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paddle key training

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n7ws

Re: paddle key training

Cookie,

I have worked the ship several times. The calls then were KK5W (2008,2009) and WA5VKS (2001).

My wife and I used to travel extensively and visited several museum ships but never the USS Stewart. Probably the closest to you was the Lexington in Corpus.

Since my wife's passing in January, I have no interest in going anywhere anymore. If that ever changes, I'll look you up.

73,

Wes

--- On Fri, 3/25/11, WILLIS COOKE <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: WILLIS COOKE <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] paddle key training
To: "Wes Stewart" <[hidden email]>, "Ken - K0PP" <[hidden email]>, "Gary Gregory" <[hidden email]>
Cc: "elecraft" <[hidden email]>
Date: Friday, March 25, 2011, 8:34 PM

Well Mr. Stewart, I happen to be the trustee for the ham station aboard the USS Stewart, DE-238 which is a museum ship on Pelican Island, Texas (City of Galveston). If you ever get to this part of Texas we could arrange for a bit of operating time from the ship. It was named for Rear Admiral Charles Stewart, Captain of the USS Constitution during the War of 1812, maybe one of your ancestors. The call on the ship is N5BPS which is a slight alteration of NBPS, the call of the USS Cavalla, SS244 which is the Submarine alongside the Stewart.
Willis 'Cookie' Cooke
K5EWJ

From: Wes Stewart <[hidden email]>
To: Ken - K0PP <[hidden email]>; Gary Gregory <[hidden email]>
Cc: elecraft <[hidden email]>
Sent: Fri, March 25, 2011 7:40:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] paddle key training

As a teenager, I knew an old gentlemen who had been a Western Union telegrapher. He had a two-story house (unusual in Tucson) and the whole second floor was a replica of a WU station. He wasn't a ham but had some TRF receivers that he'd built and one that I believe was US Navy surplus.

He gave me a Western Union "1-B Pole Changer Key" made by Bunnell, that I still use today. If I want, I can wire it to send "inverted" CW. (My
fist is bad enough these days, it would hardly be noticeable)

Interesting tidbit, especially to a guy named Stewart: The first telegraph station in Arizona Territory (1871) was at Pipe Spring and the first operator was a 16 year old girl, named Ella Stewart.

http://www.nps.gov/pisp/planyourvisit/historical-figures.htm

Wes N7WS

--- On Fri, 3/25/11, Gary Gregory <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: Gary Gregory <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] paddle key training
> To: "Ken - K0PP" <[hidden email]>
> Cc: "elecraft" <[hidden email]>
> Date: Friday, March 25, 2011, 5:52 PM
> *Ken..the FW will reverse it too.*
> *
> *
> *Gary
> *
> On 26 March 2011 09:49, Ken - K0PP <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> >
> > Thumb on right paddle makes dits.
> >
> > Have a left-handed guest op? Suggest turning
> paddles
> > around backwards and reach over the top. (:-))
> >
> > 73!
> > Ken Kopp - K0PP
> > [hidden email]

>
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AC7AC

Re: paddle key training

In reply to this post by Charles Tropp

CONTENTS DELETED

The author has deleted this message.

Kate Hutton

Re: paddle key training

I'm a rightie with my dits on the left.

I also don't head copy very well.

The first few times I had the opportunity to be NCS on the slow-speed net, I
could not figure out how to write* everything *down, keep the traffic list,
etc. & also put the pen down to send & then pick it back up again, etc. A
comedy to watch, I'm sure.

Figured out I would have to 1) learn to head copy, 2) learn to write left
handed, or 3) learn to key left handed.

Finally chose to work hard on option 1, but I did practice enough with
option 3 to convince myself that it could be done, provided that I reverse
the keyer. In other words, dits always on the thumb. Option 2 is pretty
hopeless.

73 Kate K6HTN

On Sat, Mar 26, 2011 at 7:53 AM, Ron D'Eau Claire <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I thought practicing timing was important when progressing from a straight
> key to a bug, but to use a keyer one only has to have timing good enough
> not
> to confuse the keyer logic.
>
> The keyer does all the critical work of inserting the proper spaces between
> code elements including, for most keyers, even enforcing the correct word
> spacing.
>
> Personally I loved Iambic keying. I never considered whether it was really
> faster or easier (I'm a rag chewer and so seldom run over 25 wpm). What I
> like about it was the smooth flow of motion to create CW. I quit using it
> because it destroyed my fist on a real bug. Muscle memory had me
> fruitlessly
> squeezing the bug paddles all the time, wondering what was wrong, Hi!
>
> Ron AC7AC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> Are you proficient with a straight key? You need to get your timing
> perfect before you "progress" to a paddle. You may not like a squeeze
> paddle. See for e.g. /Iambic Keying - Debunking the Myth/ by Marshall G
> Emm, N1FN (Freely available at http://www.mtechnologies.com/. For lots
> of other resources including CW mentors see the Straight Key Century
> Club website at http://www.skccgroup.com/.
>
> GL & 73, Charles, N2SO
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Re: paddle key training

Hi Kate! Nice to see you on this forum.

I will offer you another option. Learn to key while holding a pen or pencil. I
hold the pencil between my middle and index fingers and in the fork of my thumb
and index finger. It is much quicker to get it into writing position. Head
copy is difficult for a lot of us and it is more difficult when trying to get
and remember calls as in a net than trying to copy text.

I was trying to head copy some bug sending on a video by IK0XCO and just could
not get it. Then I figured out he was sending in Italian and the only thing I
could get was that he was in QSO with Favio.
Willis 'Cookie' Cooke
K5EWJ

________________________________
From: Kate Hutton <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Sat, March 26, 2011 12:37:47 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] paddle key training

I'm a rightie with my dits on the left.

I also don't head copy very well.

The first few times I had the opportunity to be NCS on the slow-speed net, I
could not figure out how to write* everything *down, keep the traffic list,
etc. & also put the pen down to send & then pick it back up again, etc. A
comedy to watch, I'm sure.

Figured out I would have to 1) learn to head copy, 2) learn to write left
handed, or 3) learn to key left handed.

Finally chose to work hard on option 1, but I did practice enough with
option 3 to convince myself that it could be done, provided that I reverse
the keyer. In other words, dits always on the thumb. Option 2 is pretty
hopeless.

73 Kate K6HTN

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Barry

Re: paddle key training

I use the traditional method of dits with the thumb of my right hand. Back in the paper logging days, I learned to send with my left hand, reversing the two connections, so dits were still with my (left) thumb. That way I could write with my right hand at the same time as sending my left hand - a skill not unlike learning SO2R.

BTW, most modern keyers have a REV command, so you can reverse the dot/dash paddles without rewiring it, turning it around or upside down.

In my experience, using many paddles over the years, the Benchers are among the worst. My favorites are N3ZN and Begali. My opinion, of course (and no financial interest in any paddle mfr.)

Barry W2UP

Ralph Parker

Re: Paddle key training

In reply to this post by John Cooper

"Do what works for you, there is no 'right' answer."...

I strongly disagree.
The 'right' answer is - dots on the thumb, regardless of which hand is used.
When the bug was developed, it was clear that the index finger was much
more capable of sending continuing dashes than the thumb was - thence the
design.
As it was pointed out, there are left-handed bugs for the southpaw crowd,
with dots on the thumb.

I have had to make a few beginners re-learn to send with a paddle and keyer
when, without any guidance, they got things the wrong way around when they
started.

Think of the everyday things you do with your index finger, and try them
with your thumb instead. Case closed.
OK, so I'm an old stick-in-the-mud - but I'm right :-)
Ask any old-timer.

Respectfully submitted,
Ralph, VE7XF

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Paul Huff-3

Re: paddle key training

In reply to this post by John Cooper

Perhaps a little off topic for the Elecraft list, but an interesting thread.

I am so dominantly right handed that even thinking about doing something with my
left hand "feels" awkward in my mind. But a couple of years ago I wanted to
learn how to use a bug. I had heard from others that switching back and forth
between a bug and a paddle can be difficult so I decided to first learn how to
work my paddle with my left hand (dits on the thumb). I now do all of my paddle
sending at about 20 wpm with my left hand, and I can switch to a bug on my right
hand, but the bug work still takes a lot of concentration. People tell me that
the bug is "good copy" but they are being generous and I still have a ways to go
with that. Straight key work is still on my right and the funny thing is that I
still work my Palm portable paddle by holding it in my left hand and using my
right.

An old dog learning new tricks can be a fun challenge!

73,
Paul - N8XMS

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Jessie Oberreuter-2

Re: paddle key training

In reply to this post by Kate Hutton

I tought myself to eat left-handed so I could write with my right at
the same time. A Chinese friend and I once went out for a writing session
over Vietnamese soup. When I picked up my pen in the right, and my
chopsticks in the left and proceeded to eat and write at the same time,
she said, "That's not fair!".
"What? You can do it too!", I replied, and then stifled a smirk as I
watched a person who had been using chopsticks her entire life struggle to
make them work in her left hand :).

Paul,

I know what you mean about the way the handedness of a task "feels"
in the brain. My hands tend to "compete" for tasks, and how it "feels"
tends to shift accordingly.

On Sat, 26 Mar 2011, Kate Hutton wrote:

> I'm a rightie with my dits on the left.
>
> I also don't head copy very well.
>
> The first few times I had the opportunity to be NCS on the slow-speed net, I
> could not figure out how to write* everything *down, keep the traffic list,
> etc. & also put the pen down to send & then pick it back up again, etc. A
> comedy to watch, I'm sure.
>
> Figured out I would have to 1) learn to head copy, 2) learn to write left
> handed, or 3) learn to key left handed.
>
> Finally chose to work hard on option 1, but I did practice enough with
> option 3 to convince myself that it could be done, provided that I reverse
> the keyer. In other words, dits always on the thumb. Option 2 is pretty
> hopeless.
>
> 73 Kate K6HTN
>
> On Sat, Mar 26, 2011 at 7:53 AM, Ron D'Eau Claire <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> I thought practicing timing was important when progressing from a straight
>> key to a bug, but to use a keyer one only has to have timing good enough
>> not
>> to confuse the keyer logic.
>>
>> The keyer does all the critical work of inserting the proper spaces between
>> code elements including, for most keyers, even enforcing the correct word
>> spacing.
>>
>> Personally I loved Iambic keying. I never considered whether it was really
>> faster or easier (I'm a rag chewer and so seldom run over 25 wpm). What I
>> like about it was the smooth flow of motion to create CW. I quit using it
>> because it destroyed my fist on a real bug. Muscle memory had me
>> fruitlessly
>> squeezing the bug paddles all the time, wondering what was wrong, Hi!
>>
>> Ron AC7AC
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> Are you proficient with a straight key? You need to get your timing
>> perfect before you "progress" to a paddle. You may not like a squeeze
>> paddle. See for e.g. /Iambic Keying - Debunking the Myth/ by Marshall G
>> Emm, N1FN (Freely available at http://www.mtechnologies.com/. For lots
>> of other resources including CW mentors see the Straight Key Century
>> Club website at http://www.skccgroup.com/.
>>
>> GL & 73, Charles, N2SO
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

george fritkin

Re: paddle key training

My computer does wonderful CW.
George, W6GF

--- On Sun, 3/27/11, Jessie Oberreuter <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: Jessie Oberreuter <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] paddle key training
To: "Kate Hutton" <[hidden email]>
Cc:
Date: Sunday, March 27, 2011, 10:15 AM

I tought myself to eat left-handed so I could write with my right at
the same time. A Chinese friend and I once went out for a writing session
over Vietnamese soup. When I picked up my pen in the right, and my
chopsticks in the left and proceeded to eat and write at the same time,
she said, "That's not fair!".
"What? You can do it too!", I replied, and then stifled a smirk as I
watched a person who had been using chopsticks her entire life struggle to
make them work in her left hand :).

Paul,

I know what you mean about the way the handedness of a task "feels"
in the brain. My hands tend to "compete" for tasks, and how it "feels"
tends to shift accordingly.

On Sat, 26 Mar 2011, Kate Hutton wrote:

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k6dgw

Re: paddle key training

In reply to this post by Paul Huff-3

RE Learning new ways to send: The primary problem with sending perfect
or near-perfect Morse with either hand and/or paddle configuration, even
with the latest keyers, is the fact that we all send the dits and dahs,
and we always have, when, strangely, they don't really matter. It's the
spaces that matter. Get them perfect and the dots and dashes will
automatically take care of themselves.

As far back as 1949, A. F. Scotten, W6ZMZ, pointed this out in the
October issue of QST. The time quantum in Morse is the dot time [Morse
Dot Time or Mdt] and is inversely proportional [in seconds] to the
sending speed [WPM]. On the surface there appear to be 3 spaces in
Morse: 1 Mdt between code elements, 3 Mdt between letters, and 7 Mdt
between words. A little scrutiny reveals that the first one is really
two: 1 Mdt key-up followed by 1 Mdt key-down [dits], and 1 Mdt key-up
followed by 3 Mdt key-down [dahs].

Old AF even offered a test sentence which he says will demonstrate the
problem and solution. “Then after Richard had arrived he and Clarence
each kissed beautiful Annabelle and she ceased all resistance because in
actual fact she liked it better than ever" Ignoring the fact that this
sentence was fairly racy for QST in 1949, the primary feature of it is
that, when sent in International Morse, it has no letters with repeating
dashes. Why this is important he leaves as an exercise for the student.

"Wishes" abound on this list, here's one that should be a snap for the
Elecraft Gurus: Create and market an Elecraft Mini-module that has four
paddles mounted such that the four fingers of either hand can rest over
them, sort of like piano keys. Pressing each paddle down creates one of
the four keying sequences above, effectively "sending" the spaces rather
than the dots and dashes. Of course you would need a footswitch or
something similar to turn the TX on. You then send the space
combinations sequentially, and release the footswitch at the end. It
should also be trivial to have only 3 paddles and operate them
chordally, like the court reporters do on those stenographs. In fact,
it would be feasible to do it with just two paddles however one of the
combinations would then be "no paddles depressed" which might be a
little awkward.

I'll gladly assign all patent rights to the ACRMSA [Ambidextrous Chordal
Removable Morse Sending Apparatus] to Wayne and Eric if they'll take
over production and marketing and make the K3 firmware changes. I
suggest three models: "The Prolitarian" [steel black crackle base with
plastic paddles]; "The Yuppie" [polished brass base with chrome
paddles]; and "The Daddy Warbucks" [gold plated base with natural ivory
paddles and a Certificate of Authenticity].

That the key [no pun intended ... OK, maybe] to perfect Morse has been
at hand for almost as long as I've been alive and has never overtaken
the inferior technique we continue to use is a mystery. A deeper
mystery is why AF's brilliant and novel discovery appeared in the Oct
and not the Apr 1949 QST.

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2011 Cal QSO Party 1-2 Oct 2011
- www.cqp.org

On 3/27/2011 4:08 AM, Paul Huff wrote:

> People
> tell me that the bug is "good copy" but they are being generous and I
> still have a ways to go with that. Straight key work is still on my
> right

> An old dog learning new tricks can be a fun challenge!

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KARL MARDERIAN

Re: paddle key training

In reply to this post by Gary Gregory

C
Cd

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 25, 2011, at 4:52 PM, Gary Gregory <[hidden email]> wrote:

> *Ken..the FW will reverse it too.*
> *
> *
> *Gary
> *
> On 26 March 2011 09:49, Ken - K0PP <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>>
>> Thumb on right paddle makes dits.
>>
>> Have a left-handed guest op? Suggest turning paddles
>> around backwards and reach over the top. (:-))
>>
>> 73!
>> Ken Kopp - K0PP
>> [hidden email]
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
>
>
> --
>
> *VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile
> Elecraft Equipment
> K3 #679, KPA-500 #018
> Living the dream!!!*
> ______________________________________________________________
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