Posting rejection and other facts of life

[john.brewer]

>From: "Julian, G4ILO" <[hidden email]>


>I have no idea why my reply to another posting looked like spam, but
>there is no excuse for some brain-dead piece of software rejecting posts
>to a members-only ...

Wow!

With all due respect, it sounds like it's a good time to take a walk around the block.

I don't think Elecraft ever said anything about guaranteeing the performance of the mailing
list, or that there's any obligation for them to even READ the mailing list. I think pounding
ones shoe on the table because one posting didn't show up, is a completely unreasonable
justification for starting another mailing list (which assureadly will have the exact same
chance of rejecting a posting) and certainly not something Elecraft is responsible for.

>I dare say my comment is no great loss to the group, but perhaps there
>is some merit in the idea of setting up an alternative list, after all.

Because of a missing posting? You've got to be kidding.

Respectfully,

John K5MO



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[John [N5BSD]]

 
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Hash: SHA1

I must sound my 2 cents on this.
The mailing list is hosted on a sever that Elecraft does not control.
Therefore they do not have the final say so on spam filtering of said
server.
I have had several mailing list post binned by my pop host because of
spam filtering, but got it
Worked out and everything is fine now.
So raising an uproar and talking about setting up an alternate list
is a bit much.
But if you feel so spited that you must continue ranting about the
quality of missing one post
Then you could try http://groups.yahoo.com/group/elecraft/
Probably will not have the same quality and quantity of people there
(much larger base already on this list)
But this is a free choice list and NET so do as you will.

As for me, a post goes elsewhere, doesn't get posted, sorted to SPAM,
or even gets lost completely, well that
Can happen on this wonderful collection of hardware we call the
Internet.

My advice, take a few breathes, come down from your high horse and
realize, this is just a hobby and your post probably
Wasn't the end all beat all post of the century. Try to repost if you
wish and move along your merry way.

Well enough from my spleen
And I think I went over 2 cents as well HI HI

As for me, this reflector is a wonderful place to have any and all
questions I have had answered, even before I need to ask them
As the case is most times (plus a great back reference when you have
such a LARGE archive as I have here, or if I must the List Archive on
the net)

Eric, Wayne and the gang at Elecraft do a wonderful job providing us
with great radios and accessories, and do a bang-up job here on the
reflector as well answering questions and what not.

Do keep up the great work guys



73
- -----------------------------------
John
N5BSD
www.N5BSD.Com
Linux user #286770
Machine # 246511
http://counter.li.org
- ------------------------------------
- -----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
[hidden email]
Sent: Friday, April 01, 2005 1:57 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] Posting rejection and other facts of life

>From: "Julian, G4ILO" <[hidden email]>


>I have no idea why my reply to another posting looked like spam, but
> there is no excuse for some brain-dead piece of software rejecting
>posts to a members-only ...

Wow!

With all due respect, it sounds like it's a good time to take a walk
around the block.

I don't think Elecraft ever said anything about guaranteeing the
performance of the mailing list, or that there's any obligation for
them to even READ the mailing list. I think pounding ones shoe on the
table because one posting didn't show up, is a completely
unreasonable justification for starting another mailing list (which
assureadly will have the exact same chance of rejecting a posting)
and certainly not something Elecraft is responsible for.

>I dare say my comment is no great loss to the group, but perhaps
>there  is some merit in the idea of setting up an alternative list,
>after all.  

Because of a missing posting? You've got to be kidding.

Respectfully,

John K5MO

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[Kevin Rock]

A few of my net reports have been kicked out of the system.  There are
certain words which one should not use since they appear "Spam like".  The
one both Julian and I used which is on the list is buy.  I asked Eric
about the list so I could avoid using the proscribed words but he told me
he did not have access to it.  The list is further up the chain than him.  
Once I reworded my sentence to avoid the word buy the net report went
through just fine.
    73,
       Kevin.  KD5ONS

P.S.  Buy needs to be in association with some other word (which I have
forgotten).
    KJR




On Fri, 1 Apr 2005 14:56:32 -0500, <[hidden email]>
wrote:

>> From: "Julian, G4ILO" <[hidden email]>
>
>
>> I have no idea why my reply to another posting looked like spam, but
>> there is no excuse for some brain-dead piece of software rejecting posts
>> to a members-only ...
>
> Wow!
>
> With all due respect, it sounds like it's a good time to take a walk
> around the block.
>
> I don't think Elecraft ever said anything about guaranteeing the
> performance of the mailing
> list, or that there's any obligation for them to even READ the mailing
> list. I think pounding
> ones shoe on the table because one posting didn't show up, is a
> completely unreasonable
> justification for starting another mailing list (which assureadly will
> have the exact same
> chance of rejecting a posting) and certainly not something Elecraft is
> responsible for.
>
>> I dare say my comment is no great loss to the group, but perhaps there
>> is some merit in the idea of setting up an alternative list, after all.
>
> Because of a missing posting? You've got to be kidding.
>
> Respectfully,
>
> John K5MO

--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.0 - Release Date: 3/31/2005

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[Thom LaCosta]

On Fri, 1 Apr 2005, Kevin Rock wrote:

>
> P.S.  Buy needs to be in association with some other word (which I have
> forgotten).
>   KJR

It's the place where prices for Ham gear have risen through the roof.

There, they don't beg for funds and offer door prizes...it's very, very
commercial.

73,Thom-k3hrn
www.zerobeat.net Home of QRP Web Ring, Drakelist home page,
Free Classified Ads for amateur radio, QRP IRC channel
Elecraft Owners Database
www.tlchost.net/              Web Hosting as low as 3.49/month
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[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ]

Guys - Let's kill this thread now. It was dealt with and explained more than a
day ago via private email between us and we're all happy :-)

Must be a night for Long Delayed Echoes...

73, Eric   WA6HHQ
Elecraft list manager

John {N5BSD} wrote:
>  
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> I must sound my 2 cents on this.
> The mailing list is hosted on a sever that Elecraft does not control.
> Therefore they do not have the final say so on spam filtering of said

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[Sverre Holm]

-----Original Message-----
Guys - Let's kill this thread now. It was dealt with and explained more than
a day ago via private email between us and we're all happy :-)

Must be a night for Long Delayed Echoes...
-----

Wow, you have just experienced an LDE which is longer than anyone else
before you ....

Possible explanations for the rest of them can be found here:
http://heim.ifi.uio.no/~sverre/LDE/


73

Sverre
LA3ZA
http://www.qsl.net/la3za/
 

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[g4ilo-2]

John and others who replied.

In many years of Internet use, both professionally and in my hobby, I
have never had a mailing list posting rejected as spam, except on this
server that Elecraft is using. I know about spam-blocking technology.
Deciding whether a post is spam or not based on some arbitrary list of
words that the server owner doesn't like is a brain-dead method that has
almost completely fallen out of use because it is not reliable. I am in
business and could not tolerate communications from my customers being
bounced in this mammer. By trivialising my complaint as one person's
tantrum, you wilfully ignore the more important issue that I was trying
to bring to the group's attention.

You selectively quoted my posting to omit the point I made about the
frustration someone would feel if his urgent plea for help with a
building problem was rejected in this manner. Whether or not Elecraft
makes any guarantees about the performance of the list, it is the
principal form of getting support for most of its customers, and I would
suggest that there would be many fewer Elecraft kit builders (especially
from outside the U. S.) without it.

The periodic requests for an alternative Elecraft forum come from people
with a genuine desire to be able to participate in an interactive
discussion about the Elecraft issues that concern them without their
mailbox filling up with postings that are of no interest to them (which
for some, unfortunately, will include this one.) Their wishes have been
repeatedly ignored. Although others have tried to start Elecraft forums
using more sophisticated software, or have offered to do so, their
efforts are doomed to failure whilst this relector with all of its
acknowledged shortcomings remains the only one that receives official
Elecraft endorsement and participation. The Elecraft archives, while
excellent as far as they go, provide no way to reply or post to the
list, and are therefore no real alternative to a proper online forum.

73,

--
Julian, G4ILO (RSGB, ARRL)
G4ILO's Shack: http://www.tech-pro.net/g4ilo

[hidden email] wrote:

Wow!

With all due respect, it sounds like it's a good time to take a walk
around the block.

I don't think Elecraft ever said anything about guaranteeing the
performance of the mailing
list, or that there's any obligation for them to even READ the mailing
list. I think pounding
ones shoe on the table because one posting didn't show up, is a
completely unreasonable
justification for starting another mailing list (which assureadly will
have the exact same
chance of rejecting a posting) and certainly not something Elecraft is
responsible for.

 >I dare say my comment is no great loss to the group, but perhaps there
 >is some merit in the idea of setting up an alternative list, after all.

Because of a missing posting? You've got to be kidding.

Respectfully,

John K5MO

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[Vic K2VCO]

Julian, G4ILO wrote:

> The periodic requests for an alternative Elecraft forum come from people
> with a genuine desire to be able to participate in an interactive
> discussion about the Elecraft issues that concern them without their
> mailbox filling up with postings that are of no interest to them (which
> for some, unfortunately, will include this one.) Their wishes have been
> repeatedly ignored.

No, actually they have not been ignored.  Judging by responses from Elecraft
personnel, they have been taken seriously.  They have, however, been turned
down, in my opinion for very good reason (which I won't repeat at this point).

It is up to Elecraft to decide how they will support their products, and this is
what they've done -- quite effectively, too.

>  this relector with all of its
> acknowledged shortcomings

I have been a member of many mailing lists for I don't know how many years, and
I find that this one runs quite smoothly with just enough application of control
by the moderator to keep it on track.  In fact, it is probably the best forum of
its type that I've encountered, period.

--
73,
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco
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[Bill Coleman-2]

On Apr 1, 2005, at 2:56 PM, [hidden email] wrote:

> Because of a missing posting? You've got to be kidding.

Currently, NONE of my postings are showing up. This is because the
Elecraft list is using SORBS, who has decided to list BellSouth.net as
a spammer's den.

I've been on the Elecraft list for several years now, but now I'm cut
off with no warning. I've mailed Eric a few times, but he hasn't yet
replied.


Bill Coleman, AA4LR, PP-ASEL        Mail: [hidden email]
Quote: "Not within a thousand years will man ever fly!"
             -- Wilbur Wright, 1901

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[Bob Nielsen]

On Sun, Apr 17, 2005 at 03:26:45PM -0400, Bill Coleman wrote:

>
> On Apr 1, 2005, at 2:56 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>
> >Because of a missing posting? You've got to be kidding.
>
> Currently, NONE of my postings are showing up. This is because the
> Elecraft list is using SORBS, who has decided to list BellSouth.net as
> a spammer's den.
>
> I've been on the Elecraft list for several years now, but now I'm cut
> off with no warning. I've mailed Eric a few times, but he hasn't yet
> replied.
>

Well, that message made it.  I don't think Eric or any other list
moderators have control over the spam settings.  That is done by
qth.net.  I've had a few bounce at times.  

73, Bob N7XY

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