Elecraft

RS232 interface

Classic

List

Threaded

33 messages Options

Alan. G4GNX

RS232 interface

I just got round to trying to interface my K3 to a PC.

I starred off with 2 different Prolific USB/RS232 cables, but although they both showed up as correctly installed drivers.
I tried running the K3 Utility but although it did seem to communicate once when I tried “Check communication”, but refuses to exchange data and gives “Not read EEPROM” errors.
That said, the same cables will not communicate with my Power Chute UPS, so I’m assuming that there is a levels problem with the Prolific cables? Can anyone confirm this.

I have now ordered a genuine FTDI cable, as that’s the recommendation by Elecraft.

I presume that there’s nothing to setup in the K3 and K3/Utility communication is automatic.

73,

Alan. G4GNX
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Don Wilhelm-4

Re: RS232 interface

Alan,

Yes, the FTDI chipset adapters are the recommended variety.

To further confuse the issue with both Prolific and FTDI serial
adapters, there are counterfeit adapters on the market. Those worked
with few problems under Windows XP with the provided drivers, but both
companies included code in the new drivers to detect those counterfeits
and render them inoperative. The new drivers are downloaded as updates
in Windows 7 and above.

I do think that the number of counterfeit chipsets in the marketplace
may be diminishing because of the manufacturers steps to protect their
intellectual property, but it is a headache if you happen to have one.
I did have one here that was a special cable for a handheld. I finally
solved the problem by ordering an equivalent cable that connects to a
real serial port or a working USB to serial adapter.

It may be that you have one (or two) of those counterfeit chipsets - not
saying for certain, but do be aware of that possibility.

There is really nothing to setup in the K3 or K3Utility, but it is best
that you set the baud rate for both at 38400 - K3 menu CONFIG:RS232. K3
Utility will scan for different baud rates if necessary.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 10/24/2014 10:11 PM, G4GNX wrote:

> I just got round to trying to interface my K3 to a PC.
>
> I starred off with 2 different Prolific USB/RS232 cables, but although they both showed up as correctly installed drivers.
> I tried running the K3 Utility but although it did seem to communicate once when I tried “Check communication”, but refuses to exchange data and gives “Not read EEPROM” errors.
> That said, the same cables will not communicate with my Power Chute UPS, so I’m assuming that there is a levels problem with the Prolific cables? Can anyone confirm this.
>
> I have now ordered a genuine FTDI cable, as that’s the recommendation by Elecraft.
>
> I presume that there’s nothing to setup in the K3 and K3/Utility communication is automatic.
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Alan. G4GNX

Re: RS232 interface

Hi Don.

I was aware of the issue with Prolific counterfeits. I probably have at
least two of those, including one I bought as genuine for programming a TYT
handheld (Baofeng cable). :-(
AFAIK Prolific do not render the counterfeit device hardware inoperative.
The counterfeits won't work with the current Prolific driver, but they will
work with a much earlier driver that does not detect counterfeits. It's also
essential to disable Windows Update for the driver. Another thing that
Micro$oft have deliberately made obscure!

FTDI have only very recently taken it one step further by actually disabling
part of the internal ID in the counterfeit chip, but it would appear that
they've shot themselves in the foot, because some genuine chips also got
disabled and they've had to retract that driver. Also a pointless exercise
because their system has already been reverse engineered, including their
driver and is being manufactured more cheaply by the Chinese.

I sympathise with both companies over protection of their intellectual
property, but they've gone about it the wrong way. Certainly in the UK at
least, I believe that FTDI's latest action is illegal. FTDI have no right to
penalise the end user by "breaking" the device that they paid for, although
it is possible to reverse the action, but most people won't know how. For
either company to hit the end user is just downright lazy and cowardly. The
general public will not know if they have a counterfeit or not and will lose
faith in these companies. The only "correct" way to stop the trade is
counterfeits is by due process of Law, by having copyright and patent laws
upheld, instead of being lazy and "fixing" a driver.

It looks like Elecraft are confirming what a lot of knowledgeable people
have been saying and that is that even genuine Prolific devices are inferior
to FTDI. Presuming that Elecraft have been selling genuine devices (I'm sure
they have) they've not changed to FTDI because of a counterfeit/driver war,
but because the Prolific devices have given them grief.

The device that I've ordered is direct from FTDI in Scotland, so it's 99%
certain it will be genuine and hopefully will work OK with the K3. It would
be ironic if it also turned out to be a counterfeit!
I would have been happy to purchase direct from Elecraft, but it would take
over a week and I'd have to pay extra taxes to our government. :-(

I'm just intrigued to know why the genuine Prolific devices are so
troublesome?

73,

Alan. G4GNX

-----Original Message-----
From: Don Wilhelm
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2014 3:43 AM
To: G4GNX ; Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] RS232 interface

Alan,

Yes, the FTDI chipset adapters are the recommended variety.

To further confuse the issue with both Prolific and FTDI serial
adapters, there are counterfeit adapters on the market. Those worked
with few problems under Windows XP with the provided drivers, but both
companies included code in the new drivers to detect those counterfeits
and render them inoperative. The new drivers are downloaded as updates
in Windows 7 and above.

I do think that the number of counterfeit chipsets in the marketplace
may be diminishing because of the manufacturers steps to protect their
intellectual property, but it is a headache if you happen to have one.
I did have one here that was a special cable for a handheld. I finally
solved the problem by ordering an equivalent cable that connects to a
real serial port or a working USB to serial adapter.

It may be that you have one (or two) of those counterfeit chipsets - not
saying for certain, but do be aware of that possibility.

There is really nothing to setup in the K3 or K3Utility, but it is best
that you set the baud rate for both at 38400 - K3 menu CONFIG:RS232. K3
Utility will scan for different baud rates if necessary.

73,
Don W3FP

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Bill-3

Re: RS232 interface

Perhaps the best bet is to install real serial ports - I have two. One
for the K3 and the other for my TS480. As I recall, I paid about $20 for
the board - a long time ago. It has been in several computers. To me,
the place for the adapter is inside the K3 - that way everyone gets the
same thing to work with and Elecraft will assure it works properly from
git go. No more screwing around with real/counterfeit/bogus products and
drivers - just a single source that works for sure.

Bill W2BLC K-Line
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Michael Walker

Re: RS232 interface

I've changed all my devices to Moxa's or Lantronix devices, that way I
don't have to worry about not having the ports installed on my desktop or
laptop.

These are RS232 over IP devices.

Mike va3mw

On Sat, Oct 25, 2014 at 9:17 AM, W2BLC <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Perhaps the best bet is to install real serial ports - I have two. One for
> the K3 and the other for my TS480. As I recall, I paid about $20 for the
> board - a long time ago. It has been in several computers. To me, the place
> for the adapter is inside the K3 - that way everyone gets the same thing to
> work with and Elecraft will assure it works properly from git go. No more
> screwing around with real/counterfeit/bogus products and drivers - just a
> single source that works for sure.
>
> Bill W2BLC K-Line
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Alan. G4GNX

Re: RS232 interface

In reply to this post by Bill-3

Sounds like a good idea for a tower/desktop PC but unfortunately I want to
use a small notebook, which I use for logging and if/when I get the
interface working, I can use it to connect to the K3 and my rotator
controller.

I may consider it for one of my towers. Thanks for the suggestion.

73,

Alan. G4GNX

-----Original Message-----
From: W2BLC
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2014 2:17 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] RS232 interface

Perhaps the best bet is to install real serial ports - I have two. One
for the K3 and the other for my TS480. As I recall, I paid about $20 for
the board - a long time ago. It has been in several computers. To me,
the place for the adapter is inside the K3 - that way everyone gets the
same thing to work with and Elecraft will assure it works properly from
git go. No more screwing around with real/counterfeit/bogus products and
drivers - just a single source that works for sure.

Bill W2BLC K-Line

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Alan. G4GNX

Re: RS232 interface

In reply to this post by Michael Walker

That might work for me in conjunction with real RS232 ports. Then I could
perhaps control from my Nexus tablet and Android phone.

I guess there's always the Pigknob stuff, but the hardware does seem rather
expensive.

FWIW I'm about to dump the Prolific (maybe counterfeit) hardware altogether
except for the Baofeng cable which works fine with my laptop.
The reason being that whilst I was experimenting yesterday, installing one
of the Prolific drivers crashed the PC into a BSOD and even though I was
using a different piece of hardware to attempt to control my UPS, it still
crashed u7nexpectedly when I was using it for something unrelated.
I've now uninstalled the Prolific driver completely and I'm performing a
ReImage repair to ensure stability. The PC has been stable for two years
since I built it, so I take drastic action when something like this happens.
:-)

I also discovered that when I was attempting to get the device to talk to
the K3, although I was getting conflicting reports, some communication must
have taken place because when I switched the K3 on today, I saw two error
messages which were caused by c0onfig changes that I did not make (2 modules
classed as installed but not actually present) and the K3 now has my
callsign on the startup message. The ONLY way that could have got there is
via the RS232 port.

I just have to be patient and wait for the FTDI cable to arrive, which I can
use on at least a temporary basis to ensure that the config is 100% and save
it as a file.

73,

Alan. G4GNX

-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Walker
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2014 4:48 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] RS232 interface

I've changed all my devices to Moxa's or Lantronix devices, that way I
don't have to worry about not having the ports installed on my desktop or
laptop.

These are RS232 over IP devices.

Mike va3mw

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Phil Wheeler-2

Re: RS232 interface

In reply to this post by Alan. G4GNX

I'm with you, Alan. I keep a 10" laptop at my operating position so I
can see the rig over it

There is a desktop Win 7 machine nearby but I don't yet interface it
with my rigs.

Phil W7OX

On 10/25/2014 11:02, G4GNX wrote:

> Sounds like a good idea for a tower/desktop PC but unfortunately I
> want to use a small notebook, which I use for logging and if/when I
> get the interface working, I can use it to connect to the K3 and my
> rotator controller.
>
> I may consider it for one of my towers. Thanks for the suggestion.
>
> 73,
>
> Alan. G4GNX
>
> -----Original Message----- From: W2BLC
> Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2014 2:17 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] RS232 interface
>
> Perhaps the best bet is to install real serial ports - I have two. One
> for the K3 and the other for my TS480. As I recall, I paid about $20 for
> the board - a long time ago. It has been in several computers. To me,
> the place for the adapter is inside the K3 - that way everyone gets the
> same thing to work with and Elecraft will assure it works properly from
> git go. No more screwing around with real/counterfeit/bogus products and
> drivers - just a single source that works for sure.
>
> Bill W2BLC K-Line

Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT

Re: RS232 interface

In reply to this post by Alan. G4GNX

They make "real" serial ports on PCMCIA and whatever the new expansion
slot-standard is called.

73 -- Lynn

On 10/25/2014 11:02 AM, G4GNX wrote:

Michael Walker

Re: RS232 interface

That's the advantage of switching to the Moxa's. All you need is a device
that connects to your Lan like any laptop.

Mike va3mw

On Sat, Oct 25, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> They make "real" serial ports on PCMCIA and whatever the new expansion
> slot-standard is called.
>
> 73 -- Lynn
>
>
> On 10/25/2014 11:02 AM, G4GNX wrote:
>
>> Sounds like a good idea for a tower/desktop PC but unfortunately I want
>> to use a small notebook, which I use for logging and if/when I get the
>> interface working, I can use it to connect to the K3 and my rotator
>> controller.
>>
>> I may consider it for one of my towers. Thanks for the suggestion.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> Alan. G4GNX
>>
>> -----Original Message----- From: W2BLC
>> Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2014 2:17 PM
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] RS232 interface
>>
>> Perhaps the best bet is to install real serial ports - I have two. One
>> for the K3 and the other for my TS480. As I recall, I paid about $20 for
>> the board - a long time ago. It has been in several computers. To me,
>> the place for the adapter is inside the K3 - that way everyone gets the
>> same thing to work with and Elecraft will assure it works properly from
>> git go. No more screwing around with real/counterfeit/bogus products and
>> drivers - just a single source that works for sure.
>>
>> Bill W2BLC K-Line
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Jim Brown-10

Re: RS232 interface

In reply to this post by Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT

On 10/25/2014 11:29 AM, Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT wrote:
> They make "real" serial ports on PCMCIA and whatever the new expansion
> slot-standard is called.

Yes, and I've been using Quatech 2-port cards for at least ten years
with T2x, T4x, and T6x-series Thinkpads. The problem is that newer
laptops don't have slots for these cards, hence the need for USB to
RS232 converters.

73, Jim K9YC
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Phil Wheeler-2

Re: RS232 interface

In reply to this post by Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT

My impression is that PCMCIA aka PC Card, I think,
went away some years ago. None of my three laptops
has that feature.

Phil W7OX

On 10/25/14 11:29 AM, Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT wrote:

> They make "real" serial ports on PCMCIA and
> whatever the new expansion slot-standard is called.
>
> 73 -- Lynn
>
> On 10/25/2014 11:02 AM, G4GNX wrote:
>> Sounds like a good idea for a tower/desktop PC
>> but unfortunately I want to use a small
>> notebook, which I use for logging and if/when I
>> get the interface working, I can use it to
>> connect to the K3 and my rotator controller.
>>
>> I may consider it for one of my towers. Thanks
>> for the suggestion.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> Alan. G4GNX
>>
>> -----Original Message----- From: W2BLC
>> Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2014 2:17 PM
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] RS232 interface
>>
>> Perhaps the best bet is to install real serial
>> ports - I have two. One
>> for the K3 and the other for my TS480. As I
>> recall, I paid about $20 for
>> the board - a long time ago. It has been in
>> several computers. To me,
>> the place for the adapter is inside the K3 -
>> that way everyone gets the
>> same thing to work with and Elecraft will
>> assure it works properly from
>> git go. No more screwing around with
>> real/counterfeit/bogus products and
>> drivers - just a single source that works for
>> sure.
>>
>> Bill W2BLC K-Line

Gary Gregory-2

Re: RS232 interface

In reply to this post by Michael Walker

Using an old Prolific here still. No known issues to date.
Interedtingly, using teo FTDI cabled i get interference so placed them in
the junk cable box. One came from Elecraft and the other from ebay.
I can easily accept a counterfeit from ebay but the Elecraft supplied cable
was annoying to say the least.
Manufacturers changing drivers and penalizing end users is more than lazy
to my way of thinking....but what would i know?

Gary
Vk1ZZ
K3, KX3, KPA500-FT, KAT500-FT,P3.
On 26/10/2014 1:49 AM, "Michael Walker" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I've changed all my devices to Moxa's or Lantronix devices, that way I
> don't have to worry about not having the ports installed on my desktop or
> laptop.
>
> These are RS232 over IP devices.
>
> Mike va3mw
>
>
> On Sat, Oct 25, 2014 at 9:17 AM, W2BLC <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Perhaps the best bet is to install real serial ports - I have two. One
> for
> > the K3 and the other for my TS480. As I recall, I paid about $20 for the
> > board - a long time ago. It has been in several computers. To me, the
> place
> > for the adapter is inside the K3 - that way everyone gets the same thing
> to
> > work with and Elecraft will assure it works properly from git go. No more
> > screwing around with real/counterfeit/bogus products and drivers - just a
> > single source that works for sure.
> >
> > Bill W2BLC K-Line
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > Message delivered to [hidden email]
> >
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Gary Gregory-2

Re: RS232 interface

Good grief......

No opions allowed unless cleared by a superior i guess.

Oh well, like i dsid....what would i know?

Gary
Vk1ZZ
K3, KX3, KPA500-FT, KAT500-FT,P3.
On 26/10/2014 12:07 PM, "Joe Subich, W4TV" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> On 2014-10-25 9:06 PM, Gary Gregory wrote:
>
>> Manufacturers changing drivers and penalizing end users is more than
>> lazy to my way of thinking....but what would i know?
>>
>
> Does your government allow you to use counterfeit currency if you
> received it from someone else? ... or should you be allowed to
> keep a stolen K-line if you purchased it from the person who stole
> it?
>
> 73,
>
> ... Joe, W4TV
>
>
> On 2014-10-25 9:06 PM, Gary Gregory wrote:
>
>> Using an old Prolific here still. No known issues to date.
>> Interedtingly, using teo FTDI cabled i get interference so placed them in
>> the junk cable box. One came from Elecraft and the other from ebay.
>> I can easily accept a counterfeit from ebay but the Elecraft supplied
>> cable
>> was annoying to say the least.
>> Manufacturers changing drivers and penalizing end users is more than lazy
>> to my way of thinking....but what would i know?
>>
>> Gary
>> Vk1ZZ
>> K3, KX3, KPA500-FT, KAT500-FT,P3.
>> On 26/10/2014 1:49 AM, "Michael Walker" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I've changed all my devices to Moxa's or Lantronix devices, that way I
>>> don't have to worry about not having the ports installed on my desktop or
>>> laptop.
>>>
>>> These are RS232 over IP devices.
>>>
>>> Mike va3mw
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Oct 25, 2014 at 9:17 AM, W2BLC <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Perhaps the best bet is to install real serial ports - I have two. One
>>>>
>>> for
>>>
>>>> the K3 and the other for my TS480. As I recall, I paid about $20 for the
>>>> board - a long time ago. It has been in several computers. To me, the
>>>>
>>> place
>>>
>>>> for the adapter is inside the K3 - that way everyone gets the same thing
>>>>
>>> to
>>>
>>>> work with and Elecraft will assure it works properly from git go. No
>>>> more
>>>> screwing around with real/counterfeit/bogus products and drivers - just
>>>> a
>>>> single source that works for sure.
>>>>
>>>> Bill W2BLC K-Line
>>>>
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>>>
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>>

Jim Brown-10

Re: RS232 interface

On 10/25/2014 11:32 PM, Gary Gregory wrote:
> Good grief......
>
> No opions allowed unless cleared by a superior i guess.
>
> Oh well, like i dsid....what would i know?

Hi Gary,

You're allowed to have an opinion, but so are the rest of us. I agree
with Joe -- vendors who steal designs ought to be condemned. Behringer
established a reputation for doing that a decade or so ago, and the pro
audio community condemned them (as did at least one court). Those who
buy cheap stuff from unknown vendors should not be surprised when it
turns out to be stolen or junk. Elecraft sells USB to serial interface
cables of known good quality. The real stuff usually does cost more than
junk.

I serve on an international Standards Committee (the Audio Engineering
Society) with representatives of several very good manufacturers who
have told me of their problems with counterfeits, and most of it is
junk. For example, connectors that don't mate because their dimensions
are wrong, and mics that look like the real thing but don't sound like
the real thing.

73, Jim K9YC
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Alan. G4GNX

Re: RS232 interface

In reply to this post by Gary Gregory-2

Joe.

Some of us have other things to do, so opinions may take time. :-)

Prolific are just a pain, but understandable that they would retaliate and
disable their driver.

FTDI on the other hand should be severely slapped. To use your government
analogy, if someone is known to be handling stolen money, you don't just
steal it back, that is illegal. You confiscate the goods and you take the
case through the courts, keeping the 'suspect' informed at all times. In the
case of counterfeit money, you don't just destroy the currency and say
nothing.

If FTDI can't afford their own "police force" they do have the option to
approach various governments and trade bodies to get the counterfeiting
stopped, although they may be into a hiding for nothing by trying to stop
the cheap Chinese copies. Nobody wants to upset the Chinese because there's
too much money involved in other trade with them. Greed and money before
principles! :-(

73,

Alan. G4GNX

-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Gregory
Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 6:32 AM
To: Joe Subich, W4TV
Cc: Elecraft List
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] RS232 interface

Good grief......

No opions allowed unless cleared by a superior i guess.

Oh well, like i dsid....what would i know?

Gary
Vk1ZZ
K3, KX3, KPA500-FT, KAT500-FT,P3.
On 26/10/2014 12:07 PM, "Joe Subich, W4TV" <[hidden email]> wrote:

Jim Brown-10

Re: RS232 interface

On 10/26/2014 2:22 AM, G4GNX wrote:
> FTDI on the other hand should be severely slapped.

Let's see if I understand this. Someone steals from me, I take measures
to make it difficult for someone to use what has been stolen, and I am
the bad guy?

In most of the civilized world, buying stolen goods is a crime. And in
most religions, it's also immoral.

73, Jim K9YC
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Alan. G4GNX

K3 enhancement

If the guys at Elecraft don’t pick this up, I will submit it directly, but I
also wanted to get opinions.

I have only recently acquired a K3 and due to home circumstances, I’ve not
had time to exploit its full potential. In fact I’ve only transmitted into a
dummy load!

In the meantime, I am still using my Icom IC7100, until I can get the shack
moved indoors and hook everything up to my satisfaction. The jury’s out on
whether I will eventually sell off the IC7100, because it does have many
features that the K3 does not, but in some areas it does not perform nearly
as well as the K3s.

Apart from the 2M, 70cm, D-STAR native capability, the IC7100 does have one
feature that I often find useful – ‘beeps’ when I tune past the Amateur Band
edges. It’s a small nicety which helps in my constant quest to be lazy.
Smile
It saves me having to stop and think “where are the band edges” on bands
that I don’t use very much without looking them up.

So, my suggestion for small enhancement is a band-edge beeper.

I appreciate that although it’s a small ask, it may be a major programming
headache, but hopefully worth consideration and would help to further set
the K3 above the rest.

I also notice that if I tune way out if band, the background noise
diminishes noticeably and I presume that the sensitivity has markedly
decreased? The problem with using that as a band-edge marker is that you
have to tune a long way out of band before anything noticeable happens.

73,

Alan. G4GNX

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]

Michael Walker

Re: RS232 interface

In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

In China they brag about how they have stolen intellectual property.

Mike va3mw

On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 5:33 AM, Jim Brown <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> On 10/26/2014 2:22 AM, G4GNX wrote:
>
>> FTDI on the other hand should be severely slapped.
>>
>
> Let's see if I understand this. Someone steals from me, I take measures to
> make it difficult for someone to use what has been stolen, and I am the bad
> guy?
>
> In most of the civilized world, buying stolen goods is a crime. And in
> most religions, it's also immoral.
>
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Alan. G4GNX

Re: RS232 interface

In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

No Jim, it's not such a clear cut situation.

Of course manufacturers should be able to protect their interests, but
taking acceptable measures depends on the degree of the measures and as
usual the (often innocent) end-user is bearing the brunt of the 'measures'
instead of the perpetrators of the crime.
The entire scenario is confusing in the extreme. The 'genuine' manufacturers
sell their chips with a view to 3rd parties using them in interfaces which
they then sell. The end-user mostly will have no idea which chip they have
purchase in good faith. Even the technically competent of us will not stop
to question what's inside the box. You buy according to published details
and would find it very difficult to detect the "lies" on face value.

To simply disable a facility because you 'think' it's counterfeit and then
not inform the user, is futile. The deed has already been done, the money's
changed hands and all you've done is to cost yourself money in retaliation
development with no hope of recovering your losses. You have also gotten
yourself a reputation as a manufacturer of bad designs, because the public
in general can't differentiate between the real thing and the counterfeit.
That's why we have laws to be administered by people who (hopefully) know
what they're doing and who have the resources to prove the case and make it
stick against the source.

Microsoft with all their faults seem to have mostly got it right. To use
Windows legally you have to validate and everyone knows this. If you don't
abide by the rules or attempt to validate a "hooky" copy, the facility
(Windows) will be withdrawn and you will receive a message telling you why
and how to go about rectifying the situation. Microsoft do not attempt to
disable any part of your PC's hardware, which is what FTDI have done and in
my view is plain wrong!

Folks can sit on their pedestals and claim that "you should know better than
to buy a 'cheap' product" , but often there's not a vast difference in
prices and human nature being what it is, people like a bargain or a
perceived saving. The criminals exploit this trait and IMO it's up to the
vendors to go after the criminals directly, not a few end-users who will
give up on the device and nobody wins.

If I lived in the USA or was about to visit imminently, I'd happily buy what
I need direct from Elecraft as a responsible/reputable supplier, but as I'm
in the UK I've ordered a USB/RS232 interface cable direct from FTDI in
Scotland. The purchase price is significantly lower than that from Elecraft,
due to shipping costs and taxes, plus I do not wish to wait over a week to
receive it or pay courier prices for fast delivery.

Hopefully you can see my point? The device I've ordered is cheaper, but that
does not make me suspicious that it's counterfeit. If the device arrived and
was counterfeit, I'd be extremely surprised and very angry and would kick
ass!

73,

Alan. G4GNX

-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Brown
Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 9:33 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] RS232 interface

On 10/26/2014 2:22 AM, G4GNX wrote:
> FTDI on the other hand should be severely slapped.

Let's see if I understand this. Someone steals from me, I take measures
to make it difficult for someone to use what has been stolen, and I am
the bad guy?

In most of the civilized world, buying stolen goods is a crime. And in
most religions, it's also immoral.

73, Jim K9YC

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]