Re: Hate the word HAM
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Bill wrote to John:
>I'm not sure what you are implying. I took my tests in 1980 under a >steely-eyed FCC examiner, and they were multiple-choice back then. The FCC ham technical exams were multiple choice when I took my first one in 1968, and they had been at least as far back as the early 1950s when my Dad took his. The only FCC technical exams that were not ALL multiple choice was/is the one for First and Second Class Commercial Radiotelegraph License (both classes use the same technical exam), and even those exams are still 90 percent multiple choice (or at least they were nearly 30 years ago when I took the exam). The reference in the original post may be to the fact that for several years after the FCC dropped the "one minute perfect copy out of five minutes sent" standard, they used multiple choice exams for the *Morse* test after the sending was over. That didn't last long. Mike / KK5F _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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Mike Morrow wrote:
> The FCC ham technical exams were multiple choice when I took my first > one in 1968, and they had been at least as far back as the early > 1950s when my Dad took his. > > The only FCC technical exams that were not ALL multiple choice was/is > the one for First and Second Class Commercial Radiotelegraph License > (both classes use the same technical exam), and even those exams are > still 90 percent multiple choice (or at least they were nearly 30 > years ago when I took the exam). I am absolutely certain that when I took my Extra and my 1st Phone in 1960, I had to draw schematics for both. I also remember doing a lot of slide-rule calculations, but I can't remember if the questions were m/c or fill-in-the-blank. I *think* (but am not sure) that the General Class test that I took in '57 also had at least one schematic. -- 73, Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Mike Morrow-3
When I took my general in 1961 at the LA Federal Building, I had to draw a
schematic of a Colpitt's Osc. They weren't specific if it had to be solid state or Vacuum tube, so I drew the solid state version I thought I knew best. Al WA6VNN ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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The theory was bad enough but what about the 20WPM
code. Had to go back three times before I got it. Had an awful time. I guess that's one of the reasons I hated to see the cw requirement go. It was so hard for me but if you want it bad enough etc. etc. Cheers, jim/k2hn --- [hidden email] wrote: > When I took my general in 1961 at the LA Federal > Building, I had to draw a > schematic of a Colpitt's Osc. > They weren't specific if it had to be solid state > or Vacuum tube, so I drew > the solid state version I thought I knew best. > > Al WA6VNN > > > > > ************************************** See what's > free at http://www.aol.com. > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Bored stiff? Loosen up... Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games. http://games.yahoo.com/games/front _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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And they wouldn't accept my 20 WPM Radiotelegraph ticket
for my 20 WPM extra! But by then it was a snap. Here's a tip, BTW ... many can write faster when copying CW by using longhand. 73! Ken Kopp - K0PP [hidden email] _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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That's right Ken. Either longhand or type it. Cheers, jim/k2hn --- Ken Kopp <[hidden email]> wrote: > And they wouldn't accept my 20 WPM Radiotelegraph > ticket > for my 20 WPM extra! But by then it was a snap. > > Here's a tip, BTW ... many can write faster when > copying CW > by using longhand. > > 73! Ken Kopp - K0PP > [hidden email] > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debate in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q&A. http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545367 _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Jim Murray-2
Oh I don't know, I aced the code and the written first time, or at least
thats what the FCC guy told me. I always felt like the Advanced was a waste for me it didn't give any extra CW space. I can still do 20wpm, but I hate that fast now, I'd rather put around at 14 or 15. hi Jerry - NR5A - South Dakota ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Murray" <[hidden email]> To: "Elecraft Post Message" <[hidden email]> Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 9:12 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Hate the word HAM > The theory was bad enough but what about the 20WPM > code. Had to go back three times before I got it. > Had an awful time. I guess that's one of the reasons > I hated to see the cw requirement go. It was so hard > for me but if you want it bad enough etc. etc. > Cheers, > jim/k2hn > --- [hidden email] wrote: > >> When I took my general in 1961 at the LA Federal >> Building, I had to draw a >> schematic of a Colpitt's Osc. >> They weren't specific if it had to be solid state >> or Vacuum tube, so I drew >> the solid state version I thought I knew best. >> >> Al WA6VNN >> >> >> >> >> ************************************** See what's >> free at http://www.aol.com. >> _______________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Post to: [hidden email] >> You must be a subscriber to post to the list. >> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): >> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> >> >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm >> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com >> > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Bored stiff? Loosen up... > Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games. > http://games.yahoo.com/games/front > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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We can still do it but just do it a little slower -hi
jim/k2hn --- nr5a <[hidden email]> wrote: > Oh I don't know, I aced the code and the written > first time, or at least > thats what the FCC guy told me. I always felt like > the Advanced was a waste > for me it didn't give any extra CW space. I can > still do 20wpm, but I hate > that fast now, I'd rather put around at 14 or 15. hi > > Jerry - NR5A - South Dakota > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Murray" <[hidden email]> > To: "Elecraft Post Message" > <[hidden email]> > Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 9:12 PM > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Hate the word HAM > > > > The theory was bad enough but what about the 20WPM > > code. Had to go back three times before I got it. > > Had an awful time. I guess that's one of the > reasons > > I hated to see the cw requirement go. It was so > hard > > for me but if you want it bad enough etc. etc. > > Cheers, > > jim/k2hn > > --- [hidden email] wrote: > > > >> When I took my general in 1961 at the LA Federal > >> Building, I had to draw a > >> schematic of a Colpitt's Osc. > >> They weren't specific if it had to be solid > state > >> or Vacuum tube, so I drew > >> the solid state version I thought I knew best. > >> > >> Al WA6VNN > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ************************************** See what's > >> free at http://www.aol.com. > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Elecraft mailing list > >> Post to: [hidden email] > >> You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > >> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > >> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > >> > >> > >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > >> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bored stiff? Loosen up... > > Download and play hundreds of games for free on > Yahoo! Games. > > http://games.yahoo.com/games/front > > _______________________________________________ > > Elecraft mailing list > > Post to: [hidden email] > > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy with an Edge to see what's on, when. http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222 ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Ken Kopp
On Sat, 2007-07-07 at 03:20 +0000, Ken Kopp wrote:
> And they wouldn't accept my 20 WPM Radiotelegraph ticket > for my 20 WPM extra! But by then it was a snap. I had to get a new 2nd Telegraph a few years back and the FCC gave me 20 WPM credit -- not for having had a prior 2nd Telegraph but for having had an Amateur Extra since before 1980-something! The guys giving the exam (not even the FCC anymore) breathed a sigh of relief because they had no idea how to give me a telegraph exam. It was hilarious.. BTW, the written portion of the 2nd Telegraph exam is the same as the first time I took it back in the 80's. Also, I took my Novice in '65, General in '66 and Extra in '68. I don't remember any essay questions on any of them but it *was* a long time ago. I do remember that the Extra was tougher than the 1st Phone. And the 2nd Telegraph tougher than the Extra. And, as long as I'm rambling, I hear a lot of new~ish sounding call signs sputtering along in the upper regions of the CW bands. I think they're guys with new HF privileges who are getting their feet wet on CW. I'm pretty happy about that.. 73, -Doug, W7KF _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Mike Morrow-3
On Fri, 6 Jul 2007 20:15:40 -0500 (GMT-05:00), Mike Morrow wrote:
>Bill wrote to John: >>I'm not sure what you are implying. I took my tests in 1980 under a >>steely-eyed FCC examiner, and they were multiple-choice back then. When I saw Bill's comment I looked into the mirror. My grey eyes did look a bit steely! >The FCC ham technical exams were multiple choice when I took my >first one in 1968, and they had been at least as far back as the >early 1950s when my Dad took his. In 1952 I took my ham Novice and Tech exam (the Tech written was the same as the General in those days) and all the questions were multiple choice except for one or two in the Tech/General exam which were "correct the diagram" types. -- 73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane Elecraft K2/100 s/n 5402 _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Doug Smith-9
On Fri, 06 Jul 2007 21:55:38 -0600, Doug Smith wrote:
>I had to get a new 2nd Telegraph a few years back and the FCC >gave me 20 WPM credit -- not for having had a prior 2nd Telegraph >but for having had an Amateur Extra since before 1980-something! They don't allow that any more. I could have had it - my Extra exam was in 1974 - but I was too busy being an FCC field supervisor to get a round tuit.... <g> -- 73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane Elecraft K2/100 s/n 5402 _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Ken Kopp
On Sat, 7 Jul 2007 03:20:33 -0000, Ken Kopp wrote:
>And they wouldn't accept my 20 WPM Radiotelegraph ticket >for my 20 WPM extra! But by then it was a snap. As long as the FCC gave the exams we would. When the exam function was privatized, that stopped. -- 73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane Elecraft K2/100 s/n 5402 _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Phil Kane-2
On 7/7/07, Phil Kane <[hidden email]> wrote:
> They don't allow that any more. I could have had it - my Extra > exam was in 1974 - but I was too busy being an FCC field > supervisor to get a round tuit.... <g> heh, I was only 2 in '74. <g> -- JT Croteau, N1ESE - Manchester, NH _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Phil Kane-2
On Fri, 2007-07-06 at 21:22 -0700, Phil Kane wrote:
> They don't allow that any more. I could have had it - my Extra > exam was in 1974 - but I was too busy being an FCC field > supervisor to get a round tuit.... <g> Yeah, I was surprised at the time. I was ready to take the test but the tester wasn't ready to give it so he called in to see what to do and was told that he could waive the CW exam. The exams are all given by the equivalent of the VE guys -- private contractors of some sort.. After enduring you steely eyed guys many years ago it was kinda anti-climatic. ;-) 73, -Doug, W7KF _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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On Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:35:47 -0600, Doug Smith wrote:
>The exams are all given by the equivalent of the VE guys -- >private contractors of some sort.. They are called COLEMs (Commercial Operator License Examination Managers) and they are not volunteer non-profit folks like VEs are. They can charge what the market will bear and do not have to offer all examinations that an applicant may request. What a racket. The only ones at the agency who welcomed the privatization of exams (both ham and commercial) were a number of secretaries in some offices who were detailed as examiners and who regarded the paperwork involved in giving the exams and dealing with the applicants as well as the "moving target" requirements handed down from Headquarters as a burden on their regular jobs, which quite frankly it was. -- 73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane Elecraft K2/100 s/n 5402 _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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On Fri, 2007-07-06 at 21:58 -0700, Phil Kane wrote:
> The only ones at the agency who welcomed the privatization of > exams (both ham and commercial) were a number of secretaries The first time I took the 2nd Telegraph my steely eyed examiner was a very nice woman (Seattle office). I showed up to take the exam with an electronic keyer and she laughed at me and said I could set that aside and use their hand key if I wanted to take the exam. (Evidently, a bug would have been acceptable but I didn't even own one and couldn't have sent with one anyway -- I'd been using a keyer for far too long.) So I copied the 20 WPM without flaw and then started pumping out the CW on the hand key with what had to be the world's worst fist. I hadn't used a hand key in 20 years! About half way through, she said - and I quote: "That's just not fast enough". <GASP> So I cranked up the speed and she somehow managed to get a minute's worth of text out of the gibberish I was sending and passed me. Actually, I think she just took pity on me. Heh.. Yeah, I liked the old FCC. 73, -Doug, W7KF _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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Doug Smith wrote:
> So I copied the 20 WPM without flaw and then started pumping out the > CW on the hand key with what had to be the world's worst fist. I > hadn't used a hand key in 20 years! About half way through, she said > - and I quote: "That's just not fast enough". <GASP> So I cranked > up the speed and she somehow managed to get a minute's worth of text > out of the gibberish I was sending and passed me. Actually, I think > she just took pity on me. Heh.. <LOL> I had a similar experience when I took the Amateur Extra in 1977 at the FCC office in Los Angeles. I had brought in my trusty Vibroplex bug, but in my nervousness, I had forgotten to check where the weight was set before I started. As it turned out, the last guy I had worked with it was apparently pretty slow, because I had the weight set all the way down to the bottom of the reed. About half way through the sending exam, the examiner says, "You're going to have to speed it up." I panicked. What should I do, stop to readjust the weight, or just try to squeeze the characters out faster by shrinking the spacing? Should have readjusted the weight, of course -- I had plenty of time -- but I opted to just press on. Stupid, because now my code sounded like crap. It was a close thing, but he passed me. :-) The guy I had, truth to be told, was anything but that legendary "steely-eyed FCC examiner." In point of fact, he looked like he was still badly hung over from the night before, and would rather be doing just about anything than giving a bunch of pimply-faced geeks their ham radio exams. :-) That was the last ham exam I ever took, of course. Kinda wish there was another higher level I could go for, just for the excitement of it! Bill / W5WVO _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by AJSOENKE
[hidden email] wrote:
> When I took my general in 1961 at the LA Federal Building, I had to > draw a schematic of a Colpitt's Osc. > They weren't specific if it had to be solid state or Vacuum tube, so > I drew the solid state version I thought I knew best. WOW, solid-state in 1962? Now that's radical! I wonder if the FCC examiner even knew what it was, or whether it was right or wrong? The only solid-state question I can remember on my 1963 General exam was something about if the arrow is pointing toward the base, is it an NPN or a PNP? Something real technical like that... Think I had to draw a Colpitts oscillator, too... Or was it a Hartley? It's all kinda hazy now... I do remember having to draw a pi-network output. Bill / W5WVO _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Doug Smith-9
Doug Smith wrote:
> The first time I took the 2nd Telegraph my steely eyed examiner was a > very nice woman (Seattle office). I showed up to take the exam with an > electronic keyer and she laughed at me and said I could set that aside > and use their hand key if I wanted to take the exam. I've told this story before, but it's worth repeating. I took my extra in New York, with the famous examiner (his name was 'Finkelstein' or similar) who had a cigar permanently attached to his mouth. I took the 20 wpm cw test in a big room, filled mostly with applicants for commercial tickets. I brought my elaborate homebrew keyer (multiple 6SN7's). He let me use it, but after he had heard enough he sneaked around behind me and pulled the plug. Luckily I was too young to have a heart attack. -- 73, Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Ken Kopp
>>I had to get a new 2nd Telegraph a few years back and the FCC
>>gave me 20 WPM credit -- not for having had a prior 2nd Telegraph >>but for having had an Amateur Extra since before 1980-something! But the FCC accepting a ham 20 wpm test result, even one from the 1950s, as qualifying one for the Commercial Radiotelegraph license Morse exam was a really bad joke. The real commercial second class code exam required receiving and *sending* at least one minute of perfect copy in a five-minute session at 20 wpm plain language *and* 16 wpm random code groups. That 16 wpm random code group test is for most folks far far harder than the plain language test. In five minutes you hear 400 random characters, including numbers and punctuation (count as two characters). You can flunk the random test if you have as few as six copy errors out of 400, if the errors are spread out such that you have less than 80 consecutive characters correct. Been there, done that! Mike / KK5F _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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