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computer - P3 - K3 communications blues

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eric manning-2

computer - P3 - K3 communications blues

I have a Windows XP box connected to my K3 using a USB port on the box
and a Prolific
USB-to-Serial adapter. It all works FB, N1MM Logger and SKimmer talk to
the K3
via LP Bridge and the USB/serial link perfectly, including N1MM keying
the rig.

THEN I hooked up my nice new P3 today.
It talks to the K3 FB - it gets freq data from the K3 and sends VFO
changes to the K3.
Everything else I've tested on the P3 also seems to work FB.

HOWEVER, the PC cannot talk to the K3 THROUGH the P3 - via either the
Prolific USB/serial link - or via a purely RS-232 link using the serial
port on the windows box, which I also tried.
[Just in case it was a USB incompatibility issue]

K3 Utility running in the Windows box polls the K3 via the link and the
P3 and gets no response.
Everything is set to 38,400 baud, 8 data bits, 1 stop bit, no parity.
The P3 is running the firmware which was installed at Elecraft, it was
shipped to me a week ago.

Any suggestions - please?

Eric VA7DZ

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Alan Bloom

Re: computer - P3 - K3 communications blues

It may be a baud rate issue. You can change the baud rate of the
PC-to-PC link in a MENU entry in the P3 called "RS232".

Note that changing the baud rate of the K3 doesn't do anything when the
P3 is connected. The P3 will change it right back to 38400. The baud
rate that the computer sees is the one that is set in the P3 menu.

Alan N1AL

On 3/15/2013 5:58 PM, eric manning wrote:

> I have a Windows XP box connected to my K3 using a USB port on the box
> and a Prolific
> USB-to-Serial adapter. It all works FB, N1MM Logger and SKimmer talk to
> the K3
> via LP Bridge and the USB/serial link perfectly, including N1MM keying
> the rig.
>
> THEN I hooked up my nice new P3 today.
> It talks to the K3 FB - it gets freq data from the K3 and sends VFO
> changes to the K3.
> Everything else I've tested on the P3 also seems to work FB.
>
> HOWEVER, the PC cannot talk to the K3 THROUGH the P3 - via either the
> Prolific USB/serial link - or via a purely RS-232 link using the serial
> port on the windows box, which I also tried.
> [Just in case it was a USB incompatibility issue]
>
> K3 Utility running in the Windows box polls the K3 via the link and the
> P3 and gets no response.
> Everything is set to 38,400 baud, 8 data bits, 1 stop bit, no parity.
> The P3 is running the firmware which was installed at Elecraft, it was
> shipped to me a week ago.
>
> Any suggestions - please?
>
> Eric VA7DZ
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

N5GE

Re: computer - P3 - K3 communications blues

In reply to this post by eric manning-2

Eric,

You should be able to run one and only one additional application to
the P3. Once you have one application connected to the P3 serial
port, that application blocks any other applications from using the
serial port the K3 the P3 are using. So if you are trying to use the
same serial port for more than one software application it will not
use the P3 port. It will give you a port in use error message.

73,
Tom
Amateur Radio Operator N5GE
ARRL Lifetime Member
QCWA Lifetime Member

On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 17:58:27 -0700, eric manning
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>I have a Windows XP box connected to my K3 using a USB port on the box
>and a Prolific
>USB-to-Serial adapter. It all works FB, N1MM Logger and SKimmer talk to
>the K3
>via LP Bridge and the USB/serial link perfectly, including N1MM keying
>the rig.
>
>THEN I hooked up my nice new P3 today.
>It talks to the K3 FB - it gets freq data from the K3 and sends VFO
>changes to the K3.
>Everything else I've tested on the P3 also seems to work FB.
>
>HOWEVER, the PC cannot talk to the K3 THROUGH the P3 - via either the
>Prolific USB/serial link - or via a purely RS-232 link using the serial
>port on the windows box, which I also tried.
>[Just in case it was a USB incompatibility issue]
>
>K3 Utility running in the Windows box polls the K3 via the link and the
>P3 and gets no response.
>Everything is set to 38,400 baud, 8 data bits, 1 stop bit, no parity.
>The P3 is running the firmware which was installed at Elecraft, it was
>shipped to me a week ago.
>
>Any suggestions - please?
>
>Eric VA7DZ
>
>
>
>
>
>

Amateur Radio Operator N5GE

ke9uw

Re: computer - P3 - K3 communications blues

A little confusing...maybe just me...
But, the K3 and P3 are on the same port and you can only have one of the utilities open at a time. K3 or P3 but not both at the same time.

Chuck, KE9UW
AARL, CCA
Lionel Trains TCA, LCCA, LRRC
aka Jack, BMW Motorcycles BMWRA, BMWMOA #224
________________________________________
From: [hidden email] [[hidden email]] on behalf of Tom H Childers [[hidden email]]
Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:30 PM
To: eric manning
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] computer - P3 - K3 communications blues

Eric,

You should be able to run one and only one additional application to
the P3. Once you have one application connected to the P3 serial
port, that application blocks any other applications from using the
serial port the K3 the P3 are using. So if you are trying to use the
same serial port for more than one software application it will not
use the P3 port. It will give you a port in use error message.

73,
Tom
Amateur Radio Operator N5GE
ARRL Lifetime Member
QCWA Lifetime Member

On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 17:58:27 -0700, eric manning
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>I have a Windows XP box connected to my K3 using a USB port on the box
>and a Prolific
>USB-to-Serial adapter. It all works FB, N1MM Logger and SKimmer talk to
>the K3
>via LP Bridge and the USB/serial link perfectly, including N1MM keying
>the rig.
>
>THEN I hooked up my nice new P3 today.
>It talks to the K3 FB - it gets freq data from the K3 and sends VFO
>changes to the K3.
>Everything else I've tested on the P3 also seems to work FB.
>
>HOWEVER, the PC cannot talk to the K3 THROUGH the P3 - via either the
>Prolific USB/serial link - or via a purely RS-232 link using the serial
>port on the windows box, which I also tried.
>[Just in case it was a USB incompatibility issue]
>
>K3 Utility running in the Windows box polls the K3 via the link and the
>P3 and gets no response.
>Everything is set to 38,400 baud, 8 data bits, 1 stop bit, no parity.
>The P3 is running the firmware which was installed at Elecraft, it was
>shipped to me a week ago.
>
>Any suggestions - please?
>
>Eric VA7DZ
>
>
>
>
>
>

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______________________________________________________________
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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Chuck, KE9UW

ve3dvy

Re: computer - P3 - K3 communications blues

In reply to this post by N5GE

> "You should be able to run one and only one additional application to
> the P3. Once you have one application connected to the P3 serial port,
> that application blocks any other applications from using the serial
> port the K3 the P3 are using. So if you are trying to use the same
> serial port for more than one software application it will not use the
> P3 port. It will give you a port in use error message. "

Isn't LP-Bridge going to allow more than one application to talk to the
serial port? I thought that is one of its main purposes.

alternatively and much simpler than LP-Bridge to solve this you can use
vspe from eterlogic. This can create a splitter to allow any number off
applications to access a virtual port that is all routed into one
physical Comm port. works for me. I often have logger32, MMSSTV
FLDIGI all working at once. I can even have K3 utilities and K3eze
all connected at the same time using VSPE.

All that said it seems that the OP cant even connect one program.
Id also check that that all the cabling is correct. IE PC to P3 and P3
to K3 aren't reversed. try removing the P3 from the picture just to
double check that the serial port to K3 is working. also shut down
LPbridge and try using the port directly with only K3 utilities using
that port. I am not totally familiar with LP bridge so I am not sure
if there is extra configuration if using the P3.

73

David Moes

[hidden email]
VE3DVY

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Don Wilhelm-4

Re: computer - P3 - K3 communications blues

The K3 and P3 Utility programs should not be run through LP Bridge.
LP-Bridge does not transfer everything used by the Utilities.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 3/16/2013 8:38 AM, david Moes wrote:

>
>> "You should be able to run one and only one additional application to
>> the P3. Once you have one application connected to the P3 serial
>> port, that application blocks any other applications from using the
>> serial port the K3 the P3 are using. So if you are trying to use the
>> same serial port for more than one software application it will not
>> use the P3 port. It will give you a port in use error message. "
>
>
> Isn't LP-Bridge going to allow more than one application to talk to
> the serial port? I thought that is one of its main purposes.
>
> alternatively and much simpler than LP-Bridge to solve this you can
> use vspe from eterlogic. This can create a splitter to allow any
> number off applications to access a virtual port that is all routed
> into one physical Comm port. works for me. I often have logger32,
> MMSSTV FLDIGI all working at once. I can even have K3 utilities and
> K3eze all connected at the same time using VSPE.
>
> All that said it seems that the OP cant even connect one program.
> Id also check that that all the cabling is correct. IE PC to P3 and
> P3 to K3 aren't reversed. try removing the P3 from the picture just
> to double check that the serial port to K3 is working. also shut
> down LPbridge and try using the port directly with only K3 utilities
> using that port. I am not totally familiar with LP bridge so I am
> not sure if there is extra configuration if using the P3.
>
> 73
>
> David Moes
>
> [hidden email]
> VE3DVY
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

ve3dvy

Re: computer - P3 - K3 communications blues

Hey Don
How about VSPE Ive often wondered if it passes everything. Its
simplicity makes me think that it possibly more efficient which may be a
bad assumption. Ive not had any issues with it and while I would not
use it while upgrading firmware or calibrations etc. I do use it using
terminal etc with the K3 Utilities.

On 3/16/2013 08:49, Don Wilhelm wrote:

> The K3 and P3 Utility programs should not be run through LP Bridge.
> LP-Bridge does not transfer everything used by the Utilities.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 3/16/2013 8:38 AM, david Moes wrote:
>>
>>> "You should be able to run one and only one additional application
>>> to the P3. Once you have one application connected to the P3 serial
>>> port, that application blocks any other applications from using the
>>> serial port the K3 the P3 are using. So if you are trying to use the
>>> same serial port for more than one software application it will not
>>> use the P3 port. It will give you a port in use error message. "
>>
>>
>> Isn't LP-Bridge going to allow more than one application to talk to
>> the serial port? I thought that is one of its main purposes.
>>
>> alternatively and much simpler than LP-Bridge to solve this you can
>> use vspe from eterlogic. This can create a splitter to allow any
>> number off applications to access a virtual port that is all routed
>> into one physical Comm port. works for me. I often have logger32,
>> MMSSTV FLDIGI all working at once. I can even have K3 utilities
>> and K3eze all connected at the same time using VSPE.
>>
>> All that said it seems that the OP cant even connect one
>> program. Id also check that that all the cabling is correct.
>> IE PC to P3 and P3 to K3 aren't reversed. try removing the P3 from
>> the picture just to double check that the serial port to K3 is
>> working. also shut down LPbridge and try using the port directly
>> with only K3 utilities using that port. I am not totally familiar
>> with LP bridge so I am not sure if there is extra configuration if
>> using the P3.
>>
>> 73
>>
>> David Moes
>>
>> [hidden email]
>> VE3DVY
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

N8LP

Re: computer - P3 - K3 communications blues

In reply to this post by eric manning-2

FWIW...

LP-Bridge blocks the commands used by K3 Utility because I don't want
anyone trying to flash new firmware through LP-Bridge. I am of the
opinion that flashing firmware should only be done by a direct
connection to the K3. This was a conscious choice. I have talked to Dick
about ways to possibly open up LP-Bridge for other functions of Utility,
but haven't had time to address this. To handle many of the terminal
functions of K3 Utility, users can run a program like K-Keys on one of
the virtual ports.

Programs like VSPE pass all traffic from all apps to the K3. Any and all
traffic will be sent to the K3, asynchronously as it is received from
all apps. There are several potential problems with this. First, you
could wind up with scrambled commands, second you will wind up with a
high degree of duplication of commands and thirdly you can wind up with
multiple apps sending competing meta commands, AIx, K2x and K3x, to the K3.

LP-Bridge blocks meta commands and puts the rig into a fixed state. It
blocks all polling requests for the most common commands and instead
does the polling for these commands itself. Since it already knows the
state of each of these params, it can answer each app individually and
asynchronously from memory. It only allows less often used commands to
pass directly to the rig. This dramatically reduces the traffic to the
K3. There is a limit to how much traffic the K3 can handle, and
exceeding this limit can, or at least has in the past, caused issues...
like loss of ALC during transmit during long transmissions.

There are always trade-offs, but my imprimatur is to protect the rig
while allowing app sharing. Is it the perfect solution for every need?
No, nothing is.

73,
Larry N8LP

On 3/16/2013 11:37 PM, [hidden email] wrote:

> Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2013 13:32:25 -0400
> From: david Moes<[hidden email]>
> To:[hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] computer - P3 - K3 communications blues
> Message-ID:<[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hey Don
> How about VSPE Ive often wondered if it passes everything. Its
> simplicity makes me think that it possibly more efficient which may be a
> bad assumption. Ive not had any issues with it and while I would not
> use it while upgrading firmware or calibrations etc. I do use it using
> terminal etc with the K3 Utilities.
>
>
> On 3/16/2013 08:49, Don Wilhelm wrote:
>> > The K3 and P3 Utility programs should not be run through LP Bridge.
>> > LP-Bridge does not transfer everything used by the Utilities.
>> >
>> > 73,
>> > Don W3FPR
>> >
>> > On 3/16/2013 8:38 AM, david Moes wrote:
>>> >>
>>>> >>> "You should be able to run one and only one additional application
>>>> >>> to the P3. Once you have one application connected to the P3 serial
>>>> >>> port, that application blocks any other applications from using the
>>>> >>> serial port the K3 the P3 are using. So if you are trying to use the
>>>> >>> same serial port for more than one software application it will not
>>>> >>> use the P3 port. It will give you a port in use error message. "
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> Isn't LP-Bridge going to allow more than one application to talk to
>>> >> the serial port? I thought that is one of its main purposes.
>>> >>
>>> >> alternatively and much simpler than LP-Bridge to solve this you can
>>> >> use vspe from eterlogic. This can create a splitter to allow any
>>> >> number off applications to access a virtual port that is all routed
>>> >> into one physical Comm port. works for me. I often have logger32,
>>> >> MMSSTV FLDIGI all working at once. I can even have K3 utilities
>>> >> and K3eze all connected at the same time using VSPE.
>>> >>
>>> >> All that said it seems that the OP cant even connect one
>>> >> program. Id also check that that all the cabling is correct.
>>> >> IE PC to P3 and P3 to K3 aren't reversed. try removing the P3 from
>>> >> the picture just to double check that the serial port to K3 is
>>> >> working. also shut down LPbridge and try using the port directly
>>> >> with only K3 utilities using that port. I am not totally familiar
>>> >> with LP bridge so I am not sure if there is extra configuration if
>>> >> using the P3.
>>> >>
>>> >> 73
>>> >>
>>> >> David Moes
>>> >>
>>> >> [hidden email]
>>> >> VE3DVY