Re: Is there a good reason to buy a K3S
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Hi All,
The question has probably already been answered by several good posts. It really seems to boil down to convenience, and maybe a little difference in money. Elecraft has NOT made the K3 obsolete. The K3S, for the most part, is just a repackaged K3. There is an advantage to the K3S, however, in that many of the items that are add-ons to the K3, are now built into the K3S. Some of those features may not even be important to you, and if not, why spend the extra money? Still, an all inclusive package will be very appealing to many which is perfectly understandable. In essence, you have even more choices!!! Significantly better performance, however, is not obtainable by buying a K3S as long as you upgrade your K3 appropriately. I have a fairly early serial number K3. Over time I have added the various upgrades and accessories. I recently acquired the new syn boards, and probably will upgrade the DSP when that becomes available. From everything I've read there is apt to be no significant improvement that a K3S would give me over my older K3. If I want, I can even add the USB option to my K3. So, what little difference is out there between my upgraded K3 and a new K3S, actually boils down to a significant cost differential, and for very little noticeable difference. My K3 is performing very well, and I know of no reason why that will change anytime soon. It gets very hard to justify that unless money is no object. I have to say, though, that I do like the idea of not having my 6 meter pre-amp hanging off the back of the radio! Maybe a K3S is in my future too, but right now it doesn't seem to make much sense. A lot depends, I suppose, on what happens to pricing for used K3's. You definitely would want the new syn boards, so the price for a used K3 without them should reflect that absence accordingly. It does make shopping for a used K3 a bit more complicated. That fact alone may cause you to go the K3S route so you don't have to worry about it. However, if you already have a K3, and are just considering upgrading models, I'd probably recommend against it. That's the "trap" that other manufacturers get you into, but not Elecraft. The TS-590 may be a good example. The new "SG" model is significantly improved. I think there was some sort of upgrade process for older models, but I don't think it went all the way to "SG" equivalency--not in the way a K3 can be upgraded to nearly identical specs to the K3S. Anyway, if that is not a good example, there are plenty of others that do make this point. In short, it would be pretty hard to make a bad decision, either way. The biggest difference between the two choices is apt to be "money", but if it buys you the convenience you really want, then probably it is worth it. For that matter, the cost differential, spread over the life of the radio, becomes pretty insignificant. Probably not enough to get a brain cramp over! Dave W7AQK ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
Re: Is there a good reason to buy a K3S
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Well thought out answer by Dave. Makes a whole lot of sense.
My K3 has been updated as much as possible at this stage and is almost ready to be shipped back to me, I thinks so anyway. I think I will just keep the upgrades happening, I am way too attached to my baby now. -----Original Message----- From: "dyarnes" <[hidden email]> Sent: 29/07/2015 7:52 PM To: "Elecraft Reflector" <[hidden email]> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Is there a good reason to buy a K3S Hi All, The question has probably already been answered by several good posts. It really seems to boil down to convenience, and maybe a little difference in money. Elecraft has NOT made the K3 obsolete. The K3S, for the most part, is just a repackaged K3. There is an advantage to the K3S, however, in that many of the items that are add-ons to the K3, are now built into the K3S. Some of those features may not even be important to you, and if not, why spend the extra money? Still, an all inclusive package will be very appealing to many which is perfectly understandable. In essence, you have even more choices!!! Significantly better performance, however, is not obtainable by buying a K3S as long as you upgrade your K3 appropriately. I have a fairly early serial number K3. Over time I have added the various upgrades and accessories. I recently acquired the new syn boards, and probably will upgrade the DSP when that becomes available. From everything I've read there is apt to be no significant improvement that a K3S would give me over my older K3. If I want, I can even add the USB option to my K3. So, what little difference is out there between my upgraded K3 and a new K3S, actually boils down to a significant cost differential, and for very little noticeable difference. My K3 is performing very well, and I know of no reason why that will change anytime soon. It gets very hard to justify that unless money is no object. I have to say, though, that I do like the idea of not having my 6 meter pre-amp hanging off the back of the radio! Maybe a K3S is in my future too, but right now it doesn't seem to make much sense. A lot depends, I suppose, on what happens to pricing for used K3's. You definitely would want the new syn boards, so the price for a used K3 without them should reflect that absence accordingly. It does make shopping for a used K3 a bit more complicated. That fact alone may cause you to go the K3S route so you don't have to worry about it. However, if you already have a K3, and are just considering upgrading models, I'd probably recommend against it. That's the "trap" that other manufacturers get you into, but not Elecraft. The TS-590 may be a good example. The new "SG" model is significantly improved. I think there was some sort of upgrade process for older models, but I don't think it went all the way to "SG" equivalency--not in the way a K3 can be upgraded to nearly identical specs to the K3S. Anyway, if that is not a good example, there are plenty of others that do make this point. In short, it would be pretty hard to make a bad decision, either way. The biggest difference between the two choices is apt to be "money", but if it buys you the convenience you really want, then probably it is worth it. For that matter, the cost differential, spread over the life of the radio, becomes pretty insignificant. Probably not enough to get a brain cramp over! Dave W7AQK ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
Re: Is there a good reason to buy a K3S
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In reply to this post by w7aqk
David,
A very good analysis. I agree completely that the K3S is an upgrade to the K3, and an existing K3 can be upgraded to almost the equal of the K3S - the RF board cannot be upgraded, but just about all the other changes can be incorporated into your K3 should that be desirable. I consider this upgrade to be similar to what happened to the K2 at serial number 3000. The boards were redesigned, and all the prior upgrades were incorporated into the new boards. The older A level boards could be upgraded with the kits provided by Elecraft, and there were only a few minor differences between an upgraded A level K2 and the newer B level. I believe Elecraft is unique in allowing customers to upgrade to the latest level by providing upgrade kits at a modest price. 73, Don W3FPR On 7/29/2015 5:51 AM, dyarnes wrote: > That's the "trap" that other manufacturers get you into, but not > Elecraft. The TS-590 may be a good example. The new "SG" model is > significantly improved. I think there was some sort of upgrade > process for older models, but I don't think it went all the way to > "SG" equivalency--not in the way a K3 can be upgraded to nearly > identical specs to the K3S. Anyway, if that is not a good example, > there are plenty of others that do make this point. > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
Is there a good reason to buy a K3S
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In reply to this post by w7aqk
I agree as well. Buying a K3S has been tempting in the way that buying
the latest model car sometimes is - though I should disclose that one of my cars is 14 years old and well into its second 100,000 miles. But as a practical matter, with the K3 upgrades (which I am doing), that temptation hasn’t moved me to buy the new model. One improvement that would make me jump to a new model, almost regardless of the cost, probably won’t be available until the K8 or K9, namely a Blue Tooth-type system for ridding my desk of the cabling jungle connecting the K3 to the KPA500, the KAT500, the P3, the PR6-10 (yes, I know that one is in the K3S) and all the rest. OK, I’d allow two to remain - DC in and RF out. As for the related question, of someone who has no K3 buying a used K3 versus a new K3S, two variables would be important to me. One would be cost. The other would be quality. I would rather buy a K3S kit than a used K3 even if factory-built, to have the advantage of knowing my radio more intimately by building it. That difference would be worth a goodly amount of difference in the price. In addition, buying a used anything is always a trip into the unknown, with no guarantees and the risk of problems, disagreements, and all of that. Avoiding that sort of risk is also worth a substantial amount of money. The analysis of that question is different from that of the question of upgrading an existing K3 versus buying a K3S: While I plan to keep my 100,000+ mile car indefinitely rather than trade it in on a new one, only someone truly desperate should want to buy the old one from me, regardless of the lower price. (But I am open to offers - it’s a cream puff 2001 Infiniti QX4 as is / where is - replies off-line, please.) Ted, KN1CBR >Message: 6 >Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2015 09:08:40 -0400 >From: Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> >To: [hidden email] >Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Is there a good reason to buy a K3S >Message-ID: <[hidden email]> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed > >David, > >A very good analysis. >I agree completely that the K3S is an upgrade to the K3, and an existing >K3 can be upgraded to almost the equal of the K3S - the RF board cannot >be upgraded, but just about all the other changes can be incorporated >into your K3 should that be desirable. > >I consider this upgrade to be similar to what happened to the K2 at >serial number 3000. The boards were redesigned, and all the prior >upgrades were incorporated into the new boards. The older A level >boards could be upgraded with the kits provided by Elecraft, and there >were only a few minor differences between an upgraded A level K2 and the >newer B level. > >I believe Elecraft is unique in allowing customers to upgrade to the >latest level by providing upgrade kits at a modest price. > >73, >Don W3FPR > Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
Re: Is there a good reason to buy a K3S
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-----Original Message-----
From: Dauer, Edward Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2015 7:31 AM To: [hidden email] Subject: [Elecraft] Is there a good reason to buy a K3S >I I would rather buy a K3S kit than a >used K3 even if factory-built, to have the advantage of knowing >my radio >more intimately by building it. ------------------------------------------------------ This point gets expressed frequently, but I don't really feel that way about the K3 that I assembled. Building a K3 is really a mindless process of bolting together subassemblies following a very well designed checklist. A few months later, all of the individual steps get erased from active memory, and when the time comes for disassembly to perform a mod or repair, I have to dig out a checklist for how to disassemble the radio. About the only thing I remember is how to take off and reinstall the top cover. For example, when I recently smoked Diode D5 on the KXV3, I had to dig out a procedure for installing the RXA Board on the KXV3 to tell me how to gain access to the KXV3. It's not like I remembered how to take the radio all apart. On the other hand, I can say, "OK, I built this %$#@, so I guess I can follow a checklist to take it apart and fix it." Doing the mods on an older radio, and fixing failed items have actually been more beneficial to me than the initial build, because I have become more confident, and purchased more tools to handle SMD's. By the way, here's the best $8 tool I have found for working with SMD's: http://www.amazon.com/SE-MH1047L-Illuminated-Multi-Power-Magnifier/dp/B003UCODIA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1438269064&sr=8-1&keywords=headband+magnifier Dave Hachadorian, K6LL Yuma, AZ . ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
Re: Is there a good reason to buy a K3S
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In reply to this post by Edward A. Dauer
On Thu,7/30/2015 7:31 AM, Dauer, Edward wrote:
> One improvement that would make me > jump to a new model, almost regardless of the cost, probably won’t be > available until the K8 or K9, namely a Blue Tooth-type system Blue Tooth is not practical in many ham applications because of latency. ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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