something is bugging me, K2 keying problem.

[N5BZ, Bob 'BZ' Zinn]

I hooked up an old bug to my keyer paddle.

I used a couple of junkbox  diodes and made sure that they matched as
far as forward voltage. [.542 and .541 on my radio shack meters diode
check mode.] I have also tried a 0.01 cap across the bug.

Even in test mode (so it isn't RF in the shack that is causing the
problem) when I send a string of dots with the bug, the IAMBIC
mode(which I do NOT use with my paddle) kicks in and instead of a string
of dots, I get alternating dots and dashes.

I HAVE cleaned the contacts on the bug!!!!

It seems to happen more when the dot weight is correct(or light). If I
make the
dots 'heavy', it doesn't seem to happen as often.

USUALLY, the first few dots are ok, but occasionally it starts dashing
me early in the string.

Suggestions?
--
-bz-    "it is a beautiful day to be alive, isn't it?" [every day]

[hidden email]
http://chemistry.lsu.edu/bz
225-578-5381

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[Don Wilhelm-3]

I may be proven wrong someday, but I believe that 'problem' is caused by
contact bounce at the key (or bug).  Cleaning the contacts may not be
sufficient, and it will vary from keying device to keying device depending
on the type and condition of the surfaces at the contact area.

I cling to my contact bounce theory because it rarely occurs if the diodes
are connected to a computer output.

I have heard that a tiny drop of NoOxIt or similar product on the contacts
helps, but I have not tried it myself.

One idea (although it makes things more complicated) is to key a mercury
wetted reed relay (if you can find one) with the bug and drive the diodes
with the relay contacts.  The mercury wetted contacts do not bounce (well,
they could but it is greatly reduced).  The other thing that works is to use
an external keyer (I use the K1EL K12 keyer) which has a separate input
wired for the hand key.

73,
Don W3FPR

> -----Original Message-----

> I hooked up an old bug to my keyer paddle.
>
> I used a couple of junkbox  diodes and made sure that they matched as
> far as forward voltage. [.542 and .541 on my radio shack meters diode
> check mode.] I have also tried a 0.01 cap across the bug.
>
> Even in test mode (so it isn't RF in the shack that is causing the
> problem) when I send a string of dots with the bug, the IAMBIC
> mode(which I do NOT use with my paddle) kicks in and instead of a string
> of dots, I get alternating dots and dashes.
>
> I HAVE cleaned the contacts on the bug!!!!
>
> It seems to happen more when the dot weight is correct(or light). If I
> make the
> dots 'heavy', it doesn't seem to happen as often.
>
> USUALLY, the first few dots are ok, but occasionally it starts dashing
> me early in the string.
>
> Suggestions?
> --
> -bz-    "it is a beautiful day to be alive, isn't it?" [every day]
>

--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.16.4/615 - Release Date: 1/3/2007
1:34 PM

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[Vic K2VCO]

Don Wilhelm wrote:

> One idea (although it makes things more complicated) is to key a mercury
> wetted reed relay

I use a simple 12v reed relay which I got at radio shack.  I put a 10 uf
capacitor across the coil to absorb the bounce spikes; otherwise the
relay will follow the bouncing!  It will work for a very long time on a
9v battery or you can use a 12v supply.  It works perfectly with
autodetect mode on my K2.
--
73,
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco
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[Darwin, Keith]

I'm confused.  If you don't use iambic mode in the K2 when using paddles
then you must be using an external keyer with your paddles.  In that
case, the K2 is in Hand mode and you should be able to hook the bug up
to the K2 with no problems.

My paddles are packed away.  I use a straight key and a bug.  I run the
K2 in hand mode and it works flawlessly.

- Keith N1AS -
- K2 5411.ssb.100 -
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob 'bz' Zinn

... when I send a string of dots with the bug, the IAMBIC mode(which I
do NOT use with my paddle) kicks in and instead of a string of dots, I
get alternating dots and dashes.
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[Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy-2]

 A pair of cross coupled NAND gates as a 'switch debouncer' should be
useful?

Geoff
GM4ESD

----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Wilhelm" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 2:54 PM
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] something is bugging me, K2 keying problem.

>I may be proven wrong someday, but I believe that 'problem' is caused by
> contact bounce at the key (or bug).  Cleaning the contacts may not be
> sufficient, and it will vary from keying device to keying device depending
> on the type and condition of the surfaces at the contact area.
>
> I cling to my contact bounce theory because it rarely occurs if the diodes
> are connected to a computer output.
>
> I have heard that a tiny drop of NoOxIt or similar product on the contacts
> helps, but I have not tried it myself.
>
> One idea (although it makes things more complicated) is to key a mercury
> wetted reed relay (if you can find one) with the bug and drive the diodes
> with the relay contacts.  The mercury wetted contacts do not bounce (well,
> they could but it is greatly reduced).  The other thing that works is to
> use
> an external keyer (I use the K1EL K12 keyer) which has a separate input
> wired for the hand key.

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[Ron D'Eau Claire-2]

My experience too, bz. It could be contact bounce, as Don suggested. I
simply quit fighting with the logic and switched the MENU to "InP HAnd" to
use my bug and straight key.

I use DeOxit on my bug contacts, but it didn't help me with the auto-detect
feature. Where the DeOxit comes in handy is in keeping the film of oxidation
from forming on the brass contacts of my Speed-X key from preventing
reliable contact that results in missed dits. I never had that problem back
when my bug keyed a vacuum tube circuits with enough voltage and current to
self-clean the contacts, but with modern logic circuits there's not enough
current to keep removing the film. I found that letting a drop of DeOxit
hang in the gap between the contacts for a minute or so, then wiping it out,
keeps the contacts clean for six months at a time, at least. I expect that's
not an issue with silver or silver plated contacts since silver oxide is an
excellent conductor.

Hmmm.... Is there a moral there about "...fighting with logic...?" One of
the things I've always liked about the Elecraft gang on the reflector is how
perfectly at ease many of them are with the idea of magic, as in finding
their rigs effective Mojos, etc. Having been educated in the sciences, it
took me decades to realize that the concept of magic actually plays a bigger
role than logic in the lives of most humans, including my own.

So, I say, switch the menu to InP HAnd and let the good times roll. If your
key fails to make contact with every dit, try a little DeOxit.

Ron AC7AC



-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Don Wilhelm
Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 6:55 AM
To: [hidden email]; [hidden email]
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] something is bugging me, K2 keying problem.


I may be proven wrong someday, but I believe that 'problem' is caused by
contact bounce at the key (or bug).  Cleaning the contacts may not be
sufficient, and it will vary from keying device to keying device depending
on the type and condition of the surfaces at the contact area.

I cling to my contact bounce theory because it rarely occurs if the diodes
are connected to a computer output.

I have heard that a tiny drop of NoOxIt or similar product on the contacts
helps, but I have not tried it myself.

One idea (although it makes things more complicated) is to key a mercury
wetted reed relay (if you can find one) with the bug and drive the diodes
with the relay contacts.  The mercury wetted contacts do not bounce (well,
they could but it is greatly reduced).  The other thing that works is to use
an external keyer (I use the K1EL K12 keyer) which has a separate input
wired for the hand key.

73,
Don W3FPR

> -----Original Message-----

> I hooked up an old bug to my keyer paddle.
>
> I used a couple of junkbox  diodes and made sure that they matched as
> far as forward voltage. [.542 and .541 on my radio shack meters diode
> check mode.] I have also tried a 0.01 cap across the bug.
>
> Even in test mode (so it isn't RF in the shack that is causing the
> problem) when I send a string of dots with the bug, the IAMBIC
> mode(which I do NOT use with my paddle) kicks in and instead of a
> string of dots, I get alternating dots and dashes.
>
> I HAVE cleaned the contacts on the bug!!!!
>
> It seems to happen more when the dot weight is correct(or light). If I
> make the dots 'heavy', it doesn't seem to happen as often.
>
> USUALLY, the first few dots are ok, but occasionally it starts dashing
> me early in the string.
>
> Suggestions?
> --
> -bz-    "it is a beautiful day to be alive, isn't it?" [every day]
>

--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.16.4/615 - Release Date: 1/3/2007
1:34 PM

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