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kxpd3 question

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KM3K

kxpd3 question

Hello,

I'm a "no-code-ham" determined to become a "know-code-ham" and so have signed up to a course by CWops.

They require a paddle for sending practice since lessons will be done at 20-wpm.

Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I think that a single paddle might work best for me.

Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:

1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence with a dual-paddle,

2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.

In reading my KX3-manual and Fred-KE7X's book, it seems to me that the KXPD3 is capable of only dual-paddle operating. Or have I missed something?

I understand that my KX3 has a second port for an external key (I presume a single-paddle).

In the past, I recall seeing photos of hams working KX3-portable with a straight-key but, at those times, I did not pay attention if any had a paddle.

TIA for any reply.

73 Jerry KM3K
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Clay Autery-2

Re: kxpd3 question

JUST finished Level 1 of the CW Academy here.

I chose the Begali HST Mark II. They've moved on to the Mark III now.
They are expensive, but I have absolutely zero regrets. I love, love,
love, my key. Worth every cent I paid for it.

When I pass 25 wpm and hopefully gain entry to CW Ops, I will treat
myself to a Sculpture Mono... just because. Frankly, I'll never NEED
another key.

IF you are serious.... don't muck around. Get a serious key. "Buy the
best tools you can afford, and only have to buy them once." -My Dad

I can't help you with the KX3 questions... My K3s works just fine with
a single paddle.

73,
Clay, KY5G

On 11/09/17 08:14, JEROME SODUS wrote:

> Hello,
>
>
> I'm a "no-code-ham" determined to become a "know-code-ham" and so have signed up to a course by CWops.
>
> They require a paddle for sending practice since lessons will be done at 20-wpm.
>
>
> Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I think that a single paddle might work best for me.
>
> Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:
>
> 1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence with a dual-paddle,
>
> 2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.
>
>
> In reading my KX3-manual and Fred-KE7X's book, it seems to me that the KXPD3 is capable of only dual-paddle operating. Or have I missed something?
>
>
> I understand that my KX3 has a second port for an external key (I presume a single-paddle).
>
> In the past, I recall seeing photos of hams working KX3-portable with a straight-key but, at those times, I did not pay attention if any had a paddle.
>
>
> TIA for any reply.
>
> 73 Jerry KM3K
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

Vic Rosenthal

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by KM3K

Jerry,

A real single paddle is nice, but you can still send non-iambically with
a dual paddle. Just don't squeeze it. You make a 'C' with four back and
forth motions instead of a squeeze.

The connections to the rig for a single or dual paddle are the same. The
only difference is in the mechanical design of the paddle. A single
paddle cannot close both dit and dah contacts at the same time. With a
dual paddle, you can -- but you don't need to.

73,
Victor, 4X6GP
Rehovot, Israel
Formerly K2VCO
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/
CWA Adviser

On 9 Nov 2017 16:14, JEROME SODUS wrote:

> Hello,
>
>
> I'm a "no-code-ham" determined to become a "know-code-ham" and so
> have signed up to a course by CWops.
>
> They require a paddle for sending practice since lessons will be done
> at 20-wpm.
>
>
> Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I
> think that a single paddle might work best for me.
>
> Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:
>
> 1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence
> with a dual-paddle,
>
> 2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.
>
>
> In reading my KX3-manual and Fred-KE7X's book, it seems to me that
> the KXPD3 is capable of only dual-paddle operating. Or have I missed
> something?
>
>
> I understand that my KX3 has a second port for an external key (I
> presume a single-paddle).
>
> In the past, I recall seeing photos of hams working KX3-portable with
> a straight-key but, at those times, I did not pay attention if any
> had a paddle.
>
>
> TIA for any reply.
>
> 73 Jerry KM3K

rich hurd WC3T

Re: kxpd3 question

Victor brings up an advantage of using a dual paddle; if at some point in
the future, you want to use an iambic keying method, using a dual paddle
would afford you that capability with the initial spend.

If you never do iambic, it's only a small incremental cost between a single
and a dual lever paddle that you'll probably never miss.

He's sort of talking me into reconsidering my single lever paddle
purchase. :)

---
72,
Rich Hurd / WC3T / DMR: 3142737
PA Army MARS, Northampton County RACES, EPA-ARRL Public Information Officer
for Scouting
Latitude: 40.761621 Longitude: -75.288988 (40°45.68' N 75°17.33' W) Grid:
*FN20is*

On Thu, Nov 9, 2017 at 9:33 AM, Victor Rosenthal 4X6GP <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Jerry,
>
> A real single paddle is nice, but you can still send non-iambically with
> a dual paddle. Just don't squeeze it. You make a 'C' with four back and
> forth motions instead of a squeeze.
>
> The connections to the rig for a single or dual paddle are the same. The
> only difference is in the mechanical design of the paddle. A single paddle
> cannot close both dit and dah contacts at the same time. With a dual
> paddle, you can -- but you don't need to.
>
> 73,
> Victor, 4X6GP
> Rehovot, Israel
> Formerly K2VCO
> http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/
> CWA Adviser
>
>
> On 9 Nov 2017 16:14, JEROME SODUS wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>> I'm a "no-code-ham" determined to become a "know-code-ham" and so
>> have signed up to a course by CWops.
>>
>> They require a paddle for sending practice since lessons will be done
>> at 20-wpm.
>>
>>
>> Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I
>> think that a single paddle might work best for me.
>>
>> Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:
>>
>> 1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence
>> with a dual-paddle,
>>
>> 2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.
>>
>>
>> In reading my KX3-manual and Fred-KE7X's book, it seems to me that
>> the KXPD3 is capable of only dual-paddle operating. Or have I missed
>> something?
>>
>>
>> I understand that my KX3 has a second port for an external key (I
>> presume a single-paddle).
>>
>> In the past, I recall seeing photos of hams working KX3-portable with
>> a straight-key but, at those times, I did not pay attention if any
>> had a paddle.
>>
>>
>> TIA for any reply.
>>
>> 73 Jerry KM3K
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Elecraft mailing list

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by KM3K

Hi Jerry,

I made the decision to use a single lever paddle and not learn the
"squeeze" technique needed to run a dual lever paddle. Several reasons:

The truly high speed guys use single lever paddles--they feel they make
fewer mistakes with the single lever.

If you learn the single lever technique you can use a dual lever paddle and
just not "squeeze"

The dual lever technique doesn't save that much time.

I think that a lot of the impetus to a dual lever is "CQ", both letters are
"squeeze" letters and if you are sending it a lot it is easier to send
repeated CQ's with a dual lever paddle.

I think regular practice is needed with both single an dual lever paddles.

I am fond of my Begali Sculpture single lever, along with my Tony Baleno
single lever.

If you go single lever, if you occasionally use a dual lever paddle you
will be happier with minimal space between the paddles; it's closer to the
distance your fingers need to move for the single lever. Begali's Magnum has
a very narrow space and I use it as well as my Sculpture single lever.
Tony Baleno of N3ZN keys will make a dual lever with what ever spacing between
the paddles you want.

Hope this helps.

73

Mike KD8RQE

In a message dated 11/9/2017 9:31:16 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
[hidden email] writes:

Hello,

I'm a "no-code-ham" determined to become a "know-code-ham" and so have
signed up to a course by CWops.

They require a paddle for sending practice since lessons will be done at
20-wpm.

Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I think
that a single paddle might work best for me.

Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:

1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence with a
dual-paddle,

2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.

In reading my KX3-manual and Fred-KE7X's book, it seems to me that the
KXPD3 is capable of only dual-paddle operating. Or have I missed something?

I understand that my KX3 has a second port for an external key (I presume
a single-paddle).

In the past, I recall seeing photos of hams working KX3-portable with a
straight-key but, at those times, I did not pay attention if any had a paddle.

TIA for any reply.

73 Jerry KM3K
______________________________________________________________
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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Gary Smith-2

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by KM3K

Jerry,

I learned on a Navy key and when I got my
license, Iambic was a new thing but those
who used it, swore by it. There were a few
interfaces that used what I think was a
Curtis 8044 IC and it was a fantastic chip
to learn Iambic with. I had a "Ham Keyer"
which used it and later made my own using
this chip. It had two settings for Iambic
and one seemed more natural than the other
so I stuck with it.

I then bought a (at the time) new Corsair
II from TenTec which had a keyer built in
for Iambic but I never liked the way it
felt or operated so I stuck with that
Curtis chip. When I bought the K3 kit &
checked out the built-in Iambic option and
it was exactly what I had come to love all
along so the Curtis is now on the shelf
beside the Corsair for when I'll fire that
up again in the future. FWIW, the K3s has
that same functionality and I'm guessing
the other Elecraft rigs have the same as
well.

Iambic is efficient, it requires I think,
less motions to accomplish the same
character and it flows like water with
such little effort. I also use a Begali
Sculpture but I started with a Bencher
Iambic paddle, moved to a Vibroplex Iambic
and finally to the Begali. The original
Bencher came apart easily and always when
I was excited and I had to put it back
together (easy to do but not an elegant
thing). Maybe they've attended to this
flaw by now? The Vibroplex worked very
well but seemed to require occasional
attention and could have been heavier to
stay in place during my moments of
exuberance. I ordered the Begali maybe 3
years ago and never have had to touch it.
I'm sure the other Iambic paddles made by
hand are just as good. I will likely keep
this one for what time I have left.

As the Iambic from the rig is spaced
perfectly as regards timing, it is a
perfect teacher as to how to send well.
Set your speed, go into the test mode so
you don't transmit and practice with
headphones to your heart's content. You
will find it intuitive and what you will
need to focus on is not running your
characters and words together as it is so
easy to send, you forget the point of
error is you and your not sending with the
proper gaps between characters and words.

The way to best do this on the K3/K3s is
to go to test mode! Now push the TEXT DEC
on the front panel for decoding CW, select
the TX ONLY option and you can read what
you're sending on the LCD and this will
help you get your character spacing and
word spacing down just right.

Lastly, I'm sure that whatever key you
get, you'll learn how to be comfortable
with it. For me, & me being a musician,
the timing is everything and again, for
me... Iambic was the easiest way to do it
right with the least effort.

73,

Gary
KA1J

> Hello,
>
>
> I'm a "no-code-ham" determined to become a "know-code-ham" and so have
> signed up to a course by CWops.
>
> They require a paddle for sending practice since lessons will be done
> at 20-wpm.
>
>
> Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I think
> that a single paddle might work best for me.
>
> Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:
>
> 1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence
> with a dual-paddle,
>
> 2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.
>
>
> In reading my KX3-manual and Fred-KE7X's book, it seems to me that the
> KXPD3 is capable of only dual-paddle operating. Or have I missed
> something?
>
>
> I understand that my KX3 has a second port for an external key (I
> presume a single-paddle).
>
> In the past, I recall seeing photos of hams working KX3-portable with
> a straight-key but, at those times, I did not pay attention if any had
> a paddle.
>
>
> TIA for any reply.
>
> 73 Jerry KM3K
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Dave Sublette

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by Elecraft mailing list

Jerry,

Don’t obsess over which paddle is best for you. Which ever system you choose, it will take hours and hours of off the air practice before you "should” put it on the air. Which ever system you start with, you will learn to love and prefer — if you get that far.

I use iambic B and a dual paddle, but don’t often use the squeeze feature. If you start with this, as others have pointed out, you don’t have to squeeze. My opinion is (and it is just an opinion) by starting with the dual paddle, Iambic B, you give yourself the most options to expand or change methods.

It is mostly timing and getting your internal “clock” to a place where you make proper, readable communication using Morse. An automatic keyer doesn’t do this for you. I hear plenty of people using keys who don’t send code that is comfortable to copy.

Pick something and start practicing. You will never master it until you start.

73,

Dave, K4TO

> On Nov 9, 2017, at 11:36 AM, Mike via Elecraft <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hi Jerry,
>
> I made the decision to use a single lever paddle and not learn the
> "squeeze" technique needed to run a dual lever paddle. Several reasons:
>
> The truly high speed guys use single lever paddles--they feel they make
> fewer mistakes with the single lever.
>
> If you learn the single lever technique you can use a dual lever paddle and
> just not "squeeze"
>
> The dual lever technique doesn't save that much time.
>
> I think that a lot of the impetus to a dual lever is "CQ", both letters are
> "squeeze" letters and if you are sending it a lot it is easier to send
> repeated CQ's with a dual lever paddle.
>
> I think regular practice is needed with both single an dual lever paddles.
>
> I am fond of my Begali Sculpture single lever, along with my Tony Baleno
> single lever.
>
> If you go single lever, if you occasionally use a dual lever paddle you
> will be happier with minimal space between the paddles; it's closer to the
> distance your fingers need to move for the single lever. Begali's Magnum has
> a very narrow space and I use it as well as my Sculpture single lever.
> Tony Baleno of N3ZN keys will make a dual lever with what ever spacing between
> the paddles you want.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> 73
>
> Mike KD8RQE
>
>
> In a message dated 11/9/2017 9:31:16 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> [hidden email] writes:
>
> Hello,
>
>
> I'm a "no-code-ham" determined to become a "know-code-ham" and so have
> signed up to a course by CWops.
>
> They require a paddle for sending practice since lessons will be done at
> 20-wpm.
>
>
> Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I think
> that a single paddle might work best for me.
>
> Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:
>
> 1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence with a
> dual-paddle,
>
> 2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.
>
>
> In reading my KX3-manual and Fred-KE7X's book, it seems to me that the
> KXPD3 is capable of only dual-paddle operating. Or have I missed something?
>
>
> I understand that my KX3 has a second port for an external key (I presume
> a single-paddle).
>
> In the past, I recall seeing photos of hams working KX3-portable with a
> straight-key but, at those times, I did not pay attention if any had a paddle.
>
>
> TIA for any reply.
>
> 73 Jerry KM3K
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

Elecraft mailing list

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by KM3K

Jerome,
I'm not sure why anyone would go through the process of learning to send CW and do it "single paddle". Every radio in production supports one, or both, Iambic modes, and they are actually easier to LEARN than they are to UNDERSTAND! Here is my 2-cents worth:

1. The best method of sending will be the one you learn first. This is true of MOST things we learn. That doesn't mean you can't learn a second method later, but USUALLY the first method will come back to you the easiest.

2. Reading about the differences in Iambic keying is far more complex than slowing the keyer down and listening to what happens. Slow down to around 10wpm, hold one paddle down and tap the other to learn how dit or dah insertion works and sounds. Hold both paddles down and listen to what happens when you release them. Play with it, but do it at slow speed so you can hear it. I am NOT talking about learning characters yet. That should happen at much faster speeds, and after you know what the paddles do to make dots and dashes at the right times. After playing with this for as long as you need, speed it up a bit and play some more. Eventually you can work up to the speed CW Ops recommends for learning the characters.

3. Stop trying to decide between Iambic A and B based on the analysis of what they do or how many paddle movements are required. You can listen to the differences as I have outlined in 2 above, but simply PICK ONE. I happen to like Iambic B because I learned on a homebrew AccuKeyer which died years ago. I can switch to Iambic A with a few minutes of practice, but I prefer Iambic B simply because it doesn't seem to be as sensitive to paddle release after holding both paddles closed in the letter C. Oops, there I go with too much analysis!

4. Dual paddles can be used as a single paddle. I suspect most of the single paddle operatiors were extensive bug users first (again, first learned is the easiest), but I couldn't afford a bug, so I learned Iambic B. I find that transitioning from Iambic B to single paddle is easy. I do that when necessary at events like Field Day.

5. No more maintenance is required for dual paddle modes than for any other mode. It all depends on what you learned first and what you use the most. In aviation, a pilot's total flight time is important, but accident reports indicate that recent experience is also important. Look at the aviation regulations for recent experience and you will see what I mean. Same for CW.

Well, I went over 2 cents worth!

Mark
KE6BB

On Thursday, November 9, 2017, 6:32:28 AM PST, JEROME SODUS <[hidden email]> wrote:

Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I think that a single paddle might work best for me.

Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:

1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence with a dual-paddle,

2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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EricJ-2

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by KM3K

This article answers the iambic question. Humorous and instructive:

http://www.morsex.com/pubs/iambicmyth.pdf

It's a fun skill, but saving nano-calories of effort is questionable for the majority of QSOs.

You can use either a single paddle or dual paddle without using the squeeze method. I wouldn't even try learning it until I was competent with a paddle without it. Once you are competent with any paddle, you will find it takes little effort to become accustomed to another. In fact, you will be surprised at how easily you can send either right to left handed or vice versa with little practice.

And once you're competent with a paddle, a week or so of practice and you can handle a bug. A bug isn't more difficult. It's just asymmetrical which takes some retraining. Once you are competent with that, you can handle just about anything you want to play with interchangeably.

I have more than a dozen different straight keys, bugs and paddles which I quick-change frequently. Sometimes during a QSO.

Sort of OT: The W6SFM Bug Roundup is Nov 17-19, next weekend. Its a bug-only version of Straight Key Night. I'll be there with my Drake 2B, Viking Ranger and homebrew left-handed bug (photo on QRZ.com).

Eric KE6US

On 11/9/2017 6:14 AM, JEROME SODUS wrote:

Hello,

I'm a "no-code-ham" determined to become a "know-code-ham" and so have signed up to a course by CWops.

They require a paddle for sending practice since lessons will be done at 20-wpm.

Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I think that a single paddle might work best for me.

Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:

1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence with a dual-paddle,

2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.

In reading my KX3-manual and Fred-KE7X's book, it seems to me that the KXPD3 is capable of only dual-paddle operating. Or have I missed something?

I understand that my KX3 has a second port for an external key (I presume a single-paddle).

In the past, I recall seeing photos of hams working KX3-portable with a straight-key but, at those times, I did not pay attention if any had a paddle.

TIA for any reply.

73 Jerry KM3K
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to [hidden email]<mailto:[hidden email]>
.

______________________________________________________________
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Jim Brown-10

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by KM3K

On 11/9/2017 6:14 AM, JEROME SODUS wrote:
> 1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence with a dual-paddle,
>
> 2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.

I started out around 1956 with a bug given to me by a cousin who had
been in the Navy. Sometime in the mid-60s, I switched cold turkey to a
keyer. Don't remember what I used for a paddle, but if it wasn't a
Bencher BY-1, I soon gravitated to one. I now own 3-4 of them, all
bought used from the great auction site. My fingers/brain learned to use
a paddle before Iambic keyers had been invented, and I've never tried to
change that.

Several years ago, I bought a used Begali gold paddle, don't know the
model number. It cost as much as I paid for three of the used Benchers,
and I find that my fingers/brain send better CW with the Benchers. All
are dual-lever paddles.

BTW -- the cheapest way to buy a BY-1 is to buy a used MFJ keyer that
has a BY-1 mechanically integrated with the keyer's electronics, remove
the electronics and throw it away. :) One of my Benchers came that way.

One of my contesting buddies brings his N3ZN paddle to our contesting
setups. It's a very nice paddle.

Why do I own so many paddles? In the shack, one is connected to a
WinKey, which my logging software toggles between two radios. Each K3
has a paddle attached so that I can program the memories. In our
multi-station contesting trailer, the computer sends the programmed
messages and the paddle sends fills.

73, Jim K9YC

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KENT TRIMBLE

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by Dave Sublette

What we DO need to obsess over is sending perfect code.

There's precious little of it out there.

What device is used to send it is irrelevant.

Dave is right on all points.

73,

Kent K9ZTV

On 11/9/2017 11:43 AM, Dave Sublette wrote:

> Don’t obsess over which paddle is best for you. Which ever system you choose, it will take hours and hours of off the air practice before you "should” put it on the air. Which ever system you start with, you will learn to love and prefer — if you get that far.
>
> I use iambic B and a dual paddle, but don’t often use the squeeze feature. If you start with this, as others have pointed out, you don’t have to squeeze. My opinion is (and it is just an opinion) by starting with the dual paddle, Iambic B, you give yourself the most options to expand or change methods.
>
> It is mostly timing and getting your internal “clock” to a place where you make proper, readable communication using Morse. An automatic keyer doesn’t do this for you. I hear plenty of people using keys who don’t send code that is comfortable to copy.
>
> Pick something and start practicing. You will never master it until you start.
>
> 73,
>
> Dave, K4TO
>

KENT TRIMBLE

Re: kxpd3 question

No, Ron, obsessing over sending perfect code is NOT like speaking
languages with an accent.

Perfect code remains the goal because it conveys the greatest chance of
100% copy.

My post was not directed to beginners but to any CW operator so
confident of his fist that he refuses to find out what the guy on the
other end is hearing.

For the last ten years I have taught as many as three Morse Code classes
every Saturday morning and have insisted that for code purposes the
mantra is, "there are 27 characters in the English alphabet, the 27th is
a space, and that 27th is the hardest to learn."

The most important CW feature on Elecraft products is the decoder. Not
for copying code, but for copying sending. When used, one quickly
realizes he's not the hot-shot code man he thought he was. FISTS
members suddenly tumble to the fact that all these years they've been
sending "CQ FISB" instead of "CQ FISTS." The first week I played with
my K3, I was taken aback by how many times I was sending "CQ DEK9ZTV."

It's not the end-of-the world either way, but if Morse is worth
preserving, is it not worth preserving correctly?

73,

Kent K9ZTV

On 11/9/2017 3:03 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:

> With respect, obsessing over perfect code is like demanding that no one speak your favorite language without an accent of any sort.
>
> It's easy to do. Use a keyboard with pre-stored messages.
>
> But many of us prefer non-canned messages even if they involve some oddities in the sending.
>
> I've encountered far more nearly-impossible or impossible to copy fists from commercial operators aboard ships than I've heard on the Ham bands.
>
> I certainly would never want to deter someone learning Morse from using it on the air, even if the best they can do is a roughly sent Name-RST-QTH-73 QSO. That was the whole point of the Novice licenses: we learn faster with real-world experience on the air.
>
> I'm always ready to drop down to whatever speed the other station is sending to help a new CW operator get "his feet wet" and have fun.
>
> 73, Ron AC7AC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:[hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of KENT TRIMBLE
> Sent: Thursday, November 9, 2017 12:41 PM
> To: Dave Sublette; Elecraft
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] kxpd3 question
>
> What we DO need to obsess over is sending perfect code.
>
> There's precious little of it out there.
>
> What device is used to send it is irrelevant.
>
> Dave is right on all points.
>
> 73,
>
> Kent K9ZTV
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home:http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help:http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post:mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list:http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered [hidden email]
>
>
> ---
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> http://www.avg.com
>
>

k6dgw

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by KM3K

You are going to get a big bunch of replies, I see you already have
quite a few, not all of which address your questions. I'll try and do
that, in 12 sections:

a. Regular practice is necessary to send Morse code well, especially
when learning. The flavor of paddle, bug, or key doesn't matter. Once
it's in your head, it will be there for the rest of your life. I was
QRT in the mid-60's for 4 years while in SE Asia. Once I came home and
got back on the air, I was back to my normal in a month or so.

b. The only difference between single-lever and dual-lever paddles
[aside from the number of levers [:-) ] is that you can close both the
dit and dah contacts at the same time on a dual-lever. With an Iambic
keyer [i.e. "squeezing], closing both will send di dah di dah di dah di
..., or alternatively dah di dah di dah ..., depending on which side was
closed first. You can use a dual-lever paddle just like it was a
single-lever paddle however -- I do and always have, and many other
non-iambicized hams do too.

c. I described Iambic-A above in (b). Iambic-B allegedly arose from a
logic misteak in a keyer chip. Iambic-B will send a single element on
it's own when the paddles are released. If it is making a dit when
released, the extra element will be a dah, and vice versa.
Incidentally, all of today's keyers are self-completing ... they will
always send correct length elements. If you're sending a dah and
release early, it will go ahead and complete the dah.

d. It seems that whichever mode you learn on will become "your" mode.
Once learned, most people have a hard time using the other mode, however
I've never seen any empirical evidence that one mode has advantages over
the other. With either mode, there are about a half-dozen or so letters
that you can complete with fewer finger movements using Iambic. I've
never seen the advantage, but some do and to each his own.

e. Yes, the KXPD3 is a dual-lever paddle, however it can be operated as
a single lever paddle as well. The KX3 has an Iambic keyer that can be
set either mode A or B [or Ultimatic, or bug mode I think]

f. Yes, the KX3 and practically all radios on the market today have a
KEY input. It is a two-wire circuit, and when in CW mode, short the two
wires and you transmit for as long as they are shorted. This is also
used with external keyers [WinKey, Microham, etc] where the external
keyer forms the code elements from paddle input or ASCII characters from
a computer. The transmitter things it has a straight key in the KEY jack.

g. Yes, for CWA, you will need to be able to send to yourself. You can
put the KX3 into TEST mode. It will act as if it's working normally, it
just won't make any RF.

h. While the KXPD3 is perfectly good for the KX3, it is very small.
I'd recommend obtaining a larger paddle [single- or dual-lever, it
doesn't matter] at a reasonable price while you're learning Morse. The
Bencher BY-1 is a very good choice, you can find them in several
finishes on eBay, eHam, and at swap meets. I have 2, one black base and
one chrome. Last time I noticed, they were in the $40-50 range. The
Hexkey [also by bencher] is a somewhat more expensive choice, Elecraft
used to sell them, they may still.

i. "Normally," paddles are configured with dahs on the finger(s) and
dits on the thumb, however there is exactly zero magic in that, it's a
holdover from the pre-keyer days with mechanical bugs. You could get a
"left-handed bug" but they were special-order and very pricey. Nearly
every keyer today allows you to "invert" that connection with a menu or
control character.

j. There is one advantage to configuring your paddle in the "normal"
manner ... that's how most stations are configured and if you are a
guest op, it will be right for you.

k. A lot of left-handed hams learned to send [and subsequently paddle]
right-handed because in the olden days, keeping a log was a Really Big
Deal. Send right, write left. Strangely, almost no right-handers
learned to paddle left. I'm a lefty, I learned to send right, but when
logs ceased to be an RBD, I put a second paddle on the left which I tend
to use in casual QSO's. You can do whatever works for you and you're
guaranteed to be "right." Being able to paddle right-handed is an
advantage if you ever are a guest op too.

l. I don't know your age but a combination of injuries to my hands in
my 20's, a genetic condition [poor choice of Dad], and an accumulation
of birthdays took a toll on my ability to send at 35 even though I could
copy it. I finally purchased an N3ZN single-lever as a fairly expensive
experiment. Fortunately, I find the combination of single lever AND
very precise engineering and design of the ZN paddle has brought my
reliable sending speed up to 25 or a little more.

I notice that you've gotten several replies that assert [I'm
paraphrasing]: "You should never transmit Morse until you've practiced
off-line for at least half your life." Jerry, that is the same "advice"
you can find in a feedlot full of male bovines. It's in the same
category as, "You should never send on a bug [nowadays that includes
'keyer'] until you can send War and Peace in its entirety with no
mistakes on a straight key." If your CW isn't perfect, so be it. The
best way to become fluent in Morse code is to get on the air and use
it. If someone thinks your fist stinks, he doesn't have to answer your
call. Getting on the air is also the best way to discover all the
things you can do with Morse and why it appeals to so many.

[Full disclosure: I'm a member of CWOps]: Congratulations on starting
CWA. That CWOps program has many graduates, some learning from scratch,
some seeking to improve their ability in the mode. Their method works,
the Advisors are extremely good at applying it, and I look forward to a
QSO with you in the near future.

73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW #142
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County
On 11/9/2017 6:14 AM, JEROME SODUS wrote:

Grant Youngman-2

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by KENT TRIMBLE

I guess the easy way to send “cw perfection” is a keyboard. Or an AccuKeyer (but that’s not the issue)

If you use a key of any kind, it’s virtually impossible not to make a mistake from time to time. Telling someone not to get on the air until their CW is “perfect” just keeps folks off the air.

Now I’ll admit that there is a difference between slop and the ersatz mistake all of us make. But ... if I had been held to the “perfection” standard in 1958, I’d have never gotten on the air and tried to make a contact ... and still wouldn’t have.

Grant NQ5T

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 9, 2017, at 4:26 PM, KENT TRIMBLE <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> No, Ron, obsessing over sending perfect code is NOT like speaking languages with an accent.
>
> Perfect code remains the goal because it conveys the greatest chance of 100% copy.
>
>
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Don Wilhelm

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by k6dgw

I do wish the K3/K3S/KX3/KX2 had Ultimatic mode. I have asked Wayne
many times if he would implement it. In fact I bugged him about it for
the K2 as well. That way, I could use dual lever paddles. The way it
is right now, only Iambic (mode A or B) is available.

For those not familiar with Ultimatic mode, the way it works is that
there are no alternating dots and dashes. When you tap the dot paddle,
a string of dots is sent (nothing different so far), same for the dash
paddle.
But if you have the dot paddle closed and then close the dash paddle, a
string of dashes will be sent (not alternating) - same if the dash
paddle is closed and the dot paddle is then closed.
In other words, the last paddle closed takes precedence.

This allows for symbol insertion, and the paddle operation is just as
efficient (or more so) than iambic. I believe this was the mode used by
one of the older electronic keyers - the W9TO keyer if I recall correctly.

I learned some bad habits using a bug - I used one side of the paddle to
push off the activation of the other paddle side. I just cannot seem to
break that old learned behavior.

The K1EL series of keyers includes Ultimatic, although I now use a
single lever paddle to achieve the same behavior. With a single lever
paddle, it is not possible to close both the dot and dash contacts.

If Wayne would implement Ultimatic mode, I could use the dual lever
paddles attached to the KX3 and KX2, but as it is, I just send garbage
because of the alternating dots and dashes.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 11/9/2017 6:35 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:
>
The KX3 has an Iambic keyer that can be
> set either mode A or B [or Ultimatic, or bug mode I think]
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Nr4c

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by Clay Autery-2

Yes. Buy nice, not twice.

I was fortunate to locate an N2DAN MERCURY for a reasonable price. It is smooooith! It belonged to a very old friend of mine and he was moving into a "senior living" space.

Sent from my iPhone
...nr4c. bill

> On Nov 9, 2017, at 9:31 AM, Clay Autery <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> JUST finished Level 1 of the CW Academy here.
>
> I chose the Begali HST Mark II. They've moved on to the Mark III now.
> They are expensive, but I have absolutely zero regrets. I love, love, love, my key. Worth every cent I paid for it.
>
> When I pass 25 wpm and hopefully gain entry to CW Ops, I will treat myself to a Sculpture Mono... just because. Frankly, I'll never NEED another key.
>
> IF you are serious.... don't muck around. Get a serious key. "Buy the best tools you can afford, and only have to buy them once." -My Dad
>
> I can't help you with the KX3 questions... My K3s works just fine with a single paddle.
>
> 73,
> Clay, KY5G
>
>
>> On 11/09/17 08:14, JEROME SODUS wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>> I'm a "no-code-ham" determined to become a "know-code-ham" and so have signed up to a course by CWops.
>>
>> They require a paddle for sending practice since lessons will be done at 20-wpm.
>>
>>
>> Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I think that a single paddle might work best for me.
>>
>> Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:
>>
>> 1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence with a dual-paddle,
>>
>> 2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.
>>
>>
>> In reading my KX3-manual and Fred-KE7X's book, it seems to me that the KXPD3 is capable of only dual-paddle operating. Or have I missed something?
>>
>>
>> I understand that my KX3 has a second port for an external key (I presume a single-paddle).
>>
>> In the past, I recall seeing photos of hams working KX3-portable with a straight-key but, at those times, I did not pay attention if any had a paddle.
>>
>>
>> TIA for any reply.
>>
>> 73 Jerry KM3K
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> Thi

Bill K9YEQ

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by rich hurd WC3T

I agree with Victor. The dual paddle allows you to squeeze when you want based on your ability, desire. 25 WPM would seem to be easier to me with a dual. I have only used dual or the old mechanical keyers from Vibroplex. To me it would seem easiest to learn a style if you start with it early in the process, regardless of what you decide. I am going to pick a single lever in the near future, just for fun and adventure.

73,
Bill
K9YEQ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of rich hurd WC3T
Sent: Thursday, November 9, 2017 9:00 AM
To: Victor Rosenthal 4X6GP <[hidden email]>
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] kxpd3 question

Victor brings up an advantage of using a dual paddle; if at some point in the future, you want to use an iambic keying method, using a dual paddle would afford you that capability with the initial spend.

If you never do iambic, it's only a small incremental cost between a single and a dual lever paddle that you'll probably never miss.

He's sort of talking me into reconsidering my single lever paddle
purchase. :)

---
72,
Rich Hurd / WC3T / DMR: 3142737
PA Army MARS, Northampton County RACES, EPA-ARRL Public Information Officer for Scouting
Latitude: 40.761621 Longitude: -75.288988 (40°45.68' N 75°17.33' W) Grid:
*FN20is*

On Thu, Nov 9, 2017 at 9:33 AM, Victor Rosenthal 4X6GP <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Jerry,
>
> A real single paddle is nice, but you can still send non-iambically
> with a dual paddle. Just don't squeeze it. You make a 'C' with four
> back and forth motions instead of a squeeze.
>
> The connections to the rig for a single or dual paddle are the same.
> The only difference is in the mechanical design of the paddle. A
> single paddle cannot close both dit and dah contacts at the same time.
> With a dual paddle, you can -- but you don't need to.
>
> 73,
> Victor, 4X6GP
> Rehovot, Israel
> Formerly K2VCO
> http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/
> CWA Adviser
>
>
> On 9 Nov 2017 16:14, JEROME SODUS wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>> I'm a "no-code-ham" determined to become a "know-code-ham" and so
>> have signed up to a course by CWops.
>>
>> They require a paddle for sending practice since lessons will be done
>> at 20-wpm.
>>
>>
>> Having researched the topic of 'paddles' and from that effort, I
>> think that a single paddle might work best for me.
>>
>> Here are the negative items which helped form that opinion:
>>
>> 1. a comment that regular practice is needed to maintain competence
>> with a dual-paddle,
>>
>> 2. iambic-a or iambic-b just seem physically complicated.
>>
>>
>> In reading my KX3-manual and Fred-KE7X's book, it seems to me that
>> the KXPD3 is capable of only dual-paddle operating. Or have I missed
>> something?
>>
>>
>> I understand that my KX3 has a second port for an external key (I
>> presume a single-paddle).
>>
>> In the past, I recall seeing photos of hams working KX3-portable with
>> a straight-key but, at those times, I did not pay attention if any
>> had a paddle.
>>
>>
>> TIA for any reply.
>>
>> 73 Jerry KM3K
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
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>
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> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

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Bill K9YEQ

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by KENT TRIMBLE

Isn't that missing space the truth, or fluxuating speed tough on my brain. I haven't done much code for several years and haven't had the time to tune up my practice. But as Ron states, I love the individual fist especially from a straight key. You get a real personality from that form. I have no desire for great speed. Otherwise, can do with the built in code reader and a keyboard. And I love that method too.

73,
Bill
K9YEQ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of KENT TRIMBLE
Sent: Thursday, November 9, 2017 4:26 PM
To: Elecraft <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] kxpd3 question

No, Ron, obsessing over sending perfect code is NOT like speaking languages with an accent.

Perfect code remains the goal because it conveys the greatest chance of 100% copy.

My post was not directed to beginners but to any CW operator so confident of his fist that he refuses to find out what the guy on the other end is hearing.

For the last ten years I have taught as many as three Morse Code classes every Saturday morning and have insisted that for code purposes the mantra is, "there are 27 characters in the English alphabet, the 27th is a space, and that 27th is the hardest to learn."

The most important CW feature on Elecraft products is the decoder. Not for copying code, but for copying sending. When used, one quickly realizes he's not the hot-shot code man he thought he was. FISTS members suddenly tumble to the fact that all these years they've been sending "CQ FISB" instead of "CQ FISTS." The first week I played with my K3, I was taken aback by how many times I was sending "CQ DEK9ZTV."

It's not the end-of-the world either way, but if Morse is worth preserving, is it not worth preserving correctly?

73,

Kent K9ZTV

On 11/9/2017 3:03 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:

> With respect, obsessing over perfect code is like demanding that no one speak your favorite language without an accent of any sort.
>
> It's easy to do. Use a keyboard with pre-stored messages.
>
> But many of us prefer non-canned messages even if they involve some oddities in the sending.
>
> I've encountered far more nearly-impossible or impossible to copy fists from commercial operators aboard ships than I've heard on the Ham bands.
>
> I certainly would never want to deter someone learning Morse from using it on the air, even if the best they can do is a roughly sent Name-RST-QTH-73 QSO. That was the whole point of the Novice licenses: we learn faster with real-world experience on the air.
>
> I'm always ready to drop down to whatever speed the other station is sending to help a new CW operator get "his feet wet" and have fun.
>
> 73, Ron AC7AC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:[hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of KENT TRIMBLE
> Sent: Thursday, November 9, 2017 12:41 PM
> To: Dave Sublette; Elecraft
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] kxpd3 question
>
> What we DO need to obsess over is sending perfect code.
>
> There's precious little of it out there.
>
> What device is used to send it is irrelevant.
>
> Dave is right on all points.
>
> 73,
>
> Kent K9ZTV
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home:http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help:http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post:mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by:http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
> list:http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered [hidden email]
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> http://www.avg.com
>
>

K7TV

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by rich hurd WC3T

I normally use either a dual paddle Begali or Bencher, but recently I purchased a (dual paddle) Palm paddle for portable operations. At this point, I haven't had time to play with adjustments, but adjusted from the factory it feels distinctly soft under finger pressure, almost like the lever itself were flexible. What really surprised me is that this "softness" felt so natural. It is almost like it reduces my mistakes, and makes sending easier than with my other paddles. I suppose the Bencher has a slight amount of flexing too, but nothing like this. I wonder if any other paddle models also make softness an asset. Maybe there is a downside with the softness when one pushes the speed higher. I haven't tried that yet.

73, Erik K7TV

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Edward R Cole

Re: kxpd3 question

In reply to this post by KM3K

When I was studying for my Novice (1958) I did not have a code
practise machine (did borrow one for a week), so I practised by
sending to my self with a straight key. I found a way to set my
super-regen receiver such that by grounding a spot on the board
caused it go into oscillation with resulting tone in the speaker.

I got very good at sending up to 20 wpm with the straight key. I
bought a Bencher about three years ago and have yet to master using
it. Guess its either straight key or keyboard. Keyboard actually is
better on eme because I can have several canned replies saved and
click to send them, Machine CW is perfectly formed.

eme'rs suggest 15-17 wpm as optimum due to fading off the moon.

73, Ed - KL7UW
http://www.kl7uw.com
Dubus-NA Business mail:
[hidden email]

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