K3 Noise Reduction

[Roy Morris-6]

When I turn on NR the audio noise level goes down.  When a SSB signal is received the audio peaks.  I have my RX EQ set flat.  In these peaks there are resonances in my internal speaker (if I use it) as well as my two external speakers that plainly makes noise reduction unpleasant.  It can be minimally tolerated at F-1-1 level with speakers.  It is somewhat more tolerable with a good headset.  Part of the problem may be in speaker response, but I also think a big part of the problem is in the noise reduction algorythms.   If noise reduction is not recommended with reduced bandwidth in CW, and unpleasant artifacts occur in SSB; then I find NR to be useless.  I hope the discussion of white noise and pink noise will lead to something that will improve the noise reduction function in the K3.  Roy Morris  W4WFB
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Bill W4ZV]

Roy Morris-6 wrote

If noise reduction is not recommended with reduced bandwidth in CW, and unpleasant artifacts occur in SSB; then I find NR to be useless.

You may want to read the following by Lyle KK7P:

http://www.zerobeat.net/mediawiki/index.php/K3_DSP

####################################################
NR explained by Lyle Johnson

I think there is a fundamental misunderstanding of what NR is and how it works, at least in the context of the K3.

1) NR is better named SE (signal enhancer).

2) It is a "short" FIR filter whose coefficients are continuously being recalculated.

3) It defaults to suppressing everything.

4) When it senses that there is something that correlates (i.e., has a pattern that doesn't seem to be entirely random), it attempts to build a filter around those frequencies that seem less random.

5) Because the FIR filter that is being implemented is short, the filter being built is less selective than the normal DSP filters in the radio.

6) NR is rarely useful if the bandwidth is narrow. If you set your CW width to 400 Hz or less, for example, there is no point in running NR *unless* you want to use it as a sort-of "smart squelch."

7) The narrower you set your WIDTH, the more that noise appears like a signal, and the worse the NR will perform. And the less noise there is anyway, assuming there is a signal present. NR cannot compete with a narrow filter, and was not designed to.

8) I find NR most useful during CW operation with the 2.8 kHz roofing filter NORM'ed so the Rx bandwidth is wide. Assuming band activity is low, the Rx is quiet. If a CW station comes on within the Rx passband, a filter will be built around the station and I can hear it.

9) Similarly, I find NR in SSB is mostly useful as a sort of squelch when tuning around, or monitoring a frequency you are expecting a call on (probably a net or a sked). I use NR1-1 or NR1-2 for this. Mild suppression, not too much impact on fidelity, and lets me hear weak signals, too.

I hope this is helpful in better understanding how NR is implemented in the K3.
#####################################################

Unfortunately the term "Noise Reduction" implies that NR should yield some S/N improvement.  In my experience (with both Orion's and K3's NR) it does not.  If you're adept at adjusting the K3's WIDTH and SHIFT controls, I don't believe there's much to be gained by using NR...except possibly operator confusion.  A filter is a filter, whether it's built automatically (by NR) or whether the operator determines it manually by adjusting WIDTH and SHIFT.  Noise bandwidth reduction follows the same laws of physics no matter how the filter characteristics are set up.  

73,  Bill

[WA6L]

Hi, Roy,

As I approach a year's ownership of the K3, I have to say that there are very few times that I find the NR capability to be useful.  On a very noisy band and with reasonably wide bandwidths (> 800 Hz) the NR can work well, but never without pressing the Level button and optimizing the setting each time.

When I compare the K3's NR with my K2's, the K2 seems far superior to me.  It may be because the K2 does its DSP at the audio instead of the IF, or it may be that the K2 implements longer FIR filters.  Whatever the reason, the K2's noise reduction works much better and in my shack is left on almost all the time.

Both the K3 manual and the Wikipedia explanation of the K3 noise reduction recommend using NR only with a wide bandwidth, and imply that it is not as effective on SSB as it is on CW.  I concur with these recommendations, but I have to say that I agree with you.  The NR implementation could have been done much better.

73,

John

Roy Morris-6 wrote

When I turn on NR the audio noise level goes down.  When a SSB signal is received the audio peaks.  I have my RX EQ set flat.  In these peaks there are resonances in my internal speaker (if I use it) as well as my two external speakers that plainly makes noise reduction unpleasant.  It can be minimally tolerated at F-1-1 level with speakers.  It is somewhat more tolerable with a good headset.  Part of the problem may be in speaker response, but I also think a big part of the problem is in the noise reduction algorythms.   If noise reduction is not recommended with reduced bandwidth in CW, and unpleasant artifacts occur in SSB; then I find NR to be useless.  I hope the discussion of white noise and pink noise will lead to something that will improve the noise reduction function in the K3.  Roy Morris  W4WFB

[Stephen Prior]

I agree, I have used my K3 for almost a year now and I don't recall one
situation where the NR was more effective than the filtering between my
ears, whether on ssb or cw.  As much as I have and continue to enjoy the
radio, I must say much the same about the NB performance.  It was very
enlightening to hook up my FT-817 to the main station antenna the other
night and find that the 817's noise blanker did a far better job than the
K3's in getting rid of the interference from the electric fence which keeps
the foxes away from our chickens!  I don't have any DSP on my K2 so I can
draw no comparison there.

On a really positive note, the one thing which makes the K3 so special to
listen to (on headphones at least) is the AFX. I would not want to be
without it.  And in all other respects the K3 is a very fine radio indeed.

73 Stephen G4SJP

K3 #980



On 27/04/2009 21:43, "WA6L" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
>
> Hi, Roy,
>
> As I approach a year's ownership of the K3, I have to say that there are
> very few times that I find the NR capability to be useful.  On a very noisy
> band and with reasonably wide bandwidths (> 800 Hz) the NR can work well,
> but never without pressing the Level button and optimizing the setting each
> time.
>
> When I compare the K3's NR with my K2's, the K2 seems far superior to me.
> It may be because the K2 does its DSP at the audio instead of the IF, or it
> may be that the K2 implements longer FIR filters.  Whatever the reason, the
> K2's noise reduction works much better and in my shack is left on almost all
> the time.
>
> Both the K3 manual and the Wikipedia explanation of the K3 noise reduction
> recommend using NR only with a wide bandwidth, and imply that it is not as
> effective on SSB as it is on CW.  I concur with these recommendations, but I
> have to say that I agree with you.  The NR implementation could have been
> done much better.
>
> 73,
>
> John
>
>
>
> Roy Morris-6 wrote:
>>
>> When I turn on NR the audio noise level goes down.  When a SSB signal is
>> received the audio peaks.  I have my RX EQ set flat.  In these peaks there
>> are resonances in my internal speaker (if I use it) as well as my two
>> external speakers that plainly makes noise reduction unpleasant.  It can
>> be minimally tolerated at F-1-1 level with speakers.  It is somewhat more
>> tolerable with a good headset.  Part of the problem may be in speaker
>> response, but I also think a big part of the problem is in the noise
>> reduction algorythms.   If noise reduction is not recommended with reduced
>> bandwidth in CW, and unpleasant artifacts occur in SSB; then I find NR to
>> be useless.  I hope the discussion of white noise and pink noise will lead
>> to something that will improve the noise reduction function in the K3.
>> Roy Morris  W4WFB
>>

... [show rest of quote]

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Greg - AB7R]

Hi Stephen.  I'm surprised with your NB comment regarding electric fences.  I have one
for my horses and on 40M and up it does a great job with the pulses.  below that they
are still there though much reduced.  Are you trying a combination of the DSP and the
IF NBs?  Is your pulse generator well grounded?

-------------------------
73,
Greg - AB7R
Whidbey Island WA
NA-065


On Mon Apr 27 13:57 , Stephen  Prior  sent:

>I agree, I have used my K3 for almost a year now and I don't recall one
>situation where the NR was more effective than the filtering between my
>ears, whether on ssb or cw.  As much as I have and continue to enjoy the
>radio, I must say much the same about the NB performance.  It was very
>enlightening to hook up my FT-817 to the main station antenna the other
>night and find that the 817's noise blanker did a far better job than the
>K3's in getting rid of the interference from the electric fence which keeps
>the foxes away from our chickens!  I don't have any DSP on my K2 so I can
>draw no comparison there.
>
>On a really positive note, the one thing which makes the K3 so special to
>listen to (on headphones at least) is the AFX. I would not want to be
>without it.  And in all other respects the K3 is a very fine radio indeed.
>
>73 Stephen G4SJP
>
>K3 #980
>
>
>
>On 27/04/2009 21:43, "WA6L" [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi, Roy,
>>
>> As I approach a year's ownership of the K3, I have to say that there are
>> very few times that I find the NR capability to be useful.  On a very noisy
>> band and with reasonably wide bandwidths (> 800 Hz) the NR can work well,
>> but never without pressing the Level button and optimizing the setting each
>> time.
>>
>> When I compare the K3's NR with my K2's, the K2 seems far superior to me.
>> It may be because the K2 does its DSP at the audio instead of the IF, or it
>> may be that the K2 implements longer FIR filters.  Whatever the reason, the
>> K2's noise reduction works much better and in my shack is left on almost all
>> the time.
>>
>> Both the K3 manual and the Wikipedia explanation of the K3 noise reduction
>> recommend using NR only with a wide bandwidth, and imply that it is not as
>> effective on SSB as it is on CW.  I concur with these recommendations, but I
>> have to say that I agree with you.  The NR implementation could have been
>> done much better.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> John
>>
>>
>>
>> Roy Morris-6 wrote:
>>>
>>> When I turn on NR the audio noise level goes down.  When a SSB signal is
>>> received the audio peaks.  I have my RX EQ set flat.  In these peaks there
>>> are resonances in my internal speaker (if I use it) as well as my two
>>> external speakers that plainly makes noise reduction unpleasant.  It can
>>> be minimally tolerated at F-1-1 level with speakers.  It is somewhat more
>>> tolerable with a good headset.  Part of the problem may be in speaker
>>> response, but I also think a big part of the problem is in the noise
>>> reduction algorythms.   If noise reduction is not recommended with reduced
>>> bandwidth in CW, and unpleasant artifacts occur in SSB; then I find NR to
>>> be useless.  I hope the discussion of white noise and pink noise will lead
>>> to something that will improve the noise reduction function in the K3.
>>> Roy Morris  W4WFB
>>>
>
>
>
>______________________________________________________________
>Elecraft mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: [hidden email]','','','')">[hidden email]
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

... [show rest of quote]

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Joe Planisky]

Hmmmm.  That's interesting.  I find the K3's Noise Blanker (NB) to be  
very effective against the various electric fences in my  
neighborhood.  The DSP=t1-6 or t1-7 setting takes the pulses  
completely out without imparting any objectionable artifacts.  I don't  
know much about electric fences, so maybe there are different types  
I'm not aware of.  The ones around here just send a pulse about once  
every second.

73
--
Joe KB8AP

On Apr 27, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Stephen Prior wrote:

> As much as I have and continue to enjoy the
> radio, I must say much the same about the NB performance.  It was very
> enlightening to hook up my FT-817 to the main station antenna the  
> other
> night and find that the 817's noise blanker did a far better job  
> than the
> K3's in getting rid of the interference from the electric fence  
> which keeps
> the foxes away from our chickens!
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Stephen Prior]

Hi Greg,

Yes the 'pulse generator' is well grounded- it's connected to a 4 feet long
copper rod buried in the ground beside it.  It is noisier this time of year
as the vegetation starts to grow around/through it (that's next weekend's
job with the strimmer/sprayer!), but nevertheless the 817 NB seems to do a
better job, whatever the various combinations of DSP and IF noise blanker
settings I have tried.

73 Stephen G4SJP


On 27/04/2009 22:15, "Greg - AB7R" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Hi Stephen.  I'm surprised with your NB comment regarding electric fences.  I
> have one
>
> for my horses and on 40M and up it does a great job with the pulses.  below
> that they
>
> are still there though much reduced.  Are you trying a combination of the DSP
> and the
>
> IF NBs?  Is your pulse generator well grounded?
>
>
>
> -------------------------
>
> 73,
>
> Greg - AB7R
>
> Whidbey Island WA
>
> NA-065
>
>

... [show rest of quote]

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[KK6T]

I just started building my K3/100 kit and I have to say.....I've been
ambushed.  I bought the kit mainly to save some money and I wasn't
really looking for any enjoyment during the building process.  I was
wrong - it's really fun and rewarding.  The instructions are excellent
and I'm having a ball.

73 de Terry KK6T
K3 #2965 (the serial# sticker just went on this morning)
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ]

That's the idea! :-)

73 and have fun!

Eric  WA6HHQ
---

Terry wrote:
> I just started building my K3/100 kit and I have to say.....I've been
> ambushed.  I bought the kit mainly to save some money and I wasn't
> really looking for any enjoyment during the building process.  I was
> wrong - it's really fun and rewarding.  The instructions are excellent
> and I'm having a ball.
>
> 73 de Terry KK6T
> K3 #2965 (the serial# sticker just went on this morning)
>  
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[KK6T]

Let me ask a question while this thread is still active.  Having the RF
board act as the structural backbone is unique in my experience.  Is
this a common method of construction as opposed to a traditional
chassis?  As I add panels (side, back) to this I'm amazed at how strong
and rigid the structure seems.

73 de Terry KK6T
K3 #2965

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[wayne burdick]

Hi Terry,

This was a bit of an experiment when we designed our first product, the
K2, about 10 years ago. But we've used the same method on many products
since then, and it works very well, keeping things light yet rigid. Our
little "2D" fasteners are an integral part of these designs, holding
together PCBs and panels at edges and corners.

The net result is that the K3 weighs only about 8 to 9 pounds, compared
to 30 to 55 pounds for competing rigs.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On Apr 30, 2009, at 12:00 PM, Terry wrote:

> Let me ask a question while this thread is still active.  Having the RF
> board act as the structural backbone is unique in my experience.  Is
> this a common method of construction as opposed to a traditional
> chassis?  As I add panels (side, back) to this I'm amazed at how strong
> and rigid the structure seems.
>
> 73 de Terry KK6T
> K3 #2965
>

---

http://www.elecraft.com

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[list1]

Hi Terry,
The RF board is an excellent part to start assembly with because it is wide
enough to connect all the panel pieces to.  After all, the purpose of the
case is to protect the innards (RF board included).  So the RF board is used
to initially align the case pieces.  After a while in the building process
the case becomes the principal support for the radio.  So you end up with a
chassis just like with the older type of radios.  You end up with a light,
but strong chassis.  One advantage is that you can always take a side of the
chassis off to access a part of the radio inside.  The K2 is very similar.
Being a structural engineer, I have been always impressed with the Elecraft
radios' structural integrity.

Steve, W2MY

-----Original Message-----
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Kit Building

 Having the RF board act as the structural backbone is unique in my
experience.  I

73 de Terry KK6T
K3 #2965

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[dave.wilburn]

The K2 was a similar experience for me, from the build perspective.  I
purchased it to have the best CW rig, and built it to save money.  I
had much more fun building it than I had expected.

Dave Wilburn
NM4M
K2/100 S/N 5982
K3/100 S/N 766

wayne burdick wrote:

> Hi Terry,
>
> This was a bit of an experiment when we designed our first product, the
> K2, about 10 years ago. But we've used the same method on many products
> since then, and it works very well, keeping things light yet rigid. Our
> little "2D" fasteners are an integral part of these designs, holding
> together PCBs and panels at edges and corners.
>
> The net result is that the K3 weighs only about 8 to 9 pounds, compared
> to 30 to 55 pounds for competing rigs.
>
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
> On Apr 30, 2009, at 12:00 PM, Terry wrote:
>
>> Let me ask a question while this thread is still active.  Having the RF
>> board act as the structural backbone is unique in my experience.  Is
>> this a common method of construction as opposed to a traditional
>> chassis?  As I add panels (side, back) to this I'm amazed at how strong
>> and rigid the structure seems.
>>
>> 73 de Terry KK6T
>> K3 #2965
>>
>
> ---
>
> http://www.elecraft.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

... [show rest of quote]

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Mike Scott-7]

Wayne said> Our little "2D" fasteners are an integral part of these designs,
holding together PCBs and panels at edges and corners.

Wayne, I have thought about your unique construction technique and am
impressed with the results. When the K3 box arrived a year ago I thought:
Where's the case? Something must be missing.

All of us home builders fret over cases. I know you guys are not in the
parts business but it would be nice if you could offer 2-D fasteners and
blank panels.

Mike Scott - AE6WA
Tarzana, CA (DM04 / near LA)
NAQCC 3535
K3-100 #508 / KX1  #1311


______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[wayne burdick]

Hi Mike,

> Wayne said
> > Our little "2D" fasteners are an integral part of these designs,
> > holding together PCBs and panels at edges and corners.
>
> Wayne, I have thought about your unique construction technique and am
> impressed with the results. When the K3 box arrived a year ago I
> thought:
> Where's the case? Something must be missing.
>
> All of us home builders fret over cases. I know you guys are not in the
> parts business but it would be nice if you could offer 2-D fasteners
> and
> blank panels.

I believe we have sold 2D fasteners to experimenters in the past; check
with [hidden email].

We also sell blank project enclosures styled to match the K2 (EC2) and
K1 (EC1). There are two different height tilt stands for the EC2: ETS15
(1.5") and ETS2 (2.5"). You'll find these on our order page.

73,
Wayne
N6KR


---

http://www.elecraft.com

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Merv Schweigert]

> I believe we have sold 2D fasteners to experimenters in the past; check
> with [hidden email].
>
> We also sell blank project enclosures styled to match the K2 (EC2) and
> K1 (EC1). There are two different height tilt stands for the EC2: ETS15
> (1.5") and ETS2 (2.5"). You'll find these on our order page.
>
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
>
>  

Would love to see a K3 size cabinet (parts) with a blank front and rear
panel,  would like
to enclose a switching power supply,  speaker etc in a matching cabinet.
Merv KH7C

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[John W2XS]

I agree.  The EC2 is too small for my anticipated balanced tuner project.

John W2XS

Merv wrote:
Would love to see a K3 size cabinet (parts) with a blank front and rear panel.

 

[n7ws]

The "2D" (where did that name come from?) fasteners are handy, but they don't maintain much in the way of shielding integrity.

If you want decent shielding then you need continuous contact between panels and a lot of screws.

You could always make your own, for example, here's a photo of an amplifier I built about 30 years ago that shows what I'm talking about (although for *really* tight shielding twice as many screws would be called for):

http://k6mhe.com/n7ws/N7WS_8877_1.jpg

Wes Stewart, N7WS

ps. If you would like to own this, contact me off list.




--- On Fri, 5/1/09, Mike Scott <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: Mike Scott <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Kit Building
> To: [hidden email]
> Date: Friday, May 1, 2009, 11:34 AM
> Wayne said> Our little "2D" fasteners are an
> integral part of these designs,
> holding together PCBs and panels at edges and corners.
>
> Wayne, I have thought about your unique construction
> technique and am
> impressed with the results. When the K3 box arrived a year
> ago I thought:
> Where's the case? Something must be missing.
>
> All of us home builders fret over cases. I know you guys
> are not in the
> parts business but it would be nice if you could offer 2-D
> fasteners and
> blank panels.
>
> Mike Scott - AE6WA

... [show rest of quote]

     
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Doug Faunt N6TQS [phone]]

   From: wayne burdick <[hidden email]>
   Date: Fri, 1 May 2009 11:20:30 -0700

   Hi Mike,

   > Wayne said
   > > Our little "2D" fasteners are an integral part of these designs,
   > > holding together PCBs and panels at edges and corners.

   I believe we have sold 2D fasteners to experimenters in the past; check
   with [hidden email].

   We also sell blank project enclosures styled to match the K2 (EC2) and
   K1 (EC1). There are two different height tilt stands for the EC2: ETS15
   (1.5") and ETS2 (2.5"). You'll find these on our order page.

I bought a few, and then built a box that's the same width and depth
as the K2, but high enough for the Clifton Labs Z90 panadapter.

It's got one piece with two bends in parallel (the front panel), two
pieces with only one bend (bottom and top) and two pieces that are
just flat.  I had to set the shear fence ONCE to get the widths cut.
There's no nothcing necessary either in the sheet metal nor in the
brake.

I think the design shows genius.

73, doug
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[N5GE]

On Fri, 1 May 2009 11:20:30 -0700, wayne burdick <[hidden email]>
wrote:

[snip]

>We also sell blank project enclosures styled to match the K2 (EC2) and
>K1 (EC1). There are two different height tilt stands for the EC2: ETS15
>(1.5") and ETS2 (2.5"). You'll find these on our order page.
>
>73,
>Wayne
>N6KR
[snip]

I'd like to see some small enclosures for things like the home brew
"in shack" end of things like coaxial switching units, Mic switching
assemblies, etc. (4x3x2", 4x6x3", etc.)

Now that I have two k3 XCVR's I'd like to construct some Mic switching
assemblies, etc.

 For my VHF UHF activities I'd like to have a small enclosure for
switching coaxial relays up on the tower.

Tom, N5GE
K3 #806, K3 #1055
XV144, XV432
W1 and other small kits.
http://www.n5ge.com

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html