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Want to Buy a K3

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Larry stowell

Want to Buy a K3

I just got back to the "Frost Fest" and played with a K3 I'm 95% sure I'm going buy a K3. I want to
start and build. I have to start with the K3/100 as 10 watts won't drive my amp. I have a SteppIR
so the tuner isn't needed. My question what is the minimum filters. I don't do CW, I do RTTY
contests and voice contests.

Thanks

73
Larry K1ZW/4
Durham, NC

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Jack Brabham KZ5A

Re: Want to Buy a K3

Larry,

The 250hz 8 pole is amazingly good in a RTTY contest and appears to me
to be about as narrow as can be used. The 500 hz 8 pole Inrad is a
little more versatile but not quite as good at holding onto a run frequency.

I use the 1.8kc for SSB contesting but I think the Inrad 1.5 kc would be
better and plan to pick one up before the fall SSB contests.

73 Jack KZ5A

On 2/6/2011 7:01 AM, Larry stowell wrote:

> I just got back to the "Frost Fest" and played with a K3 I'm 95% sure I'm going buy a K3. I want to
> start and build. I have to start with the K3/100 as 10 watts won't drive my amp. I have a SteppIR
> so the tuner isn't needed. My question what is the minimum filters. I don't do CW, I do RTTY
> contests and voice contests.
>
> Thanks
>
> 73
> Larry K1ZW/4
> Durham, NC
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
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Dick Dievendorff

Re: Want to Buy a K3

In reply to this post by Larry stowell

The minimum is the 5-pole 2.7 kHz filter included in the base price.

73 de Dick, K6KR

On Feb 6, 2011, at 7:01, "Larry stowell" <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dave Hachadorian

Re: Want to Buy a K3

In reply to this post by Larry stowell

Hi Larry,

I do RTTY and SSB contesting too. I settled on the stock 2.7 for ssb
ragchewing, 1.8 for ssb contesting, and 250 for cw and rtty contesting. I
had some others, but sold them. In the config menu, tell the K3 that the
1.8 is really a 2.1, and tell the k3 that the 250 is a 400. That way, they
will switch in at dsp bandwidth of 2.1 and 400 respectively. Those filters
sound great that way. The 250, with dsp set at about 350, is nice & flat
on the mmtty display over the entire 170 hz distance between the mark &
space, and a little beyond.

Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
Yuma, AZ

-----Original Message-----
From: Larry stowell
Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2011 6:01 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] Want to Buy a K3

I just got back to the "Frost Fest" and played with a K3 I'm 95% sure I'm
going buy a K3. I want to
start and build. I have to start with the K3/100 as 10 watts won't drive
my amp. I have a SteppIR
so the tuner isn't needed. My question what is the minimum filters. I don't
do CW, I do RTTY
contests and voice contests.

Thanks

73
Larry K1ZW/4
Durham, NC

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Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: Want to Buy a K3

In reply to this post by Jack Brabham KZ5A

>> The 250hz 8 pole is amazingly good in a RTTY contest and appears to
>> me to be about as narrow as can be used. The 500 hz 8 pole Inrad is
>> a little more versatile but not quite as good at holding onto a
>> runfrequency.

The 400 Hz INRAD is probably the best compromise. Wide enough for
tuning the band but good skirts/reasonable selectivity. The 250
would seem to require rather critical tuning.

>> I use the 1.8kc for SSB contesting but I think the Inrad 1.5 kc
>> would be better and plan to pick one up before the fall SSB
>> contests.

I find the 1.5 KHz filter to be too tight (I have a couple). It
requires too much adjustment to be useful, particularly in the
"heat of "battle." The overall difference between 1500 and 1800
in the IF doesn't mean much when using a more narrow DSP setting
but it is significant in ease of use when tuning.

73,

... Joe, W4TV

On 2/6/2011 9:09 AM, Jack Brabham wrote:

> Larry,
>
> The 250hz 8 pole is amazingly good in a RTTY contest and appears to me
> to be about as narrow as can be used. The 500 hz 8 pole Inrad is a
> little more versatile but not quite as good at holding onto a run frequency.
>
> I use the 1.8kc for SSB contesting but I think the Inrad 1.5 kc would be
> better and plan to pick one up before the fall SSB contests.
>
> 73 Jack KZ5A
>
> On 2/6/2011 7:01 AM, Larry stowell wrote:
>> I just got back to the "Frost Fest" and played with a K3 I'm 95% sure I'm going buy a K3. I want to
>> start and build. I have to start with the K3/100 as 10 watts won't drive my amp. I have a SteppIR
>> so the tuner isn't needed. My question what is the minimum filters. I don't do CW, I do RTTY
>> contests and voice contests.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> 73
>> Larry K1ZW/4
>> Durham, NC
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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Jim Brown-10

Re: Want to Buy a K3

In reply to this post by Dave Hachadorian

On 2/6/2011 7:10 AM, Dave Hachadorian wrote:
> I do RTTY and SSB contesting too. I settled on the stock 2.7 for ssb
> ragchewing, 1.8 for ssb contesting, and 250 for cw and rtty contesting. I
> had some others, but sold them. In the config menu, tell the K3 that the
> 1.8 is really a 2.1, and tell the k3 that the 250 is a 400. That way, they
> will switch in at dsp bandwidth of 2.1 and 400 respectively. Those filters
> sound great that way. The 250, with dsp set at about 350, is nice& flat
> on the mmtty display over the entire 170 hz distance between the mark&
> space, and a little beyond.

I strongly agree with all of Dave's advice.

73, Jim K9YC
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KD8NNU

Re: Want to Buy a K3

In reply to this post by Larry stowell

Hi Larry,

I do a lot of SSB work and now starting the digital stuff. I find that
I am always going down to 1.8 or less on SSB phone in noisy conditions.
So if to do it again I would not have gotton the 2.1.

Second am finding that I am going down to 100 hz for psk work and I am
thinking about getting a 500 hz filter to add. One of the great things
is that you can easily add filters later after you figure out how you
are going to actually use the radio.

In fact I am in California this week and hope to stop by the factory to
see if I can buy some goodies direct and save on the shipping.

Don

Don
KD8NNU

On Sun, Feb 6, 2011 at 7:10 AM, Dave Hachadorian wrote:

> Hi Larry,
>
> I do RTTY and SSB contesting too. I settled on the stock 2.7 for ssb
> ragchewing, 1.8 for ssb contesting, and 250 for cw and rtty
> contesting. I had some others, but sold them. In the config menu,
> tell the K3 that the 1.8 is really a 2.1, and tell the k3 that the 250
> is a 400. That way, they will switch in at dsp bandwidth of 2.1 and
> 400 respectively. Those filters sound great that way. The 250, with
> dsp set at about 350, is nice & flat on the mmtty display over the
> entire 170 hz distance between the mark & space, and a little beyond.
>
>
> Dave Hachadorian, K6LL
> Yuma, AZ
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message----- From: Larry stowell
> Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2011 6:01 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] Want to Buy a K3
>
> I just got back to the "Frost Fest" and played with a K3 I'm 95% sure
> I'm going buy a K3. I want to
> start and build. I have to start with the K3/100 as 10 watts won't
> drive my amp. I have a SteppIR
> so the tuner isn't needed. My question what is the minimum filters. I
> don't do CW, I do RTTY
> contests and voice contests.
>
> Thanks
>
> 73
> Larry K1ZW/4
> Durham, NC
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

KD8NNU

Re: Want to Buy a K3

In reply to this post by Larry stowell

Hi Jack,

Would you please be so kind as to explain what you mean by holding onto
a run frequency.

Also why the 8 pole vs the 5 pole, if you dont mind.

Don
KD8NNU

On Sun, Feb 6, 2011 at 6:09 AM, Jack Brabham wrote:

> Larry,
>
> The 250hz 8 pole is amazingly good in a RTTY contest and appears to me
> to be about as narrow as can be used. The 500 hz 8 pole Inrad is a
> little more versatile but not quite as good at holding onto a run
> frequency.
>
> I use the 1.8kc for SSB contesting but I think the Inrad 1.5 kc would
> be better and plan to pick one up before the fall SSB contests.
>
> 73 Jack KZ5A
>
> On 2/6/2011 7:01 AM, Larry stowell wrote:
>> I just got back to the "Frost Fest" and played with a K3 I'm 95% sure
>> I'm going buy a K3. I want to
>> start and build. I have to start with the K3/100 as 10 watts won't
>> drive my amp. I have a SteppIR
>> so the tuner isn't needed. My question what is the minimum filters. I
>> don't do CW, I do RTTY
>> contests and voice contests.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> 73
>> Larry K1ZW/4
>> Durham, NC
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Maarten-2

Re: Want to Buy a K3

In reply to this post by Larry stowell

I have a fully loaded K3 / 100 watt sn3418 for sale. Perfect working and
cosmetic condition. Non smoker. K3 / 100 comes with the following options:

KAT3 internal ATU, KRX3 second receiver with matched 2.7Khz 5 pole filter,
KXV3A 2nd RX, IF out, transverter interface option, 2.7KHz 5 pole SSB
filter, 250Hz 8 pole cw filter, 400Hz 8 pole cw filter, Serial to USB cable.

Asking price $3000.00.

73 Maarten N1DZ

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Jim Brown-10

Re: Want to Buy a K3

In reply to this post by Joe Subich, W4TV-4

On 2/6/2011 7:28 AM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:
> The 400 Hz INRAD is probably the best compromise. Wide enough for
> tuning the band but good skirts/reasonable selectivity. The 250
> would seem to require rather critical tuning.

The words "would seem" suggests that you have not actually used the 250
Hz filter, or have not used it much. I HAVE used both 250 Hz and 400 Hz
8-pole filters extensively, and I do NOT feel that the 250 Hz filter is
too narrow or that it requires "rather critical tuning." The -6dB
bandwidth is roughly 330-350 Hz, so if you use it as K6LL has suggested
(that is, tell the K3 it's a 400 Hz filter), it's nearly ideal for
crowded band CW and RTTY contesting. If you want to listen wider, simply
use the width control.

> I find the 1.5 KHz filter to be too tight (I have a couple). It
> requires too much adjustment to be useful, particularly in the
> "heat of "battle." The overall difference between 1500 and 1800
> in the IF doesn't mean much when using a more narrow DSP setting
> but it is significant in ease of use when tuning.

I haven't used the 1.5 kHz filter, but I use the 1.8 kHz filter
virtually all the time for SSB contesting. I find it rather tweaky to
tune "just right," and I definitely would NOT want anything narrower for
SSB. I tell the K3 that it is a 2 kHz filter.

73, Jim K9YC
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David Gilbert

Re: Want to Buy a K3

I bought the 1.5 kHz filters instead of the 1.8 kHz filters, and I don't
find them particularly difficult to tune even in a contest. The key, of
course, is to adjust the Shift down to somewhere between 950 Hz and 1050
Hz. The only problem I've ever had with them is that some voices have
such an extreme pitch that it is necessary to adjust the Shift for
clarity, but that is rarely necessary.

That all being said, I don't think the 1.5 kHz filters provide that much
of an advantage for SSB compared with the 1.8 kHz filters. We're
talking roofing filters, after all, and generally speaking there are
very times that very strong adjacent SSB signals occupy the space
between 1.5 kHz and 1.8 kHz AND are clean enough not to spill over into
both passbands anyway. I think the great majority of the time the 1.8
kHz filters with a narrower DSP setting would work excellently, and some
voices have better intelligibility at 1.8 kHz than they do at 1.5 kHz.

If I were buying them again I'd probably go with the 1.8 kHz filters.

73,
Dave AB7E

>> I find the 1.5 KHz filter to be too tight (I have a couple). It
>> requires too much adjustment to be useful, particularly in the
>> "heat of "battle." The overall difference between 1500 and 1800
>> in the IF doesn't mean much when using a more narrow DSP setting
>> but it is significant in ease of use when tuning.
> I haven't used the 1.5 kHz filter, but I use the 1.8 kHz filter
> virtually all the time for SSB contesting. I find it rather tweaky to
> tune "just right," and I definitely would NOT want anything narrower for
> SSB. I tell the K3 that it is a 2 kHz filter.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
> ______________

Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: Want to Buy a K3

In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

>> The words "would seem" suggests that you have not actually used the
>> 250 Hz filter, or have not used it much. I HAVE used both 250 Hz
>> and 400 Hz 8-pole filters extensively, and I do NOT feel that the
>> 250 Hz filter is too narrow or that it requires "rather critical
>> tuning."

No, I have not used the specific INRAD "250 Hz" filter in the K3. I
have, however, used 300 - 370 Hz filters in other transceivers, the
Elecraft 200 Hz filter, and operated the K3 with DSP bandwidth set
to 300 Hz +/- and the INRAD 400 Hz filter ... all of which provide a
strong basis for understanding the behavior of cascaded IF/DSP filters
at various bandwidths.

I find that composite bandwidths much below 400 Hz make it difficult
to tune an RTTY signal. Narrowing the bandwidth to as little as 300
Hz does help with strong adjacent QRM once a signal is tuned but it
is nearly impossible for me to to tune a new signal at that bandwidth.

>> The -6dB bandwidth is roughly 330-350 Hz, so if you use it as K6LL
>> has suggested (that is, tell the K3 it's a 400 Hz filter), it's
>> nearly ideal for crowded band CW and RTTY contesting. If you want
>> to listen wider, simply use the width control.

Using the width control is not a good solution as going wider than
400 Hz with the "250 Hz" (350 nominal) selects the next wider filter
which can result in the loss of IMD and overload protection. The
400 Hz filter is, in my opinion, a better compromise for CW and RTTY
than the "250 Hz" filter. If more selectivity is needed for CW,
adding the 200 Hz filter becomes worthwhile for CW only.

73,

... Joe, W4TV

On 2/7/2011 3:24 PM, Jim Brown wrote:

> On 2/6/2011 7:28 AM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:
>> The 400 Hz INRAD is probably the best compromise. Wide enough for
>> tuning the band but good skirts/reasonable selectivity. The 250
>> would seem to require rather critical tuning.
>
> The words "would seem" suggests that you have not actually used the 250
> Hz filter, or have not used it much. I HAVE used both 250 Hz and 400 Hz
> 8-pole filters extensively, and I do NOT feel that the 250 Hz filter is
> too narrow or that it requires "rather critical tuning." The -6dB
> bandwidth is roughly 330-350 Hz, so if you use it as K6LL has suggested
> (that is, tell the K3 it's a 400 Hz filter), it's nearly ideal for
> crowded band CW and RTTY contesting. If you want to listen wider, simply
> use the width control.
>
>> I find the 1.5 KHz filter to be too tight (I have a couple). It
>> requires too much adjustment to be useful, particularly in the
>> "heat of "battle." The overall difference between 1500 and 1800
>> in the IF doesn't mean much when using a more narrow DSP setting
>> but it is significant in ease of use when tuning.
>
> I haven't used the 1.5 kHz filter, but I use the 1.8 kHz filter
> virtually all the time for SSB contesting. I find it rather tweaky to
> tune "just right," and I definitely would NOT want anything narrower for
> SSB. I tell the K3 that it is a 2 kHz filter.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>
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