Portable Antennae
Locked
 
|
I operated mobile for many years and here is how I handled the
antenna's. When in motion I had a 20M Hamstick on one side of the motor home roof and a 40M Hamstick on the other side of the motor home roof. Each of those Hamsticks was on a quick disconnect fitting. So when we reached the destination for the day, it took just an instant to remove one of the HamSticks and replace it with a long wire. I had two long wires in the RV, one 33ft long and one 66ft long. In the 15 years I was running mobile around the 14 states in the West, most camp sites had at least one camping spot with some sort of object to throw the long wire over. If there was only one low tree or shrub to throw the long wire over, I used the 33ft wire with the tuner. But if the terrain allowed, I used the 66ft long wire with the tuner. Having a full sized vertical 66ft long on 80M was a huge improvement on the lower bands. I usually got the wire up 33ft to 45 ft and then the top was bent over horizontally. Using a nylon cord to pull it to another object till it was tight. I used the vertical long wire because it was stealthy and you can have it in operation very fast. With the least amount of disturbance to the others in the camping area. In the desert locations of the West there was generally some sort of scrub or other type of object to throw the wire over. If the site just didn't allow any type of long wire, I made due with the HamSticks. The large motor home provided the ground plane. All anyone ever saw was a thin wire coming off the top of the motor home to a tree. And you had to look very close to even see it. The first antenna's I tried for mobile use were the top loaded Hustler verticals. I found them to be almost as good as a dummy load. But when I switched to using the higher efficency Hamsticks, I was able to easily work DX while in motion on 20M . I see a lot of hams today use amplifiers in their mobile setups and that's probably because it takes 500W to overcome the losses in the in some of the lame mobile antennas I see on the market today. I think I've seen them advertised as screwdriver ant. Frank W7is **************Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living. (http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/ 2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598) _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
|
|
Ken wrote:
>...I would like to construct a good portable antennae to use while camping I have played around with multi-band HF antennas for camping and backpacking for more than 30 years. I've tried resonant dipoles with and without traps, untuned dipoles fed with balanced line, simple and complex verticals, fed-fed wires, etc. I have never found anything that works as well as the least-expensive of the above...the resonant dipole. I have never found anything that works as poorly as verticals. Portable verticals, lacking a very good ground system, are very poor in performance compared to a dipole, if a side-by-side comparison at the same site and the same time is done. Outrageously priced vertical "dummy loads," such as those produced under the "Outbacker" name (with that bogus "ground coupling" base) are among the very worst. Most (or all) commercial vertical offerings allow the waste of hundreds of dollars to prove that contacts can still be made using the poorest of antenna systems. For the past 20 years I've used a dipole with appropriate insulators located in each leg that can be jumpered to get a resonant dipole, without traps, on any band between 40m and 10m. I use PCV water tubing for the insulators, and flex- or super-weave wire that has withstood many set-up/take-down cycles without the first sign of wire fatique failure. It takes less than a minute to lower the antenna and alter the jumpers to change band. I have worked more than 40 countries from camp sites using this antenna less than 10 feet above ground. I can send anyone interested a small .pdf file that describes all the details and dimensions. It's all quickly home-made at very low cost. Mike / KK5F _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
|
|
Hey Mike:
I would love to get the PDF with the info. This sounds exactly like what I am looking for. Thanks! Ken/NO4D Mike Morrow wrote: > Ken wrote: > > >> ...I would like to construct a good portable antennae to use while camping >> > > I have played around with multi-band HF antennas for camping and backpacking > for more than 30 years. I've tried resonant dipoles with and without traps, > untuned dipoles fed with balanced line, simple and complex verticals, fed-fed > wires, etc. > > I have never found anything that works as well as the least-expensive of the > above...the resonant dipole. I have never found anything that works as poorly > as verticals. Portable verticals, lacking a very good ground system, are very > poor in performance compared to a dipole, if a side-by-side comparison at the > same site and the same time is done. Outrageously priced vertical "dummy > loads," such as those produced under the "Outbacker" name (with that bogus > "ground coupling" base) are among the very worst. Most (or all) commercial > vertical offerings allow the waste of hundreds of dollars to prove that contacts > can still be made using the poorest of antenna systems. > > For the past 20 years I've used a dipole with appropriate insulators located > in each leg that can be jumpered to get a resonant dipole, without traps, on > any band between 40m and 10m. I use PCV water tubing for the insulators, and > flex- or super-weave wire that has withstood many set-up/take-down cycles > without the first sign of wire fatique failure. It takes less than a minute > to lower the antenna and alter the jumpers to change band. I have worked more > than 40 countries from camp sites using this antenna less than 10 feet above > ground. I can send anyone interested a small .pdf file that describes all the > details and dimensions. It's all quickly home-made at very low cost. > > Mike / KK5F > > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > > > Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
|
|
In reply to this post by W7is
Ken wrote: >...I would like to construct a good portable antennae to use while camping Mike responded: >...I have played around with multi-band HF antennas for camping and backpacking for more than 30 years. I've tried resonant dipoles with and without traps, untuned dipoles fed with balanced line, simple and complex verticals, fed-fed wires, etc. I have never found anything that works as well as the least-expensive of the above...the resonant dipole. I have never found anything that works as poorly as verticals....." ...................... Ken, I would agree with Mike! I built this very antenna in a short time after Mike sent me a simple diagram/link. I built the antenna probably four or five years ago and still use it. I used it immediately after Hurricane Katrina with my K1 and solar panel set up for nearly two weeks after the storm. I just use a light weight painters pole and bugie cord it to a suitable, but stationary anchor. As Mike said, it's easily adjustable and it works great given it's simpicity. Thanks Mike for sending those plans several years ago! And Ken, I'd try it. You'll be surprised! 73, John-KD5EJA _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
|
|
Hi All,
I would question the assertion that a resonant dipole is the absolute best choice. First of all, I think the original query included the condition that the antenna needed to fit within "the footprint of the campsite". Now, we don't know how big that footprint is, but I can certainly envision that such a footprint wouldn't be that big, particularly in a crowded campground. Putting up a resonant dipole there could easily be a problem. I would concede that a resonant dipole alleviates lots of "issues". But conditions at hand don't always make it the best choice. A dipole that can only be elevated a short distance is going to be pretty "NVIS" as a general rule. Perhaps that's sufficient, but generally it isn't. If you can get it up in the air a fair amount, all the better. Furthermore, if you use balanced feeders and a tuner, you have the makings for a nice little multiband system. But again, you may not be radiating in all directions very effectively, so maybe that's a problem too. But clearly a dipole that you can elevate somewhat is a good choice. I find vertical systems to be quite beneficial in many situations. True, there may not be super efficient, but sometimes that is really your only option. Verticals don't have to be elevated either, although if you can elevate one you might be better off. And it doesn't have to be elevated nearly as much as a dipole--just enough to start chipping away at the ground loss issue. I think the "rule of thumb" is to elevate it at least 1/10 wavelength to start getting some real benefit. Vertical antennas tend to have lower take-off angles--particularly compared to a dipole at a relatively low height. So, you might work stations closer to you better with the dipole, but stations farther away may hear you better on the vertical. For certain you need some radials, but they don't necessarily have to be all that long. As we have been told by those more knowledgeable, more shorter radials are often better than just a few longer ones. Vertical systems like the MP-1 and PAC-12 are darn good little systems. Admittedly, they could be better, but you can also make them better. You can add more length below and above the coil for starters. Also, you can spread more radials than are supplied. But even as supplied, these systems do work, and work fairly well. I've used both systems enough times to attest to that. Furthermore, I can use these systems in lots of situations where a dipole just isn't possible. It's not that I prefer using verticals--actually when I can I put up a multiband dipole system--but it all depends on circumstances as to which type of antenna works better. I would conclude my comments by posing a hypothetical situation to you. I'm not sure I know the answer, but I think I do. Let's assume you want to work some "DX" on 40 meters from your campsite. You are in a situation where you could put up a dipole at 30 feet, maybe even 35 feet. Alternatively, you could use a limb, or something like that, to elevate an MP-1 (enhanced maybe with an extra rod or two under the coil, and maybe one or two more on top as well) about 20 feet with 4 tuned radials sloping downward. Which antenna has the smaller "footprint" with regard to your campsite? Which one is apt to perform better at working DX? Is one substantially harder than the other to put up? Anybody want to play the game? Sorry, no prizes for the "correct" answers since I can't say for certain what they are! Dave W7AQK ----- Original Message ----- From: <[hidden email]> To: <[hidden email]> Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 4:49 AM Subject: [Elecraft] Re: Portable Antennae Ken wrote: >...I would like to construct a good portable antennae to >use while camping Mike responded: >...I have played around with multi-band HF antennas for >camping and backpacking for more than 30 years. I've tried resonant dipoles with and without traps, untuned dipoles fed with balanced line, simple and complex verticals, fed-fed wires, etc. I have never found anything that works as well as the least-expensive of the above...the resonant dipole. I have never found anything that works as poorly as verticals....." ...................... Ken, I would agree with Mike! I built this very antenna in a short time after Mike sent me a simple diagram/link. I built the antenna probably four or five years ago and still use it. I used it immediately after Hurricane Katrina with my K1 and solar panel set up for nearly two weeks after the storm. I just use a light weight painters pole and bugie cord it to a suitable, but stationary anchor. As Mike said, it's easily adjustable and it works great given it's simpicity. Thanks Mike for sending those plans several years ago! And Ken, I'd try it. You'll be surprised! 73, John-KD5EJA _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
|
|
In reply to this post by W7is
hi over the years ive done a good bit of portable work. and the best antennae i have used
is a vertical . i use a dk9sq 33ft mast with 33ft copper wire taped to the mast ( 1/4 wave on 40m) an atu and ground wires or on a nice day the wire conected to my k2. useing the atu in the k2 to work other bands ive worked all over the world so me im happy with vertical ants dont take much room and quick to put up wish you goodluck with what you use and most of all good fun chris g0wfh _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
|
|
This is the thing I use the most. I use the MFJ 33' Fiberglass mast. Small
hookup wire for antenna elements. 33' vertical and at least 2, preferably 4 radials laid on ground 90 degrees apart. White insulated "mil-spec" type wire used (24-26 guage) with tracer stripes. White wire wasy to see and helps prevent people tripping over the strands. Also have tried an 85' "L" antenna (33' vertical, 52' horizontal). It is harder to support easily and no good in parking lot or away from trees for support of the "far" end. The vertical is very quick to setup and takedown. Doesn't require and weights or slinghots to get the far end supported over a tree limb. 73, Sandy W5TVW ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" <[hidden email]> To: <[hidden email]> Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 1:00 PM Subject: [Elecraft] Re: Portable Antennae hi over the years ive done a good bit of portable work. and the best antennae i have used is a vertical . i use a dk9sq 33ft mast with 33ft copper wire taped to the mast ( 1/4 wave on 40m) an atu and ground wires or on a nice day the wire conected to my k2. useing the atu in the k2 to work other bands ive worked all over the world so me im happy with vertical ants dont take much room and quick to put up wish you goodluck with what you use and most of all good fun chris g0wfh _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.21.3/1308 - Release Date: 3/3/2008 10:01 AM _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
|
|
Sandy & Chris If you happen to have another 33 ft. mast; a real performer is a pair of 1/2 wave verticals,(20 thru 10m) spaced anywhere between 1/4 to 5/8ths WL, end fed in phase, or not. Can fire broadside or off the ends. Use four of these in a box pattern you can have a unidirectional beam. Center feeding would enable you to tune 17-15-12 & 10m, where, on 10, you would have colinear verticals Simple to hook up. No radials. More gain than a Bobtail and a lower T/O angle. Great DX antenna. IT SURE WORKS! Carry-on BillHarris w7kxb PS..I haven't tried the center fed arrangement, as yet, but it sure looks good on paper. PPS...Maybe someone should establish an Elecraft Field Operation Reflector (YahooGroups?) and lighten the load on this reflector. > From: [hidden email] > To: [hidden email]; [hidden email] > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: Portable Antennae > Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 13:14:38 -0600 > CC: > > This is the thing I use the most. I use the MFJ 33' Fiberglass mast. Small hookup wire for antenna elements. 33' vertical and at least 2, preferably 4 radials laid on ground 90 degrees apart. White insulated "mil-spec" type wire used (24-26 guage) with tracer stripes. White wire wasy to see and helps prevent people tripping over the strands. > The vertical is very quick to setup and takedown. Doesn't require and > weights or slinghots to get the far end supported over a tree limb. > > 73, > > Sandy W5TVW > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chris" <[hidden email]> > To: <[hidden email]> > Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 1:00 PM > Subject: [Elecraft] Re: Portable Antennae > > > hi over the years ive done a good bit of portable work. and the best > antennae i have used is a vertical . i use a dk9sq 33ft mast with 33ft copper wire taped to the mast ( 1/4 wave on 40m) an atu and ground wires or on a nice day the wire conected to my k2. useing the atu in the k2 to work other bands ive worked all over the world so me im happy with vertical ants dont take much room and quick to put up wish you goodluck with what you use and most of all > good fun > chris g0wfh > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
«
Return to Elecraft
|
1 view|%1 views
| Free forum by Nabble | Edit this page |