Question about Data Modes...

[NK7Z]

Hello,
I am still trying to get my head wrapped around the K3 for RTTY and--
lets say JT65.  

Here is the K3 setup:
1.  Microphone to Mic input, radio set to look for Mic in SSB on MIC
INPUT.
2.  Computer to LINE IN, DATA MODE A set to look to LINE IN for sounds
from the sound-card.
3.  PTT being asserted via RS-232 for data modes, and using a foot
switch for SSB.

Old Pro 3 setup:
When I had my Pro 3, I used the mic input for SSB, and data, using a
Rigblaster to mix inputs when needed.  I avoided the data inputs because
they also offset tuning on the Pro 3, and I was not running FSK, so I
always just used USB for all sound card modes, and did not have to
switch , or rewire anything to change any modes.

I would like that or as close to that as I can get on the K3

New K3 Setup:
Now under the K3, and no Rigblaster, I have JT65 (WSJTx), running
perfectly...  Rig control, decodes, makes contacts, etc...  I am using
DATA MODE A, and LINE IN for audio.  Works like a champ!

However when I go to RTTY using MixW software on the same computer,
leaving the K3 in DATA MODE A, I get the oddest behavior...  I can not
decode RTTY no matter how I try and/or how I tune it.  I have the
waterfall on the computer software showing that I am tuned correctly,
levels are good, but it fails to decide RTTY.  If I force a sideband
switch on the radio and re-tune it still does not decode RTTY, if I
force a sideband switch in the software and re-tune it still fails to
decode RTTY.  In tuning, to center a signal in the passband, the markers
for the signal in the computer waterfall the opposite direction from
what I would expect.  I have the same function running under CW, using
the same tuning method and the radio tunes as expected.  

There is something special about DATA MODE A I am missing.  

HOWEVER...  

If I switch the radio to USB, all decodes fine.  However I can not
transmit RTTY because I am in USB mode, and as such the radio is
expecting the computer RTTY tones to appear in the Mic input, where I
have my microphone, I have the computer wired to the LINE IN.

I really want to be able to run RTTY in DATA MODE A because I don't want
to change mic inputs every time I switch modes between JT65 and RTTY.
Is my assumption that AFSK A can not look at LINE IN correct?

So here are the questions:

1.  If you are running RTTY and any JT65 are you always in DATA A mode,
or do you change between data modes if you switch from JT65 top RTTY?
     a.  If you change to RTTY which mode for the radio, if JT65, which
mode for the radio?
   
2.  Any idea why I can not decode RTTY in DATA A mode?
    a.  I believe it is something to do with my not getting the sideband
settings right in MixW, or on the K3.

3.  What exactly is the difference between DATA MODE A, AFSK A mode, and
SSB?

4.  Are all sound card modes supposed to use the same DATA Mode, either
DATA A or AFSK A?
     a.  If so, why?
     b.  If not, why?

I have Cady's book, but for some reason, (I suspect frustration, and a
preconceived idea of how I think it should work), I am unable to unwind
this problem.  

I see the Cady's book says to use AFSK A for RTTY, and it says use DATA
MODE A for PSK, and I assume JT65, etc.  Why?  This relates to question
3 above...  Can I assign LINE IN as the sound input for both DATA MODE
A, and AFSK A?  

I believe I may be constraining the problem too much to solve it here...
So in short here is my goal:

I want to be able to just switch to DATA on the K3 and have it work for
all sound card modes, with no rewiring, or changing of the
configurations.  Is this possible?

Sorry for the long post, but I am trying to be as clear as possible in
this.

--
Thanks and 73's,
For equipment, and software setups and reviews see:
www.nk7z.net
for MixW support see;
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mixw/info
for Dopplergram information see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/dopplergram/info
for MM-SSTV see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/MM-SSTV/info



______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

[Jim Brown-10]

On 5/6/2014 7:19 AM, David Cole wrote:
> However when I go to RTTY using MixW software on the same computer,
> leaving the K3 in DATA MODE A, I get the oddest behavior..

Hi Dave,

Use AFSK and the Line Input for your setup.  DATA A is USB, RTTY is LSB.
Don't ask me why. :) Also, check that RTTY Baud rate is 45, and tone
frequency matches what you're doing with your RTTY software (most of us
use MMTTY)

73, Jim K9YC


______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

[NK7Z]

Thank you Jim!  Are you saying to use AFSK A for all sound card modes?
--
Thanks and 73's,
For equipment, and software setups and reviews see:
www.nk7z.net
for MixW support see;
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mixw/info
for Dopplergram information see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/dopplergram/info
for MM-SSTV see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/MM-SSTV/info


On Tue, 2014-05-06 at 07:31 -0700, Jim Brown wrote:

> On 5/6/2014 7:19 AM, David Cole wrote:
> > However when I go to RTTY using MixW software on the same computer,
> > leaving the K3 in DATA MODE A, I get the oddest behavior..
>
> Hi Dave,
>
> Use AFSK and the Line Input for your setup.  DATA A is USB, RTTY is LSB.
> Don't ask me why. :) Also, check that RTTY Baud rate is 45, and tone
> frequency matches what you're doing with your RTTY software (most of us
> use MMTTY)
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

[Jim Brown-10]

On 5/6/2014 8:53 AM, David Cole wrote:
> Thank you Jim!  Are you saying to use AFSK A for all sound card modes?

No, only for sound card RTTY.

Note also that like MMTTY, the K3 can be set for several tone frequency
pairs. I use the lowest of them, 915/1085 Hz, because I find it easier
to tune by ear.

Some RTTY folks don't recommend this, because the second and third
harmonic can get through the TX filter. What they fail to realize is
that the same mechanism that creates harmonic distortion also creates
intermod distortion. So careful level setting throughout both the audio
and RF chain are critical for all audio and data modes.

73, Jim K9YC


______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

[NK7Z]

Thank you so much again sir!  I now have everything running under DATA
A, but RTTY, that is my next setup for this rig, then I will be done...
I have my align, bandwidth change, set various things macro finished for
CW, and now for PSK.  It is amazing how much customization goes into a
rig.  Only getting a new rig, and having to rebuild it actually shows
one just how much each installation is custom.  Thanks again Jim, you
have been a huge help to me both here, and with your published
papers...  
--
Thanks and 73's,
For equipment, and software setups and reviews see:
www.nk7z.net
for MixW support see;
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mixw/info
for Dopplergram information see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/dopplergram/info
for MM-SSTV see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/MM-SSTV/info


On Tue, 2014-05-06 at 09:05 -0700, Jim Brown wrote:
> On 5/6/2014 8:53 AM, David Cole wrote:
> > Thank you Jim!  Are you saying to use AFSK A for all sound card modes?
>
> No, only for sound card RTTY.


______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

[Don Wilhelm-4]

AFSK A mode is not only LSB, but the K3 displays the mark frequency.  
That works quite well for those who are using MMTTY.

It may be that frequency display difference that is causing MixW to
'misbehave' - just a guess, I do not know much about MixW behavior.

You can use DATA A mode for RTTY, but you will likely have to tell MixW
to send in RTTY reverse.  It works that way with Fldigi.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 5/6/2014 10:31 AM, Jim Brown wrote:

> On 5/6/2014 7:19 AM, David Cole wrote:
>> However when I go to RTTY using MixW software on the same computer,
>> leaving the K3 in DATA MODE A, I get the oddest behavior..
>
> Hi Dave,
>
> Use AFSK and the Line Input for your setup.  DATA A is USB, RTTY is
> LSB. Don't ask me why. :) Also, check that RTTY Baud rate is 45, and
> tone frequency matches what you're doing with your RTTY software (most
> of us use MMTTY)
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]