relief on the connectors. But for the flimsy
>>power
>>cables supplied with accessories like my KAT500, LP-100A, Lantronix serial
>>servers I am. Has anybody found a good solution for this? Should I just
>>fill
>>the back of the connectors with epoxy or is there a better way?
>
> I haven't worried about the lack of strain relief, but with the small
> wires I have had to solder the wires to the metal connector inserts after
> crimping to keep them from pulling loose.
>
> Cheers - Bill, AE6JV
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Bill Frantz | I don't have high-speed | Periwinkle
> (408)356-8506 | internet. I have DSL. | 16345 Englewood Ave
> www.pwpconsult.com | | Los Gatos, CA 95032
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Bill Frantz

Re: OT: APP strain relief

A good idea. I'll try it the next time I have to make up some
small wire APPs.

BTW, I solder the connections before I put the contacts in the shells.

Cheers - Bill, AE6JV

On 4/24/13 at 3:45 PM, [hidden email] (D Joyce) wrote:

>Hi Bill: I've found that if you strip the wire twice as long
>as necessary and then turn it back on itself to the proper
>length, the crimp has more to grab hold of and it will not pull
>out - I'm using a regular Power Pole crimper.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill Frantz | gets() remains as a monument | Periwinkle
(408)356-8506 | to C's continuing support of | 16345
Englewood Ave
www.pwpconsult.com | buffer overruns. | Los Gatos,
CA 95032

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Jim Rhodes-2

Re: OT: APP strain relief

If you solder smaller cables you need strain relief even more. The solder
makes the wire stiffer as it wicks up the wire,making them more prone to
breaking in my experience. The heat shrink also makes them a little easier
to insert into the housing. Two layers of the thin stuff or one of the
heavier gauge.

On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 9:11 PM, Bill Frantz <[hidden email]> wrote:

> A good idea. I'll try it the next time I have to make up some small wire
> APPs.
>
> BTW, I solder the connections before I put the contacts in the shells.
>
> Cheers - Bill, AE6JV
>
> On 4/24/13 at 3:45 PM, [hidden email] (D Joyce) wrote:
>
> Hi Bill: I've found that if you strip the wire twice as long as
>> necessary and then turn it back on itself to the proper length, the crimp
>> has more to grab hold of and it will not pull out - I'm using a regular
>> Power Pole crimper.
>>
>
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
> -----------
> Bill Frantz | gets() remains as a monument | Periwinkle
> (408)356-8506 | to C's continuing support of | 16345 Englewood Ave
> www.pwpconsult.com | buffer overruns. | Los Gatos, CA 95032
>
> ______________________________**______________________________**__
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/**mailman/listinfo/elecraft<http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft>
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.**htm<http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
> Post: mailto:[hidden email].**net <[hidden email]>
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

--
Jim K0XU
[hidden email]
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Chip Stratton

Re: OT: APP strain relief

>
> Don W. has it right. Get some adhesive lined heat shrink (also called
> "dual wall"). I put a length of small diameter over the wires up to the
> APP, then a shorter length of larger diameter that also goes up over the
> rear of the APP. This stabilizes the wires in the APP, allows gradual
> bending behind the APP to reduce chances of fatigue failure from low radius
> flexing, and also helps hold the black and red halves of the APP together.
>
> While you are at it, get an assortment of diameters of this heat shrink.
> You'll use it for all sorts of electrical cables, if you do that kind of
> stuff. I seem to go through a whole lot of it myself. I've purchased from
> www.buyheatshrink.com and have been satisfied.
>
> Chip
>
>

Edward R Cole

Re: OT: APP strain relief

In reply to this post by ab2tc

I just placed an order with Powerwerx for a special 45A pc-mount
connector and special #10wire plug to use 10awg wiring with my
amplifiers. The 300w amp runs 17A at 27vdc so the heavier dc wiring
will be useful (typical 60% effficiency).

I am building a CCI AN762 (5w/140w) amplifier kit and will use the
same dc connector. Estimate it will draw 234w dc load at 13.8v which
is 16.9A. I plan to bring the amp to Dayton to show and sell.

I am just finishing winding the cores for the six band LP
filter. Testing next.

73, Ed - KL7UW

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ve3dvy

Re: OT: APP strain relief

In reply to this post by ab2tc

For the fine wires, before crimping I slide a short length about half
to 3/4 inch length of shrink tubing with a diameter just big enough to
fit over the crimped end on each lead then I slide another piece of
shrink tubing over both wires about 2 inches long and slide it out of
the way for now. once the crimp and soldering is done I slide
the short tubing so that it is just covering the crimp then shrink it
then I slide the terminals into the connector body and join the two
together and line them up. Then I slide the longer shrink that covers
both wires as close to the APPs as I can and shrink it. It makes a
tidy strain relief As a side note I never use the pins to hold the
connector pairs together I find that they can still come apart
Crazy glue does a much better and more permanent job.

73 Dave VE3DVY

. On 4/24/2013 17:20, ab2tc wrote:

EricJ-2

Re: OT: APP strain relief

{Directed at no one in particular. Don't take it personally, anyone}

I think someone already mentioned doubling the stripped wire back over
the insulation, then putting that in the APP terminal. I'm pretty sure
that's what Anderson recommends. But then you have to PROPERLY crimp it,
not solder it. Do that and you won't need strain relief in ordinary service.

So treat yourself. West Mountain has an EXCELLENT crimper good for all
three APP terminals, and as quality crimpers go, it's dirt
cheap...$40...the price of two large pizzas. Anderson has one too, but
you need a credit check to buy it. I've done hundreds of crimps with the
West Mtn crimper for ham, auto and R/C use. Soldering APPs is ridiculous
and produces an inferior connection that NEEDS strain relief. You select
a stranded wire, then wick solder up it to make it a solid wire. That's
nuts.

I've heard from lots of R/C people that crimping makes an inferior
connection and the connection should be soldered as well. Tell that to
Mercedes or any quality auto or motorcycle manufacturer. Except for PC
boards, just try to find a soldered joint in an automobile of any
quality. You won't.
Everything is crimped. I don't know for sure, but I'd bet all aircraft
connectors are crimped. I bet the SR-71 connectors are all crimped.
Probably the Shuttle too. Shouldn't that be good enough for a 12 volt
ham rig?

Crimping isn't inferior. Crimping with crap tools is inferior.

Well, that feels better.

Eric
KE6US
K1, KX1, K2

On 5/2/2013 4:44 PM, david Moes wrote:

> For the fine wires, before crimping I slide a short length about half
> to 3/4 inch length of shrink tubing with a diameter just big enough to
> fit over the crimped end on each lead then I slide another piece of
> shrink tubing over both wires about 2 inches long and slide it out of
> the way for now. once the crimp and soldering is done I slide
> the short tubing so that it is just covering the crimp then shrink
> it then I slide the terminals into the connector body and join the
> two together and line them up. Then I slide the longer shrink that
> covers both wires as close to the APPs as I can and shrink it. It
> makes a tidy strain relief As a side note I never use the pins to
> hold the connector pairs together I find that they can still come
> apart Crazy glue does a much better and more permanent job.
>
> 73 Dave VE3DVY
>
> . On 4/24/2013 17:20, ab2tc wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I have recently converted more or less completely to Anderson Power
>> Poles
>> for all my power supply needs. I use an 8-way "hub" from Powerwerx as my
>> "distribution center". No fuses as the switching power supplies are
>> current
>> limited and probably failsafe in the event of most electrical component
>> failures. For the big stuff, radios with #12 power wires I am not
>> worried
>> about the lack of strain relief on the connectors. But for the flimsy
>> power
>> cables supplied with accessories like my KAT500, LP-100A, Lantronix
>> serial
>> servers I am. Has anybody found a good solution for this? Should I
>> just fill
>> the back of the connectors with epoxy or is there a better way?
>>
>> Knut - AB2TC
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/OT-APP-strain-relief-tp7573006.html
>> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>

ve3dvy

Re: OT: APP strain relief

you are correct that a properly crimped connection is as good as
soldering but that really wasn't the point and I'm not sure why I even
mentioned soldering perhaps because I know that some do. I just crimp
as its way faster less burns and swearing and works fine for me.
The biggest downfall of soldering APP is that the solder and flux can
run down the pin where contact is made defeating the silver plating
creating problems.

However, whether you crimp or not, with light gauge wires like that
the power cable for an HT or small accessory, a strain relief will help
prevent wires from breaking off right at the end of the connector due to
fatigue. Frequent connecting and reconnecting plus moving equipment
while connected will break the wire right where it comes out of the
crimped connector pin. (I'm not talking about the wires pulling out).
A strain relief will reduce the radius of the bend in the wire at the
connection when it is moved around I don't see how crimping the
connector alone will prevent a wire bending and eventually breaking off
from fatigue

As for Mercedes Way back I was a Mechanic at a Mercedes dealer and I
know for sure that Mercedes Benz soldered plenty including pins for the
connectors. I'm sure that is changed in the last 3 decades due to
manufacturing cost.

David Moes

[hidden email]
VE3DVY

On 5/2/2013 21:42, EricJ wrote:

> {Directed at no one in particular. Don't take it personally, anyone}
>
> I think someone already mentioned doubling the stripped wire back over
> the insulation, then putting that in the APP terminal. I'm pretty sure
> that's what Anderson recommends. But then you have to PROPERLY crimp
> it, not solder it. Do that and you won't need strain relief in
> ordinary service.
>
> So treat yourself. West Mountain has an EXCELLENT crimper good for all
> three APP terminals, and as quality crimpers go, it's dirt
> cheap...$40...the price of two large pizzas. Anderson has one too, but
> you need a credit check to buy it. I've done hundreds of crimps with
> the West Mtn crimper for ham, auto and R/C use. Soldering APPs is
> ridiculous and produces an inferior connection that NEEDS strain
> relief. You select a stranded wire, then wick solder up it to make it
> a solid wire. That's nuts.
>
> I've heard from lots of R/C people that crimping makes an inferior
> connection and the connection should be soldered as well. Tell that to
> Mercedes or any quality auto or motorcycle manufacturer. Except for PC
> boards, just try to find a soldered joint in an automobile of any
> quality. You won't.
> Everything is crimped. I don't know for sure, but I'd bet all aircraft
> connectors are crimped. I bet the SR-71 connectors are all crimped.
> Probably the Shuttle too. Shouldn't that be good enough for a 12 volt
> ham rig?
>
> Crimping isn't inferior. Crimping with crap tools is inferior.
>
> Well, that feels better.
>
> Eric
> KE6US
> K1, KX1, K2
>
>
>
>
> On 5/2/2013 4:44 PM, david Moes wrote:
>> For the fine wires, before crimping I slide a short length about
>> half to 3/4 inch length of shrink tubing with a diameter just big
>> enough to fit over the crimped end on each lead then I slide
>> another piece of shrink tubing over both wires about 2 inches long
>> and slide it out of the way for now. once the crimp and
>> soldering is done I slide the short tubing so that it is just
>> covering the crimp then shrink it then I slide the terminals into
>> the connector body and join the two together and line them up.
>> Then I slide the longer shrink that covers both wires as close to the
>> APPs as I can and shrink it. It makes a tidy strain relief As a
>> side note I never use the pins to hold the connector pairs together I
>> find that they can still come apart Crazy glue does a much
>> better and more permanent job.
>>
>> 73 Dave VE3DVY
>>
>> . On 4/24/2013 17:20, ab2tc wrote:
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> I have recently converted more or less completely to Anderson Power
>>> Poles
>>> for all my power supply needs. I use an 8-way "hub" from Powerwerx
>>> as my
>>> "distribution center". No fuses as the switching power supplies are
>>> current
>>> limited and probably failsafe in the event of most electrical component
>>> failures. For the big stuff, radios with #12 power wires I am not
>>> worried
>>> about the lack of strain relief on the connectors. But for the
>>> flimsy power
>>> cables supplied with accessories like my KAT500, LP-100A, Lantronix
>>> serial
>>> servers I am. Has anybody found a good solution for this? Should I
>>> just fill
>>> the back of the connectors with epoxy or is there a better way?
>>>
>>> Knut - AB2TC
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> View this message in context:
>>> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/OT-APP-strain-relief-tp7573006.html
>>>
>>> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

EricJ-2

Re: OT: APP strain relief

Well, we might be talking past one another to some extent, because we
seem to be largely in agreement. When I suggested folding the stripped
wire back over the insulation for fine wires, that takes are of the
fatiguing problem without strain relief because now you don't have bare
wire at the end of the terminal. The insulation runs all the way inside
the barrel. I've never had a failure using that method for small and
fine wires. In R/C, we are often pulling connections apart several times
during every flight day and more times on the bench. Nothing in a ham
shack gets that kind of flexing. Never had a crimped connection fail,
but I used to have lots of fatigued solder joints in R/C.

Eric
KE6US

On 5/2/2013 7:52 PM, david Moes wrote:

> you are correct that a properly crimped connection is as good as
> soldering but that really wasn't the point and I'm not sure why I even
> mentioned soldering perhaps because I know that some do. I just
> crimp as its way faster less burns and swearing and works fine for
> me. The biggest downfall of soldering APP is that the solder and
> flux can run down the pin where contact is made defeating the silver
> plating creating problems.
>
> However, whether you crimp or not, with light gauge wires like that
> the power cable for an HT or small accessory, a strain relief will
> help prevent wires from breaking off right at the end of the connector
> due to fatigue. Frequent connecting and reconnecting plus moving
> equipment while connected will break the wire right where it comes out
> of the crimped connector pin. (I'm not talking about the wires
> pulling out). A strain relief will reduce the radius of the bend in
> the wire at the connection when it is moved around I don't see how
> crimping the connector alone will prevent a wire bending and
> eventually breaking off from fatigue
>
> As for Mercedes Way back I was a Mechanic at a Mercedes dealer and I
> know for sure that Mercedes Benz soldered plenty including pins for
> the connectors. I'm sure that is changed in the last 3 decades due
> to manufacturing cost.
>
> David Moes
>
> [hidden email]
> VE3DVY
>
> On 5/2/2013 21:42, EricJ wrote:
>> {Directed at no one in particular. Don't take it personally, anyone}
>>
>> I think someone already mentioned doubling the stripped wire back
>> over the insulation, then putting that in the APP terminal. I'm
>> pretty sure that's what Anderson recommends. But then you have to
>> PROPERLY crimp it, not solder it. Do that and you won't need strain
>> relief in ordinary service.
>>
>> So treat yourself. West Mountain has an EXCELLENT crimper good for
>> all three APP terminals, and as quality crimpers go, it's dirt
>> cheap...$40...the price of two large pizzas. Anderson has one too,
>> but you need a credit check to buy it. I've done hundreds of crimps
>> with the West Mtn crimper for ham, auto and R/C use. Soldering APPs
>> is ridiculous and produces an inferior connection that NEEDS strain
>> relief. You select a stranded wire, then wick solder up it to make it
>> a solid wire. That's nuts.
>>
>> I've heard from lots of R/C people that crimping makes an inferior
>> connection and the connection should be soldered as well. Tell that
>> to Mercedes or any quality auto or motorcycle manufacturer. Except
>> for PC boards, just try to find a soldered joint in an automobile of
>> any quality. You won't.
>> Everything is crimped. I don't know for sure, but I'd bet all
>> aircraft connectors are crimped. I bet the SR-71 connectors are all
>> crimped. Probably the Shuttle too. Shouldn't that be good enough for
>> a 12 volt ham rig?
>>
>> Crimping isn't inferior. Crimping with crap tools is inferior.
>>
>> Well, that feels better.
>>
>> Eric
>> KE6US
>> K1, KX1, K2
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 5/2/2013 4:44 PM, david Moes wrote:
>>> For the fine wires, before crimping I slide a short length about
>>> half to 3/4 inch length of shrink tubing with a diameter just big
>>> enough to fit over the crimped end on each lead then I slide
>>> another piece of shrink tubing over both wires about 2 inches long
>>> and slide it out of the way for now. once the crimp and
>>> soldering is done I slide the short tubing so that it is just
>>> covering the crimp then shrink it then I slide the terminals into
>>> the connector body and join the two together and line them up.
>>> Then I slide the longer shrink that covers both wires as close to
>>> the APPs as I can and shrink it. It makes a tidy strain relief
>>> As a side note I never use the pins to hold the connector pairs
>>> together I find that they can still come apart Crazy glue does
>>> a much better and more permanent job.
>>>
>>> 73 Dave VE3DVY
>>>
>>> . On 4/24/2013 17:20, ab2tc wrote:
>>>> Hi all,
>>>>
>>>> I have recently converted more or less completely to Anderson Power
>>>> Poles
>>>> for all my power supply needs. I use an 8-way "hub" from Powerwerx
>>>> as my
>>>> "distribution center". No fuses as the switching power supplies are
>>>> current
>>>> limited and probably failsafe in the event of most electrical
>>>> component
>>>> failures. For the big stuff, radios with #12 power wires I am not
>>>> worried
>>>> about the lack of strain relief on the connectors. But for the
>>>> flimsy power
>>>> cables supplied with accessories like my KAT500, LP-100A, Lantronix
>>>> serial
>>>> servers I am. Has anybody found a good solution for this? Should I
>>>> just fill
>>>> the back of the connectors with epoxy or is there a better way?
>>>>
>>>> Knut - AB2TC
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> View this message in context:
>>>> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/OT-APP-strain-relief-tp7573006.html
>>>>
>>>> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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>>
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>
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